The Player / Manager Conundrum

[Mark from Brisbane]

Thought this was fairly informative from the club

https://twitter.com/x/status/1681150116185645056

 

[Mark from Brisbane]

And the list

 

[The Who]

Very sensible of the club.
Now, can anyone marry-up the players with their management?

 

[globaleagle]

phew, lucky someone posted this!

 

[Nordburg]

Thought this was fairly informative from the club

https://twitter.com/x/status/1681150116185645056

What about next year though?

 

[Mark from Brisbane]

What about next year though?

Good point , but don’t shoot me as I’m only the messenger

 

[BOZO]

For what it is worth

Roar Article
NRL player agents are major figures in the rugby league ecosystem. They are well known within the game’s inner circle, but not as well known to the fans.

There are a few agents with big books of marquee players who carry significant influence and have their fingers in a lot of pies. The typical agency contract involves an entitlement to a commission of 6-7 percent of a player’s earnings (materially higher than the average AFL agent’s rate of 2-5%).

In addition, some agents partner with players in business ventures and the earn from this can be higher, as is the commission on endorsements. Player agents also regularly represent coaches, NRL media personalities and even administrators, not just players… but more on this below.
Player agents are just like any other type of agent. They do the “dirty work”. They alleviate the need for the player to negotiate their own contract, a task most athletes have little experience in.

Agents also know how the game works; have a network of extensive contacts; can play a vital role in finding opportunities, greasing the wheels and advancing the interests of players by eliminating friction between clubs and players. I’ve dealt with a few agents and some of them are pretty good people who care about their clients.

But is this enough, and do players and the game benefit from the agents and the commission model? Almost every graded player has an agent so it must be necessary-right? Well, yes and no.
Some players need agents more than others. This depends on a wide range of factors, including the player’s experience, intelligence, worldliness, presence of alternative trusted advisers and their marketability and talent.
There are many players who could drop their agents tomorrow and pocket the 7 percent commission and maybe even strike betters deals for themselves, yet only a few players choose to self- manage their affairs.

There are other players who would not know where to start and may not rise above playing park football without an agent. Agents can also provide lucrative post-playing career opportunities and some are genuine father figures or mentors who steer their players through life’s challenges.

The Rugby League Player Agent Accreditation Scheme was introduced in 2005, ensuring that all agents in rugby league are registered and regulated. Agents must comply with the schemes’ rules and code of ethics and pay an annual accreditation fee.
There are various safeguards and sanctions in place to protect players and to ensure minimum standards are observed. In recent years the NRL has imposed serious sanctions for breaches of the Scheme and even de registered player agents. The Scheme rules are comprehensive. So, in this respect it’s a well- regulated industry, not a wild frontier.

There is however a major weak spot in the accreditation scheme and in the system and market forces don’t seem to adequately address this: conflicts of interest. Player agents are largely unconstrained in their ability to wear multiple hats and juggle obvious conflicts of interests.

What do I mean by this? Well imagine a real estate agent acting for the buyer and seller of the same property or a lawyer acting for both spouses in a divorce dispute.
Player agents regularly represent coaches and players in the same team, manage players in the same playing position (sometimes in the same club) and have media roles which give them an opportunity or talk up their own books or down other agent’s books.

Some even have club roles. Whether these conflicts are a good or bad thing depends on who wins or loses from the conflicts in any particular case. Conflicts of interests rarely produce a win/win outcome. I’ve kept this general to protect the innocent but we can all recall instances of conflicts affecting the outcome of contract negotiations to the detriment of one person or another.

Before everyone yells “there are rules around all this”. Yes, there are. Indeed, the scheme includes specific conflict rules.

The trouble with the rules is that they can be readily subverted, and often are. Indeed, the rules actually allow blatant conflicts provided there is full disclosure and consent. But the idea of providing informed consent to a conflict is fraught with major difficulties.

Many players would struggle to appreciate the full significance of an agent conflict even if the disclosure was adequate, which is against the likely odds. Some conflicts can be indirect or subtle and the agent might not even recognise it.

 

[Nordburg]

Good point , but don’t shoot me as I’m only the messenger

No I wasn’t having a go at you.Just pointing out that that list is pretty much redundant with most of the players were signed under Des’/Fulton/any number of CEO’s,regime

 

[JakeyB789]

This would be the list for those interested, might be wrong with a couple of the reserve players as to who is actually contracted or not but would be pretty close. Definitely agree it's a misguided list given it's for this year which is pretty much over now, and doesn't include our coaches or player movements for next year to downplay the Moses influence

Crown Sports: Schuster, Olakau'atu, Saab, S Fainu, L Fainu, GCKT, Fulton

Wasserman: Tuipulotu, Tuilagi, Sipley, Weekes, Vaega, Ferris*, Abbey* (Paulo)

Pacific Sports: Parker, Arthur, Lawton, Matterson, Sykes, Stuckey*

SFX Sports: Turbo, Jurbo, Burbo, Keppie, Humphreys

Cove: Lodge, Bullemor, Johns, Woods, Condon (Brooks, Talau)

Sports Player: Aloiai, Croker, Harper

Titan Sports: Garrick, Boyle, Dias*

Ignite Sports: DCE

Apex Sports: Paseka

GS Sports: Koula

 

[Spartan Eagle]

There was an article just posted by the "masthead" telecrap just now;

Manly’s bizarre move to ‘debunk’ player agent rumours​

can anyone get behind the paywall and post please.

thank you in advance

 

[Kiwi Eagle]

Lol, the club chasing its tail yet again. Post up 2024 for some transparency

 

[The Who]

Joe Wehbe from Ignite Sports must be able to earn a living through the commission he is getting from DCE.
Does he manager any other player?

 

[Spartan Eagle]

Very interesting read that sheds some light where our club is heading under Spoonbold

Time to cut through the BS: The truth behind Manly’s bizarre player agent ‘reveal’ - Hoops

Time to cut through the BS: The truth behind Manly’s bizarre player agent ‘reveal’ - Hoops

www.foxsports.com.au

 

[TheSoaringEagle2023]

Very interesting read that sheds some light where our club is heading under Spoonbold

Time to cut through the BS: The truth behind Manly’s bizarre player agent ‘reveal’ - Hoops

Time to cut through the BS: The truth behind Manly’s bizarre player agent ‘reveal’ - Hoops

www.foxsports.com.au

I wonder if Seibs was the Trojan horse.

 

[Spartan Eagle]

I wonder if Seibs was the Trojan horse.

It appears that way.

 

[bob dylan]

What a sheltered workshop this joint is.

Absolutely 100% embarrassing.

 

[NREagle]

Very interesting read that sheds some light where our club is heading under Spoonbold

Time to cut through the BS: The truth behind Manly’s bizarre player agent ‘reveal’ - Hoops

Time to cut through the BS: The truth behind Manly’s bizarre player agent ‘reveal’ - Hoops

www.foxsports.com.au

Head coach and head of recruitment both managed by Moses. Plus an increasing list of players.

What could go wrong.....

 

[SeaEagleRock8]

For what it is worth

Roar Article
NRL player agents are major figures in the rugby league ecosystem. They are well known within the game’s inner circle, but not as well known to the fans.

There are a few agents with big books of marquee players who carry significant influence and have their fingers in a lot of pies. The typical agency contract involves an entitlement to a commission of 6-7 percent of a player’s earnings (materially higher than the average AFL agent’s rate of 2-5%).

In addition, some agents partner with players in business ventures and the earn from this can be higher, as is the commission on endorsements. Player agents also regularly represent coaches, NRL media personalities and even administrators, not just players… but more on this below.
Player agents are just like any other type of agent. They do the “dirty work”. They alleviate the need for the player to negotiate their own contract, a task most athletes have little experience in.

Agents also know how the game works; have a network of extensive contacts; can play a vital role in finding opportunities, greasing the wheels and advancing the interests of players by eliminating friction between clubs and players. I’ve dealt with a few agents and some of them are pretty good people who care about their clients.

But is this enough, and do players and the game benefit from the agents and the commission model? Almost every graded player has an agent so it must be necessary-right? Well, yes and no.
Some players need agents more than others. This depends on a wide range of factors, including the player’s experience, intelligence, worldliness, presence of alternative trusted advisers and their marketability and talent.
There are many players who could drop their agents tomorrow and pocket the 7 percent commission and maybe even strike betters deals for themselves, yet only a few players choose to self- manage their affairs.

There are other players who would not know where to start and may not rise above playing park football without an agent. Agents can also provide lucrative post-playing career opportunities and some are genuine father figures or mentors who steer their players through life’s challenges.

The Rugby League Player Agent Accreditation Scheme was introduced in 2005, ensuring that all agents in rugby league are registered and regulated. Agents must comply with the schemes’ rules and code of ethics and pay an annual accreditation fee.
There are various safeguards and sanctions in place to protect players and to ensure minimum standards are observed. In recent years the NRL has imposed serious sanctions for breaches of the Scheme and even de registered player agents. The Scheme rules are comprehensive. So, in this respect it’s a well- regulated industry, not a wild frontier.

There is however a major weak spot in the accreditation scheme and in the system and market forces don’t seem to adequately address this: conflicts of interest. Player agents are largely unconstrained in their ability to wear multiple hats and juggle obvious conflicts of interests.

What do I mean by this? Well imagine a real estate agent acting for the buyer and seller of the same property or a lawyer acting for both spouses in a divorce dispute.
Player agents regularly represent coaches and players in the same team, manage players in the same playing position (sometimes in the same club) and have media roles which give them an opportunity or talk up their own books or down other agent’s books.

Some even have club roles. Whether these conflicts are a good or bad thing depends on who wins or loses from the conflicts in any particular case. Conflicts of interests rarely produce a win/win outcome. I’ve kept this general to protect the innocent but we can all recall instances of conflicts affecting the outcome of contract negotiations to the detriment of one person or another.

Before everyone yells “there are rules around all this”. Yes, there are. Indeed, the scheme includes specific conflict rules.

The trouble with the rules is that they can be readily subverted, and often are. Indeed, the rules actually allow blatant conflicts provided there is full disclosure and consent. But the idea of providing informed consent to a conflict is fraught with major difficulties.

Many players would struggle to appreciate the full significance of an agent conflict even if the disclosure was adequate, which is against the likely odds. Some conflicts can be indirect or subtle and the agent might not even recognise it.

I was dubious when I saw it's from the Roar, but it's not a bad article. I've posted previously about the blatant danger of conflict of interest with managers and it's strange the RLPA aren't trying to do something about it. Or maybe they are.

 

[lsz]

As i said when it was first posted it was a remarkable thing to post.

I can somewhat understand the sentiment but to post a list like that, without context and understanding of the current sentiment is just weird. It is lazy communications - something anyone with a background in coms would have picked up straight away.

Instead of assuring fans (which may have been the motivation) or responding to the league tabloid media (most likely) it failed to do either and has created a story where the club is unable to control the narrative.

My bet is that Cusso was not involved and this was another example of a failure to have an effective media strategy in place apart from the overworked one person we have.

At least this has distracted me from the fact we have selected Lodge this week.

 

[lsz]

I mean you know it is a dumb move when even the fox fools make sense talking about it

https://twitter.com/x/status/1681222123820392448