Salary Cap Witch Hunt. **Appeal unsuccessful**

[Kevinward777]

Has anyone wondered why the cap reduction figure is 660k, 330k x2? Such unusual numbers. No other "rorters" have had to carry a reduction into the following year.

Did the NRL calculate we have 330k left for this year and decided it isn't a high enough penalty, and then doubled it?

Todd loves to set precedents when it comes to Manly.

 

[Deleted member 24974]

I find it hard to believe that after perusing over 8000 documents, emails ,text messages etc.. all they can come up with is "compelling evidence" . Where is the smoking gun?

I find it hard to believe that after perusing over 8000 documents, emails ,text messages etc investigating a team under the salary cap but has a misunderstanding with the salary cap the NRL do not investigate the Broncos and Roosters.

 

[Harvies elbow]

There is one thing that all this subterfuge has made me realise.
And unlike the cricket team this is so clouded, make up your own rules, good for some not for others, bullshi*t, is this.
I love this club even more than I thought.
We are a different beast here.
Go Manly.
Forever !!

 

[Brooke]

Rothfield says Scott Penn knowingly signed Daly's dodgy contract because it was way too shady a deal and Kelly wouldn't touch it.

He needs to be very careful. That's a huge accusation to throw around when in the space of 2 mins he flaked from one version of absolute fact to another version of events and back again.

He certainly made lots of dumb comments. He implied Blake Green was on 600 plus for this season but Blake's contract was for the two seasons.

 

[Kevinward777]

Rothfield says Scott Penn knowingly signed Daly's dodgy contract because it was way too shady a deal and Kelly wouldn't touch it.

He needs to be very careful. That's a huge accusation to throw around when in the space of 2 mins he flaked from one version of absolute fact to another version of events and back again.

The girls at Stilettos must have vomited in their own mouths whenever this creep came sliding through the door.

 

[maxta]

Just another quick point about all this which may seem coincidence, but I feel is related....
So it’s 5 years ago this apparently started with Manly losing the guidelines of this TPA trivial crap.
About the same time Greenberg was involved in luring Hasler (illegally) while still at Manly, to the Dogs.
There was also big plans to tear the heart out of Manly and steal Foran....in fact this whole debacle created a chaotic effect on the Manly club and the players looked lost till Toovey, a genuine legend, was able to do an Amazing job in regrouping the squad....
Point being, Greenberg was right behind the underhanded scam that got Manly in a code red situation and guess what....5 years ago....not to say this makes Manly innocent, but damn it’s a good case that Greenberg was behind the rot that started at this time and is far worse than anything I am yet to hear about that Manly have done.

 

[40 years an eagle]

Fulton willing to play ball with NRL investigators
https://www.nrl.com/news/2018/03/26...-on-former-manly-sea-eagles-player-contracts/

 

[Lyonstomenzies]

I think if true we should lose Cherry and Walkz, we cheated to get them and that disgusts me.

I have a mate on the Roosters board and he hands over money left right and centre. He is a smart operator who can make a deal out of anything.
Keep your faith in Manly young @Turbo1

 

[HoldenV8]

Compelling evidence.....a rather curious way of putting it. It sounds like they are trying to convince not only everyone else but also themselves that we have done something majorly wrong.

I think that is why that while we have been hit as hard as they could under their own rules, its not as hard as it might have been had they found conclusive evidence. That says to me that they don't have anywhere near as much on Manly as what they (Greenturd) wanted.

Greenturd said in the past that they wanted to do everything they could to help doesn't-matta get through their salary cap problems. Yet with Manly its "Every other club should be angry at Manly".......if that isn't the CEO of the league showing bias then what is?

I can cop the penalties the club has been given, though I also think we should fight it out rather than just say sorry and cop it sweet. What I can't cop is the CEO of the league trying to insight anger among the other 15 clubs towards us. As NRL boss Greenturd is supposed to show impartiality. I wouldn't mind if like Arko used to he still professed a soft spot for his former club, but this is something different altogether.

 

[master blaster]

The thing here is, he has a major advantage over us in that he has the media, Rothfield,hooper and a cast of others, and they are only too willing to put the boot into us at every chance, at least Kent, like him or not, is Ruthless and he has always claimed that the TPA area is a grey one, and he is pretty fair. Lets not forget, it wasnt that long ago that hooper used stick the knife into Manly every chance he got, then all of a sudden, he seemed to change a bit, like he was an alright journo, he even fooled me, but know he has the opportunity to stick the knife in again, he aint wasting it thats for sure, and we all know old beetroot face has always had it for Manly. How on earth Hooper is the leading league correspondant has got me beat, over to you Toddy...

 

[globaleagle]

https://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/s...t/news-story/85851921e2a878a7ef4ba23e1e2a0f46

Manly Sea Eagles owner Scott Penn fires back at salary cap rorting punishment

DEFIANT Manly owner Scott Penn fired back at the NRL, declaring: “We’re not salary cap cheats.”

The Sea Eagles chairman told The Daily Telegraph his club had been “seriously hung out to dry” through “circumstantial evidence” despite the NRL revealing it had uncovered “deliberate breaches of the cap.”

“This is not a rort,” Penn insisted.

Asked had his club cheated, Penn said: “No. We have abided by the principles of the salary cap. The club has not paid one player any more than we have declared.

“And the NRL has not provided a smoking gun through this whole process. It’s disappointing to be tarnished with a big brush.


“We have not paid a player one cent more than our annual salary cap declaration. We have abided by the principles and rules of the salary cap. They are suggesting we have somehow rorted the system and gained an unfair advantage — we disagree.

“They have said we effectively made promissory notes to players and not disclosed them. They were in relation to making introductions and helping find them third parties. It was only around the negotiating process.

“The NRL is maintaining a hard line on it and are saying it is breach of the rules. We never guaranteed any third parties. That is what we are disputing. They are saying we had to disclose them, it was an obligation.

“But there are no guarantees in writing — this is all circumstantial. When you’re negotiating with a player, sure you try and find them additional money. That’s common practice. This isn’t isolated to the Sea Eagles.

“This is not a rort. It’s a protocol issue. The club has not guaranteed third parties. And no-one is claiming that we have, this is where it gets tricky. We are seriously getting hung out to dry on this, to be honest.

“What we have done is introduce people to player agents, and the like, as part of the negotiations. All at an arm’s length and said there is potentially an opportunity here. Some have come to pass, some haven’t.

“They are claiming that every single one of those for the past five years — any introduction or otherwise — should have been in the cap, which we totally disagree with.”

“We feel at this stage there are certainly strong grounds to appeal,” Penn said. “We just need to review that based on our legal opinion.”


Also:

https://www.theaustralian.com.au/sp...s/news-story/b88efdfdcf6bd8eaf8b67d63844a48bd

Only hours after his club was fined $750,000 and key officials were sanctioned for salary cap rorts totalling $1.5 million over five years, Manly chair and co-owner Scott Penn was asked whether the Sea Eagles were cheats.

“I disagree, totally disagree,” Penn said. “You could not possibly put us in the same category as the previous issues (with other clubs) because the club has not paid one cent more than we have disclosed.

 

[HoldenV8]

We are being painted as cheats when we haven't actually cheated. And what's worse is that the CEO of the NRL is leading the charge. Rather than try to work to a solution like they did so hard with doesn't-matta who were actually cheating, he just wants everyone to join him in his hatred for Manly.

We aren't and haven't been over the salary cap (hence no points penalty). This is all about $1.5 million worth offers to 13 players that were allegedly made but weren't carried out. We're being fined that $1.5m and penalised $660k in the salary cap over 2018 and 2019 (is that in total or per year??) for payments that didn't actually have to be and weren't paid. All under the pretense of we should have told the NRL.

I wonder, should the other 15 clubs be angry at Manly because it drove up the price of those players.....or because its opened a can of TPA worms that could expose the other clubs?

 

[40 years an eagle]

Is the "appeal" process overseen by an impartial judiciary or is it overseen by Greenturd?
If it is the latter then best to bypass it altogether and take it straight to the ASC or the supreme court or whatever me thinks.

We can't win anything if this guy has influence. He has it in for us and is running wild without any boundaries.

FFS, this guy has to go for the sake of the game and I would be proud to be a part of the club that made it happen...if I could be any more proud to be an Eagle than I already am.

 

[globaleagle]

Is the "appeal" process overseen by an impartial judiciary or is it overseen by Greenturd?
If it is the latter then best to bypass it altogether and take it straight to the ASC or the supreme court or whatever me thinks.

We can't win anything if this guy has influence. He has it in for us and is running wild without any boundaries.

FFS, this guy has to go for the sake of the game and I would be proud to be a part of the club that made it happen...if I could be any more proud to be an Eagle than I already am.

Penn expected to get a clean bill of health. He still does, an indication the club would push ahead with an appeal before the NRL appeals committee, headed by Ian Callinan QC.

“This is still a legal argument,” Penn said. “This is not falsifying records or invoices. It really comes down to a legal interpretation. They have dismissed our legal argument but in the appeals process it does come down to more of a legal argument.

from the australian article I linked above.

 

[Dan]

What is the point in appealing? it won't go anywhere

 

[globaleagle]

It seems amazing that the nrl are trying to say that clubs need to report any conversation ever regarding tpa's in their cap.

They are delusional if they think every club has done that. They would need an office the size of Tasmania to hold all the paperwork.

So if "Bob's Garage" wants to tpa a player.... obviously they are going to ring the club. The club passes that on to a player manager and hears no more about it but somehow they are supposed to report the amount to the nrl or even if it went ahead?

How would they know that? I must have interpreted it wrong as if Todd has fined Manly because of that, surely even first year lawyers would be lining up to take that on.

Persecution, pure and simple.

 

[HappilyManly]

Has anyone wondered why the cap reduction figure is 660k, 330k x2? Such unusual numbers. No other "rorters" have had to carry a reduction into the following year.

Did the NRL calculate we have 330k left for this year and decided it isn't a high enough penalty, and then doubled it?

Greenturd actually wanted it to be $666k

 

[Loobs]

As much as I hate the fact that we would be labelled cheats forever, I totally agree with you. There is no winning really in this situation and when the NRL have no appetite for us to succeed like they did with Parra. The mud has already stuck now so probably best to just move on.

If I was Penn I would just say we are innocent we don't agree with the NRL's findings, but in the interest's of moving on we will accept the punishment.

That’s it. Say you don’t agree but close it out. You’re can also say something like dragging this out would cost us more reputationally yada yada. Plus I think you can kick Bozo under the bus on this one and let him, Joe Kelly and Bare wear the blame.

 

[Ralphie]

That’s it. Say you don’t agree but close it out. You’re can also say something like dragging this out would cost us more reputationally yada yada. Plus I think you can kick Bozo under the bus on this one and let him, Joe Kelly and Bare wear the blame.

Wow, that’s a position of integrity right there.

 

[Loobs]

Wow, that’s a position of integrity right there.

Based on what I know outside of the cap stuff which is all public knowledge, Joe Kelly isn't the most astute businessman (CoCo Joy anyone?) and did a terrible-poor job as CEO in his time here, and Bozo among other things mercilessly sacked Toovey, ran another CEO out of town and gave numerous jobs to his own family - so if you're asking me if those two may have been involved in something untoward, then I'd be leaning towards yes - most likely lead by Bozo who as we all know was the pseudo leader of this place.

And my broader point still stands. Look at Cronulla with the peptides. Did Flanagan ever admit guilt? No but they took the penalty (which was admittedly pathetic) and moved on and even won the comp the following year. 330K a year off the cap isn't that much, especially in light of the dead weight they've carried in years past. It's ultimately a question of fight this and have it lingering for possibly years along with the drag on our reputation, etc. or draw a line in the sand and move on? Other league fans will assume your guilty even if we win every legal challenge so there is nothing to be gained in public opinion. Right or wrong in this situation is of no consequence - It's purely a matter of whether you want this to end or continue.