Where Will Mighty Manly Finish Next Season

[Mark from Brisbane]

A great thread , for January 2019!


Waaaaaaay way too soon to be picking this!!

 

[Pittwater Legend]

In our wonderful history we've only had 11 seasons where we leaked >500 points

1947 to 1998: No seasons >500 points scored against us. From 1947 to 2018 the average points scored against us in a season is 364.

1999 to 2005: All seasons >500 points against (average points against 701) - This was obviously the SL / Northern Eagles era

2016 to 2018: All seasons >500 points against (average points against 566) - The Barrett / Cartwright Era

Defence is all about attitude, teamwork, pride, commitment and not wanting to let your mates down. These are all things that are driven by Coaching and the team leadership. Cartwright has been part of that group, he has been a part of the problem and he can NOT fix this.

The 1947 season would have gone pretty damn close over a 24 game regular season - around 485 points and that is with tries being worth 3 points at the time. But you can always excuse a club in their starting year.

 

[SeaEagle21]

A great thread , for January 2019!


Waaaaaaay way too soon to be picking this!!

I wouldn't be confident then, i would say week 8 or so

 

[manly al]

Faark I will laugh my arrse off if a deal is struck with Baz and he stays ......

Irrespective of the rights and wrongs of the matter , can only think that the likelihood of Baz coaching Manly next season has long passed the point of no return [ and , just my opinion , quite a bit of it self inflicted on his part ]

 

[pjayz]

Until we know who the coaching staff are (confirmed, not assumed), plus any changes in playing roster - there is no way to tell.

We only need 2-3 quality roster changes and a decent coach with some Manly DNA in the support staff (passion for the colours) such as Singe, Ballin and Spud.

We do the above and have reasonable luck with injuries - we could be 5-8.

The club’s offseason recruitment from coaching, support staff through to a few roster changes will give us a real indication of just how serious the club is. I genuinely doubt most media reports; however, if it is true that Maguire wanted the gig and we said no in favour of Cartwright then we have rocks in our heads - but who really knows what’s what?

 

[Woodsie]

Don’t laugh I reckon that is a slight possibility!!

I know ..... hehehe ....

 

[Wombat64]

The 1947 season would have gone pretty damn close over a 24 game regular season - around 485 points and that is with tries being worth 3 points at the time. But you can always excuse a club in their starting year.

In 1947 they played 18 games over the season and we had 364 points scored against us. Average per game 20 points against .....

 

[Woodsie]

Irrespective of the rights and wrongs of the matter , can only think that the likelihood of Baz coaching Manly next season has long passed the point of no return [ and , just my opinion , quite a bit of it self inflicted on his part ]

What part of "self inflicted" gave you a clue ..... was it when he officially gave his notice .....

 

[Woodsie]

In 1947 they played 18 games over the season and we had 364 points scored against us. Average per game 20 points against .....

20 points a game in '47 is 4 tries and conversions which is the equivalent of 24 points in todays currency ..

 

[Woodsie]

Plus unlimited tackles, a 5 yard rule, no interchange, attacking team didn't get the ball back from the restart . etc etc

 

[Wombat64]

20 points a game in '47 is 4 tries and conversions which is the equivalent of 24 points in todays currency ..

Totally agree hard to compare the different eras. I just put those stats out there to highlight a little of where we are at.

However, even a numb nut, sausage roll eating, punchie like me knows that our defence over the last three years has been way below what should be expected and tolerated from a Manly team.

 

[mozgrame]

Plus unlimited tackles, a 5 yard rule, no interchange, attacking team didn't get the ball back from the restart . etc etc

Here's an interesting read to kill a few minutes...

Some interesting rule changes over the years.

1909 Maximum of three forwards in front row of the scrum; other rows remain unrestricted.

1920 Scrum half required to roll ball into scrum.

1922 Goal from ‘fair catch/mark' and soccer-style ‘field goal' abolished.

1925 A second football provided at the touch-line to eliminate delays during all first-class matches.

1926 Goal-line drop-out (instead of from the 25-yard line) after defender makes ball dead; play-the-ball modernised - only marker and man playing the ball to be involved in contest for the ball, and marker to keep both feet on ground until ball is dropped or placed.

1931 Defending halfback to feed scrum (previously the attacking half-back fed scrum), with attacking side having the loose-head. The ‘3-2-1' scrum formation made mandatory. Scrums to be set minimum of 10 yards from touch and minimum of 5 yards from goal line. Off-side player at time of play-the-ball to be penalised if not making attempt to get on on-side and/or interferes/obstructs opposing player(s).

1932 Hooker must have both arms over props (loose-arm rule); penalty extended to include optional scrum (instead of ‘free kick').

1948 Front rows cannot pack against each other until ordered by referee.

1951 Five-yard ruck rule introduced (for one season only) to both teams; previously there had been a ‘no-yard' ruck rule.

1952 No-yard ruck rule reinstated; dummy-half and second-marker to both stand one yard behind the two men at the play-the-ball.

1954 Tap penalty introduced, with offending team to retire 10 yards.

1956 Three-yard ruck rule applied to both teams, with no minimum distance for dummy-half and second-marker.

1959 Abolition of tap penalty.

1961 Dummy-half caught with ball resulted in a scrum (rescinded after 1962 season).

1963 Ball from scrum to come out from behind the second-rowers; non-offending team given feed and loose-head for scrum from penalties (including after kick to touch); teams can replace a maximum of two injured players up to and including halftime .

1964 Scrums minimum of 10 yards from goal-line; place kickoff from halfway line to restart play after unconverted try; penalty at halfway if kickoff out on the full.

1966 Five-yard ruck rule implemented (applied to both teams i.e. attackers and defenders).

1967 Four-tackle rule replaced unlimited tackles; tap penalty reintroduced; scrum replaced by tap kick for restart after penalty kick into touch.

1968 Restart after attacking team makes ball dead: 25-yard optional kick.

1969 Front row to pack ‘square' in the scrums.

1970 Two replacements for injured players allowed at any time during a game, provided those replacements had played at least half of a lower-grade game.

1971 Value of field goal reduced from two points to one, and six-tackle rule introduced.

1972 Stopping play for treatment of injured player by ambulanceman replaced by use of club trainer and play continuing (unless serious injury &/or too close to play to allow game to continue).

1981 ‘Sin-bin' and differential scrum penalty introduced; four replacements allowed.

1982 Scrum feed and loose-head given to non-offending team.

1983 Value of try increased to four points; handover after sixth tackle if caught in possession.

1986 Twenty-metre restart when ball caught on full in in-goal by defending team.

1987 ‘Head-bin' introduced (players suffering minor head injuries allowed to return to the field of play after 10 minutes without affecting team's quota of replacements). A team kicking ball into touch in own half of the field, up to the fourth tackle, earned right to feed the ball at ensuing scrum (rule suspended before NSWRL 1987 play-offs).

1988 Two fresh reserves allowed.

1989 Handover if on the sixth tackle the attacking team knocks on, kicks out on the full, or runs into touch. At scrums, backs (apart from half-back) to stand back a minimum of 5m.

1990 In-goal touch judges used in finals series. Off-side kick chasers to remain 10m (increased from 5m) away from opponent taking possession of the ball.

1991 Penalty against defender stripping the ball from opponent in possession (later changed to allow one-on-one strips). Interchange rule introduced, allowing four players (two of whom could be fresh reserves and two of whom must have played half a game in the preceding Reserve Grade or President's Cup) unlimited interchanges throughout a match. This rule was brought in primarily to cut down the risk of the spread of blood-borne diseases. By April an angry public reaction forced a modification which provided for a maximum of four players to be available for a total of six interchanges in a match. Players sent to the ‘blood-bin' did not count among these six interchanges.

1993 Ten-metre rule introduced mid-season.

1996 Unlimited interchange re-introduced.

1997 Striking in the play-the-ball banned; deletion of minimum distance for attacking team behind dummy-half; ‘40/20' kicking rule introduced; new guidelines introduced to combat ‘dangerous throws'.

1998 ‘Zero tackle' introduced; video referee introduced.

1999 Field goal (drop goal) still awarded even if touched in flight by defender.

2001 Defending player jumping to take a catch from opponent's kick cannot be tackled mid-air. Team finding touch from the 20m optional re-start to feed scrum. If the defending team takes the ball dead from a kick (e.g. placing one foot over the dead ball line before playing at the ball) from anywhere on the field it must re-start play with a drop-out from beneath its own posts. Defending team could strip ball in the tackle if no more than two tacklers. Limited interchange rule re-introduced - 4 replacements and max. 12 interchanges.

2003 'Golden Point' extra-time introduced to decide drawn games (in NRL).

2004 When attacking player is held up in-goal, play-the-ball 10 metres from goal-line.

2007 Tap from penalty kick to be taken 20 metres infield (rescinded after 2008).

2008 Interchanges reduced from 12 to 10. Second tackler permitted to strip ball if attacker attempting to place ball for a try.

2009 Assistant on-field referee introduced. Penalty applied against defender where kicker is tackled whilst in the air.

http://websites.sportstg.com/assoc_...ID=175912&news_task=DETAIL&articleID=15492573

 

[manly al]

What part of "self inflicted" gave you a clue ..... was it when he officially gave his notice .....

That was his prerogative and fair enough . Just could not see the validity and case for making a big deal of the lack of resources and so on and when the same situation applied least season . On field performances and results were always the bigger issue this season and in the final interim did not notice much accountability on his part there .[ and until the latter part of this season and before , i was genuinely always a strong advocate of his coaching at Manly ]

 

[mozgrame]

And.....we're finals bound in 2019!!

 

[Woodsie]

Totally agree hard to compare the different eras. I just put those stats out there to highlight a little of where we are at.

However, even a numb nut, sausage roll eating, punchie like me knows that our defence over the last three years has been way below what should be expected and tolerated from a Manly team.

I agree with the point you are making ... but as far as the actual numbers are concerned I think the modern game makes any comparison impossible ... for example ..Broncos had 500 points scored against them and came 6th ... 7 or 8 teams had more than 500 points put on them ... with the referees controlling up to 10 penalties in a row and 22% possession stats, having 40 scored on you in one half is no longer unusual ...... we lost 8 games by less 6 points ... but 2 big losses can be up to 80 points against.

So, I don't think the actual numbers matter .... the fact we finished 15th tells us all we need to know ..

 

[Woodsie]

That was his prerogative and fair enough . Just could not see the validity and case for making a big deal of the lack of resources and so on and when the same situation applied least season . On field performances and results were always the bigger issue this season and in the final interim did not notice much accountability on his part there .[ and until the latter part of this season and before , i was genuinely always a strong advocate of his coaching at Manly ]

Last season he had Fulton doing the recruitment and helping in all the other areas ..so was not pressing ..... but remember he delayed signing an extension until certain conditions were met ... he got the promises but no action ...

 

[Pittwater Legend]

In 1947 they played 18 games over the season and we had 364 points scored against us. Average per game 20 points against .....

That is correct. 364 points against us over 18 games. If they played 24 games that season (like this season) then on averages the season total would have worked out to be about 485. If tries were worth 4 points that season then the total would surely pass 500.

 

[manly al]

They had a crack at Peter O " Sullivan [ presume it was a serious attempt ] and there were still re signings occurring at various stages of this season . Thought that his delay in re signing as coach last year was mainly of a monetary issue . No doubt he got some more support with Fulton there last season and had some grounds for a couple of grievances this year but again think that he was just a little too precious with his overall complaint mentality and general attitude at different stages this season .

 

[TimmyQ]

A great thread , for January 2019!


Waaaaaaay way too soon to be picking this!!

Mark its looking like we are recycling our assistant coach to head coach. With our salary cap issues we wont be buying anyone of any note. So sadly, its not too early in our case because we all know this is the status quo for 2019.

 

[Peter C]

So assuming that Cartwright is our coach and our owners continue to be tight asses and make all the wrong moves and Hodkinson/Parker/Winterstein/M.Wright continue to be picked, how low can we go?

It's not a matter of them being tight asses as far as the salary cap is concerned,as they are compelled to spend 95% of the cap, it's more a case of recruiting and developing the right players.