A clean out is not the answer

[frank stokes]

Can’t say for a fact but I heard we let Levi go to (a) sign Foran and (b) because Des thought the NRL ‘no fault stand down’ policy would likely be scrapped and Fainu would play again. As it turned out, De Berlin’s case was hung and worse still, Hayne was found guilty so any chance of the policy being scrapped was dead in the water.

Also, at training, Croker looks better than what he has shown on the field. So you are correct, the problem has been handled poorly for the above reasons.

I was a Croker fan when he first came in @Snake and I still respect his efforts in defence but he has shown on multiple occasions that he is not up to producing consistent NRL-quality performances... Cust is better but has questionable defence... they are like 2 sides of a lower-grades coin...

Levi was not awesome but he defended well, gave good service (mostly) and could pull off a goal line sneak occasionally... imo you can write off the Api decision on Fainu but the Levi call (with our 9 'options') was madness... and if Foran was the reason then stick him in 9 because he has no leg speed left and is only good for service and kicking anyway...

As for AFB, attitude or not, wtf?

 

[SeaEagleRock8]

No links. From senior person in game with little reason to make it up.
I’ve done a bit of this before way back and it’s always worried me that there has been no talk of a plea deal to lesser charges at this late stage.
Cops are notorious for ****ing up prosecutions but video evidence is always hard to dispute which probably explains there being no movement re a plea.

I hope for the kids sake and the club he gets off. Pretty serious stuff.

Video evidence can be anything from conclusive to persuasive to useless, just depends on the quality obviously.
I suppose even if the club was less than optimistic about the outcome the fact he has some younger siblings showing a lot of ability is one reason for offering him that extension. Doesn't excuse not sourcing a better plan B, of course, but I'm not really sure what was available? Some one of Levi standard wouldn't help us.

 

[SeaEagleRock8]

I’ve done a bit of this before way back and it’s always worried me that there has been no talk of a plea deal to lesser charges at this late stage.

In NSW now there is a statutory scheme for discounts that is tied to the timing of the plea, so there's very little incentive for negotiating after committal. May as well take your chances with the jury. He had a QC for his bail application so I'm sure he's getting the best advice. Unfortunately, whatever happens from here it has already been a disaster from Manly's point of view.

 

[Mark from Brisbane]

We ALL said from the moment Levi was let go that a 9 AND a decent fill in for Tissue Tommy is what we need.

We all thought Harper would fill that fullback role as a backup so this was hardly mentioned in the 5 months of off season.

BUT we ALL knew TNI was never the answer for 9, he’s just not a first grader and I’m seriously ****ed if I know why he was EVER extended.

 

[globaleagle]

Ok so let's agree for a moment that all our problems stem from not having a hooker that can engage markers or A defenders.

At what point did the professionals who have been coaching NRL for decades decide that we didn't need to go to market to solve that problem ? Do we not have one genuine hooker in our whole squad that can do the basics well enough to allow all the other stuff to fall into place and make us competitive in games ? It's not like this is a recent development, we all knew Fainu was out for at least half a season, we all knew the effect the new rules had on the way the game would be played, we released Levi, we've won one game in 11 or 12 outings.

Surely they decided sometime last year that Croker had the necessary skill set, or Cust even. Seems bizarre to me that something that seems so obvious wasn't addressed. There are multiple young hookers getting around the NRL at the moment, probably a few sitting behind more experienced incumbents dying for an opportunity. If we really needed a hooker we most likely could have had one, yet we buy a bit of a journeyman with a busted achilles. What were they doing all offseason if they weren't running opposed drills with our first choice dummy half ?

Does my head in a bit as well.

"Marty has an offload but I, croker, as hooker, will never ever back up looking for an offload or support play in any way shape or form."

 

[SeaEagleRock8]

BUT we ALL knew TNI was never the answer for 9, he’s just not a first grader and I’m seriously ****ed if I know why he was EVER extended.

Er, probably because he was cheap!

 

[KNUCKLES]

Seems you are right regarding Reynolds price, good value there for Souths.

In regards to the second point, my comment was in when in form.

So polite and serious question, which halfbacks do you rate ahead of DCE if all current halves were in peak form?

I'll refrain from the childish quips

DCES best games and worst games a far far apart in quality. DCE only has a few of those games a year nowadays and alot of shockers.. I mean alot. Reynolds may not eclipse a DCE individual performance but over the course of the season Reynolds is consistently good. I would rather a halfback that can play a 7 or 8 out of ten game every week then one that can manage 5 and 6s with the odd 9. Reynolds goal kicking in itself only makes an even better option than DCE

 

[Snake]

The other thing to remember is that very little of what happens on a football field, happens in isolation.

take the Duffy try in the first half for example. It was really poor defence but did it happen because Daly and/or Jestski forgot how to tackle? Did it happen because the defensive structures are poor? More than likely it happened because our minds were on the frustration of having so much ball, only to come up with nothing. That’s why you see so many sides score straight after defending their line for repeat sets...it’s a mental thing.

it’s the same principal with fitness. Someone will comment on our perceived lack of fitness but polish on the end of sets is required to help the forwards stay fresh in the middle (repeat sets, finding grass with yardage kicks, etc). It all has a flow on effect. Our 5th tackle options haven’t been good enough and the lack of execution is largely down to the fact that everything is off the back of slow play-the-balls because our forwards are just getting the ball one off the ruck and running into brick walls. All halves look bad playing off slow ruck speed. We need someone to help em over the advantage line and it ain’t happening.

The point of my post is that most problems are from a flow on effect. Outside of Parker’s **** hands and Croker’s inability to play an effective hand at 9, the rest is a byproduct of something else.

 

[frank stokes]

The other thing to remember is that very little of what happens on a football field, happens in isolation.

take the Duffy try in the first half for example. It was really poor defence but did it happen because Daly and/or Jestski forgot how to tackle?

I had a great view of that from my seat in the St Merge members area at ground level on half way ("woops, my ticket said J21, I must have the wrong area") and that was terrible structure and lack of trust... DCE came in because he didn't trust his inside man and Suli stayed planted which left a whole large enough to drive a bus through for Sims....

In the words of the Letterkenny Shamrocks coach...

"IT WAS F*CKING EMBARRASSING"

Defending like that, we ain't ever gonna get the W bois....

 

[globaleagle]

I had a great view of that from my seat in the St Merge members area at ground level on half way ("woops, my ticket said J21, I must have the wrong area") and that was terrible structure and lack of trust... DCE came in because he didn't trust his inside man and Suli stayed planted which left a whole large enough to drive a bus through for Sims....

In the words of the Letterkenny Shamrocks coach...

"IT WAS F*CKING EMBARRASSING"

Defending like that, we ain't ever gonna get the W bois....

Always likes for letterkenny references!

 

[Brisbane Tragic]

I doubt you'll get him on 600k atm

Thats like saying Staggs is on 300k atm so offer him 400k an you have him.

You work off what people are offering now not what they offered at their last contract

and add in

Video evidence can be anything from conclusive to persuasive to useless, just depends on the quality obviously.
I suppose even if the club was less than optimistic about the outcome the fact he has some younger siblings showing a lot of ability is one reason for offering him that extension. Doesn't excuse not sourcing a better plan B, of course, but I'm not really sure what was available? Some one of Levi standard wouldn't help us.

Yes I am gathering the siblings coming through were one big reason for the extension

 

[frank stokes]

Always likes for letterkenny references!

Thats whats i respects about you GE

 

[Chip and Chase]

Can’t say for a fact but I heard we let Levi go to (a) sign Foran and (b) because Des thought the NRL ‘no fault stand down’ policy would likely be scrapped and Fainu would play again.

Wow Des has taken a big punt there on Fainu's situation if true. Kinda makes sense considering we extended his contract despite his current plight, which at the time I couldn't work out either. I just assumed they were supremely confident he would beat the charges.

 

[globaleagle]

Thats whats i respects about you GE

Can confirm.

 

[frank stokes]

Can confirm.

Well pitter patter... get after it then...

 

[Little Grubber Kick]

I've watched enough RL to know that clean outs don't work. Neither does sacking a coach.

Keep the faith.

The single biggest problem with a 'clean out' is

the people 'cleaning out' would probably be the same clowns who recruited and retained in the first place.................i.e. probably zero chance they could 'clean out' their pussy's kitty litter without messing it up.......

 

[The better Robbo]

I was a Croker fan when he first came in @Snake and I still respect his efforts in defence but he has shown on multiple occasions that he is not up to producing consistent NRL-quality performances... Cust is better but has questionable defence... they are like 2 sides of a lower-grades coin...

Levi was not awesome but he defended well, gave good service (mostly) and could pull off a goal line sneak occasionally... imo you can write off the Api decision on Fainu but the Levi call (with our 9 'options') was madness... and if Foran was the reason then stick him in 9 because he has no leg speed left and is only good for service and kicking anyway...

As for AFB, attitude or not, wtf?

Levi and defending well should never be mentioned in the same sentence. Levi was pooh, had a bit more of a running game then Croker but his decision making was awful and couldn't tackle my grandma.

 

[Mark from Brisbane]

Er, probably because he was cheap!

“ You get what you pay for”

 

[frank stokes]

Levi and defending well should never be mentioned in the same sentence. Levi was pooh, had a bit more of a running game then Croker but his decision making was awful and couldn't tackle my grandma.

Levi was a better defender than Cust @The better Robbo... I'd call Cade a speed hump but at least speed humps slow you down...

Levi was an average hooker but he had lengths on what we are trying to plug the gap with imo...

ZDC must be considered pretty average to have these blokes in front of him...

 

[pjayz]

Levi and defending well should never be mentioned in the same sentence. Levi was pooh, had a bit more of a running game then Croker but his decision making was awful and couldn't tackle my grandma.

That’s one tough nanna