keep politics out of the game

[SeaEagleRock8]

Look forward to your response.

What point is there discussing anything about the world with someone who says (as you have) "reality is in the eye of the beholder".
May as well just be like Bozo, 'you are you and I am I'
However I'm happy to hear that you don't support the views of Hancock, if that is the case?

 

[Red Pill]

What point is there discussing anything about the world with someone who says (as you have) "reality is in the eye of the beholder".
May as well just be like Bozo, 'you are you and I am I'
However I'm happy to hear that you don't support the views of Hancock, if that is the case?

Yep this was the kind of BS response I was expecting… definitely not surprised or disappointed.

I knew this would happen when I called your bluff.

 

[Woodsie]

Is our new crack coaching crew officially announced yet?

piss off ... why raise football here ... surely there is a forum you could do that on?

 

[SeaEagleRock8]

We could have actual discussions of interesting topics including people here who have a range of different views, most of which have at least some merit. This would of course require some effort, to avoid the put-downs. Put downs obviously serve to discourage the other person from continuing, or elses inflame the debate and it gets sucked into personal bickering.
I'm prepared to make a big effort to avoid the putdowns!
@Red Pill @chuckee @Woodsie @highlandeagle ?
Anyone else ?
(this is a rare social experiment folks, who knows what is about to unfold?)

 

[Seagles68]

piss off ... why raise football here ... surely there is a forum you could do that on?

and I did just get an e-mail from the club saying we re-signed Fulton, so that's positive footy thing. But I digress.

 

[Eagles4Life]

This thread has taken off in all sorts of interesting directions. (As was expected when @Red Pill opened this can of worms) It actually gets right to the core of historical injustices, perpetrated not just in the colony of New South Wales, but in the British Isles well before (Hundreds of years before), the Endeavour set sail.

 

[Red Pill]

We could have actual discussions of interesting topics including people here who have a range of different views, most of which have at least some merit. This would of course require some effort, to avoid the put-downs. Put downs obviously serve to discourage the other person from continuing, or elses inflame the debate and it gets sucked into personal bickering.
I'm prepared to make a big effort to avoid the putdowns!
@Red Pill @chuckee @Woodsie @highlandeagle ?
Anyone else ?
(this is a rare social experiment folks, who knows what is about to unfold?)

Ok. Looking forward to seeing some of your brethren reply to your email as well. Will check later this arvo and hope to see you with lots of responses….

 

[Seagles68]

Fair enough Mate. My quick reply is have you ever been to old Sydney town when you were younger? Or heard of the cat of 9 tails…etc…

Yep, we had school excursions etc and to various historical sites. I also ploughed my way through The Fatal Shore so as I say, I fully appreciate what you're saying. However, you know what I didn't hear from anyone in school in the 60's and 70's? First Nations history. Not even the word aboriginal. It was like they didn't exist. But we were made to say the Lords Prayer and sing God Save The Queen every morning in primary school in the 60's - and I went to a public school in Sydney's South West! I remember also how being of convict stock was never talked about. Almost something to be ashamed of. And then seemingly all of a sudden it became ok to talk about - almost cool to have some convict lineage. And that only came about (IMHO) because it was broadly spoken about and the kind of things you're referring to were openly discussed. I would suggest that it was a similar situation for families that had a child with a disability. That is, until relatively recently, having a child with something like cerebral palsy, was something general society couldn't cope with. And I'm not saying everyone was like this but I've spoken with relos over the years that had disabled family members and they were shunned and it was something not spoken about. This can have a profound and long lasting impact. Just an aside, I remember also being taken to what used to be called the Spastic Centre at Allambie Heights for a primary school excursion. When I look back on that, I view that now as quite enlightened on my schools part. And it's only a result of years of advocacy (or what some might describe as prioritising victimhood (and I don't necessarily mean you, I'm just borrowing your reference), that people were moved out of "sheltered workshops" and we now have something like the NDIS. Ok, that's a whole other discussion given the funding difficulties but you get what I'm saying, right? And so coming back to the original line of thought - I guess what I'm trying to say (and I admit my thoughts are free wheeling a bit here) these issues are of their time and again, it's only in relatively recent times that the profound impact of colonisation on First Nations people is being broadly spoken about. Mainly through articulate and determined advocacy of indigenous people. This country is really only now being forced to a certain degree and reluctantly by many, to have that conversation. And I dare say that as sport reaches a much broader population, it's inevitable that such avenues will be used to get that message across. Will everyone like that? Absolutely not. Is it effective? It certainly can be. Do I make much sense? I struggle. Anyway, that's me done. How about that Zac re-signing!!?? 🙂

 

[Woodsie]

We could have actual discussions of interesting topics including people here who have a range of different views, most of which have at least some merit. This would of course require some effort, to avoid the put-downs. Put downs obviously serve to discourage the other person from continuing, or elses inflame the debate and it gets sucked into personal bickering.
I'm prepared to make a big effort to avoid the putdowns!
@Red Pill @chuckee @Woodsie @highlandeagle ?
Anyone else ?
(this is a rare social experiment folks, who knows what is about to unfold?)

I'm out ... prefer to discuss things with people that are having a genuine exchange of views ... not with someone just parroting ideology or trying to lead people down a rabbit hole.

 

[Red Pill]

@Woodsie trust you know SER8 better than most on here..

Yep, we had school excursions etc and to various historical sites. I also ploughed my way through The Fatal Shore so as I say, I fully appreciate what you're saying. However, you know what I didn't hear from anyone in school in the 60's and 70's? First Nations history. Not even the word aboriginal. It was like they didn't exist. But we were made to say the Lords Prayer and sing God Save The Queen every morning in primary school in the 60's - and I went to a public school in Sydney's South West! I remember also how being of convict stock was never talked about. Almost something to be ashamed of. And then seemingly all of a sudden it became ok to talk about - almost cool to have some convict lineage. And that only came about (IMHO) because it was broadly spoken about and the kind of things you're referring to were openly discussed. I would suggest that it was a similar situation for families that had a child with a disability. That is, until relatively recently, having a child with something like cerebral palsy, was something general society couldn't cope with. And I'm not saying everyone was like this but I've spoken with relos over the years that had disabled family members and they were shunned and it was something not spoken about. This can have a profound and long lasting impact. Just an aside, I remember also being taken to what used to be called the Spastic Centre at Allambie Heights for a primary school excursion. When I look back on that, I view that now as quite enlightened on my schools part. And it's only a result of years of advocacy (or what some might describe as prioritising victimhood (and I don't necessarily mean you, I'm just borrowing your reference), that people were moved out of "sheltered workshops" and we now have something like the NDIS. Ok, that's a whole other discussion given the funding difficulties but you get what I'm saying, right? And so coming back to the original line of thought - I guess what I'm trying to say (and I admit my thoughts are free wheeling a bit here) these issues are of their time and again, it's only in relatively recent times that the profound impact of colonisation on First Nations people is being broadly spoken about. Mainly through articulate and determined advocacy of indigenous people. This country is really only now being forced to a certain degree and reluctantly by many, to have that conversation. And I dare say that as sport reaches a much broader population, it's inevitable that such avenues will be used to get that message across. Will everyone like that? Absolutely not. Is it effective? It certainly can be. Do I make much sense? I struggle. Anyway, that's me done. How about that Zac re-signing!!?? 🙂

100% agree even the 80’s and early 90’s there was not much taught about the impact of settlement upon First Nations people there was more emphasis upon the convicts etc…
Yes great news about Zac mate…

 

[Red Pill]

@Woodsie trust you know SER8 better than most on here..

Yep, we had school excursions etc and to various historical sites. I also ploughed my way through The Fatal Shore so as I say, I fully appreciate what you're saying. However, you know what I didn't hear from anyone in school in the 60's and 70's? First Nations history. Not even the word aboriginal. It was like they didn't exist. But we were made to say the Lords Prayer and sing God Save The Queen every morning in primary school in the 60's - and I went to a public school in Sydney's South West! I remember also how being of convict stock was never talked about. Almost something to be ashamed of. And then seemingly all of a sudden it became ok to talk about - almost cool to have some convict lineage. And that only came about (IMHO) because it was broadly spoken about and the kind of things you're referring to were openly discussed. I would suggest that it was a similar situation for families that had a child with a disability. That is, until relatively recently, having a child with something like cerebral palsy, was something general society couldn't cope with. And I'm not saying everyone was like this but I've spoken with relos over the years that had disabled family members and they were shunned and it was something not spoken about. This can have a profound and long lasting impact. Just an aside, I remember also being taken to what used to be called the Spastic Centre at Allambie Heights for a primary school excursion. When I look back on that, I view that now as quite enlightened on my schools part. And it's only a result of years of advocacy (or what some might describe as prioritising victimhood (and I don't necessarily mean you, I'm just borrowing your reference), that people were moved out of "sheltered workshops" and we now have something like the NDIS. Ok, that's a whole other discussion given the funding difficulties but you get what I'm saying, right? And so coming back to the original line of thought - I guess what I'm trying to say (and I admit my thoughts are free wheeling a bit here) these issues are of their time and again, it's only in relatively recent times that the profound impact of colonisation on First Nations people is being broadly spoken about. Mainly through articulate and determined advocacy of indigenous people. This country is really only now being forced to a certain degree and reluctantly by many, to have that conversation. And I dare say that as sport reaches a much broader population, it's inevitable that such avenues will be used to get that message across. Will everyone like that? Absolutely not. Is it effective? It certainly can be. Do I make much sense? I struggle. Anyway, that's me done. How about that Zac re-signing!!?? 🙂

100% agree even the 80’s and early 90’s there was not much taught about the impact of settlement upon First Nations people there was more emphasis upon the convicts etc…
Yes great news about Zac mate…

 

[SeaEagleRock8]

I'm prepared to make a big effort to avoid the putdowns!
@Red Pill @chuckee @Woodsie @highlandeagle ?

Well that lasted about an hour. Woodsie comes straight in with a put down which Chuckee and Red Pill 'like', then Red Pill doubles down with a fawning bow to the knowledge of his hero and protector, Woodsie.
(I won't hold my breath waiting for a response from Highland, I'm sure his answer will be delivered in due course in his usual concise manner, ie via a dislike or disagree)

 

[Budgie]

We could have actual discussions of interesting topics including people here who have a range of different views, most of which have at least some merit. This would of course require some effort, to avoid the put-downs. Put downs obviously serve to discourage the other person from continuing, or elses inflame the debate and it gets sucked into personal bickering.
I'm prepared to make a big effort to avoid the putdowns!
@Red Pill @chuckee @Woodsie @highlandeagle ?
Anyone else ?
(this is a rare social experiment folks, who knows what is about to unfold?)

Extremely depressing.
I never thought this site would be taken over by the RWNJs as it has.
I guess they’re everywhere these days.
Apart from Woodsie, who disappoints me in this but has merit discussing footy stuff and is kinda funny, the others are rarely to be seen in actual footy discussions.
One of them writes the kind of stuff that I saw regularly as a teacher when kids submitted essays full of words, lots of words, with not a jot of original thought amongst it all.
The others are just negative nellies who pick their targets and can’t wait to swoop in with angry name calling.
I feel it’s the whole Murdoch/Fox news/2GB influence on society but it depresses the hell out of me.
I guess we all pretty much mix in our own circles in real life so I rarely see the homophobia and misogyny and racism I’ve read on here in recent times. I don’t know why these people are so foaming and frothing with bile, but they are.
There are a great many good and lovely people on this site, including yourself SER8, I just hope we don’t gradually get overwhelmed by the haters.

 

[Woodsie]

Well that lasted about an hour. Woodsie comes straight in with a put down which Chuckee and Red Pill 'like', then Red Pill doubles down with a fawning bow to the knowledge of his hero and protector, Woodsie.
(I won't hold my breath waiting for a response from Highland, I'm sure his answer will be delivered in due course in his usual concise manner, ie via a dislike or disagree)

Yep ... you should thank me ... you're finally achieved victimhood ... congratulations ..

 

[Woodsie]

@Budgie ... i am truly sorry I disappoint you ... but my only posture in this entire issue has been with people advocating to force other people to act against their beliefs ...

In exactly the same way as I would never tolerate anybody trying to force you, to act against yours.

I fully accept, respect and support who you are, and how you live your life, but it is important to protect those freedoms that allow people from both sides of a debate to be able to speak and belief as they wish.

At times we may not like it ... but heaven help us if we ever lose the right.

 

[Red Pill]

Well that lasted about an hour. Woodsie comes straight in with a put down which Chuckee and Red Pill 'like', then Red Pill doubles down with a fawning bow to the knowledge of his hero and protector, Woodsie.
(I won't hold my breath waiting for a response from Highland, I'm sure his answer will be delivered in due course in his usual concise manner, ie via a dislike or disagree)

Man you are bloody hard work!! it’s really unrelenting. Very keen it appears to cry victim…
I can appreciate @Woodsie approach here…
Btw, just because I like a post doesn’t imply I had changed my mind just respecting someone else’s chosen position… but I suspect you don’t really care about that anyway…. just more concerned with self perceived bragging rights of some sort..

It’s really such a waste

 

[Budgie]

@Budgie ... i am truly sorry I disappoint you ... but my only posture in this entire issue has been with people advocating to force other people to act against their beliefs ...

In exactly the same way as I would never tolerate anybody trying to force you, to act against yours.

I fully accept, respect and support who you are, and how you live your life, but it is important to protect those freedoms that allow people from both sides of a debate to be able to speak and belief as they wish.

At times we may not like it ... but heaven help us if we ever lose the right.

Of course.
To go back to the original, which is not what this has become, but to clarify my perspective for you:
1. The club completely stuffed it up.
2. I was extremely hurt by all the anti gay stuff that spewed forth on this site as a result. Some of it was subtle, but as someone who has suffered rejection at family, work, and societal levels, I know full well all of the guises it takes.
3. I have a great many problems with organised religion. Apart from some absolute gems, like the Sisters of Mercy, who relentlessly cared for gay boys during the AIDS crisis in the eighties when no one else wanted to be anywhere near them, much organised religion does more harm than good.
Pedophiles everywhere. Missionaries ruining previously happy societies (check your history Rainbow Seven). Wars! How many bloody wars? Guilt and righteousness where they shouldn't be. A majority exclusion of women in positions of power. And on it goes.

I won't go on.

Yes, in a perfect world, everyone should be able to speak and believe as they wish. In the Western World we pretty much have that. But even that is warping with narrowcasting media and the internet.
The Right Wing Nutjobs in America have such a silo of speech and belief that they're storming the Capitol and trying to kill the Speaker of the House.
Absolutely there has been revolutions throughout history but these were people who had to spread ideas without media and meet in secret and organise and risk. Now they're people who get up, scratch their balls, sit in front of the computer, and egg each other on. All speech and belief and dangerous.
The Christchurch Mosque shooter was fuelled by online groups where people spoke openly of their beliefs that Muslims were despicable.
Pedophiles have groups ... well you know what I'm saying.

I'm great with respectful, informed debate. I agree people should not act against their beliefs but I do think that in better circumstances than our club allowed, those beliefs should be talked through and a middle ground found where no one is hurt.

I've understood your point from the start Woodsie. I just think you're in with the wrong crowd 😉🥴😊

 

[Woodsie]

Of course.
To go back to the original, which is not what this has become, but to clarify my perspective for you:
1. The club completely stuffed it up.
2. I was extremely hurt by all the anti gay stuff that spewed forth on this site as a result. Some of it was subtle, but as someone who has suffered rejection at family, work, and societal levels, I know full well all of the guises it takes.
3. I have a great many problems with organised religion. Apart from some absolute gems, like the Sisters of Mercy, who relentlessly cared for gay boys during the AIDS crisis in the eighties when no one else wanted to be anywhere near them, much organised religion does more harm than good.
Pedophiles everywhere. Missionaries ruining previously happy societies (check your history Rainbow Seven). Wars! How many bloody wars? Guilt and righteousness where they shouldn't be. A majority exclusion of women in positions of power. And on it goes.

I won't go on.

Yes, in a perfect world, everyone should be able to speak and believe as they wish. In the Western World we pretty much have that. But even that is warping with narrowcasting media and the internet.
The Right Wing Nutjobs in America have such a silo of speech and belief that they're storming the Capitol and trying to kill the Speaker of the House.
Absolutely there has been revolutions throughout history but these were people who had to spread ideas without media and meet in secret and organise and risk. Now they're people who get up, scratch their balls, sit in front of the computer, and egg each other on. All speech and belief and dangerous.
The Christchurch Mosque shooter was fuelled by online groups where people spoke openly of their beliefs that Muslims were despicable.
Pedophiles have groups ... well you know what I'm saying.

I'm great with respectful, informed debate. I agree people should not act against their beliefs but I do think that in better circumstances than our club allowed, those beliefs should be talked through and a middle ground found where no one is hurt.

I've understood your point from the start Woodsie. I just think you're in with the wrong crowd 😉🥴😊

All that you say is valid .. but can you tell me one country in the world where the ruling regime completely controls the media, and freedom of speech doesn't exist ... that has anything other than a deplorable human rights record.

The best we can do is have the "hate" speech laws that we do .. and enforce them.

Apart from a mug like Kevvy ... I haven't heard any hate talk on here ... just some posts I wish I hadn't read. ... and that includes the hate and vitriol that was directed towards the 7.

 

[DSM5]

Interesting that the city of Townsville is named after one of the most infamous Australian slave traders. Even has a statue. Shameful really.

 

[Woodsie]

Of course.
To go back to the original, which is not what this has become, but to clarify my perspective for you:
1. The club completely stuffed it up.
2. I was extremely hurt by all the anti gay stuff that spewed forth on this site as a result. Some of it was subtle, but as someone who has suffered rejection at family, work, and societal levels, I know full well all of the guises it takes.
3. I have a great many problems with organised religion. Apart from some absolute gems, like the Sisters of Mercy, who relentlessly cared for gay boys during the AIDS crisis in the eighties when no one else wanted to be anywhere near them, much organised religion does more harm than good.
Pedophiles everywhere. Missionaries ruining previously happy societies (check your history Rainbow Seven). Wars! How many bloody wars? Guilt and righteousness where they shouldn't be. A majority exclusion of women in positions of power. And on it goes.

I won't go on.

Yes, in a perfect world, everyone should be able to speak and believe as they wish. In the Western World we pretty much have that. But even that is warping with narrowcasting media and the internet.
The Right Wing Nutjobs in America have such a silo of speech and belief that they're storming the Capitol and trying to kill the Speaker of the House.
Absolutely there has been revolutions throughout history but these were people who had to spread ideas without media and meet in secret and organise and risk. Now they're people who get up, scratch their balls, sit in front of the computer, and egg each other on. All speech and belief and dangerous.
The Christchurch Mosque shooter was fuelled by online groups where people spoke openly of their beliefs that Muslims were despicable.
Pedophiles have groups ... well you know what I'm saying.

I'm great with respectful, informed debate. I agree people should not act against their beliefs but I do think that in better circumstances than our club allowed, those beliefs should be talked through and a middle ground found where no one is hurt.

I've understood your point from the start Woodsie. I just think you're in with the wrong crowd 😉🥴😊

And you know I am no fan of the church.