Snake

[Mark from Brisbane]

Can't believe Batty has been totally ignored as one of our great FB's in this thread.

Maybe i'm one of the only geriatrics here who is old enough to have seen him play.

Played over 200 games exclusively for Manly, was a fortress-like defender, had great game vision and scored over 1000 points.

He was a great FB.

I would put him after Eadie and before Snake and Turbanhead as our most important FB's..

I’m just old, you are indeed geriatric if you saw him play!!

Although not living in Sydney I never really started attending games until my late teens (early 70’s), about the time Wombat started.

 

[Bearfax]

My top 5

1 Eadie
2 Stewart
3 Batty
4 Ridge
5 Shearer

Young Turbo destined for somewhere in the future Top 3.

Pretty close there Seagalatos. Eadie definitely No 1, Stewart definitely No2. The others. Well it depends on what you value. For safety, good all round effectiveness without being very fast, but an excellent kicker and organiser, Ridge is the man. Shearer was like Stewart. Brilliantly fast, safe, not as all round effective as Ridge, but better in attack. Batty, I remember well and I'm glad his name came up. Batty was a bit of pearls and swine. Could do many brilliant things, but prone to some silly mistakes. Defence was OK, fast and his attack was effective but not to the Eadie, Stewart, Shearer level. Good goal kicker. Well loved by Manly fans as were the Yakich brothers, but just a shade short of International level. Id have them;

1. Eadie
2. Stewart
3. Shearer
4. Ridge
5. Batty

And that's no disrespect for Batty, who was a fine and well respected full back. Turbo I've left out because until he reaches his peak I'm not sure where he sits. At this stage though he would be No 3

 

[Woodsie]

Batty was a very very good club fullback, and any team would have been happy to have him .... but he was not a great fullback ...

With only 40 tries from over 200 appearances and no representative honours it is difficult to argue that he was in the elite class of Eadie, Snake and Ridgey ..... Tom is well on the road to emulate and even surpass them ... to be even mentioned in the same sentence is an honour ...

 

[Disco]

TT hasn't played fullback in any rep teams, only wing and centre, which brings us to another question - is he a centre/winger or a fullback?

Maybe Cherry was thinking Mitchell Marsh, rather than Shaun?

Yes he is 22, but has forced his way into rep teams, where they had to find space for him. Not the first fullback to be found space for on the basis of their talent, Hayne, Inglis, Slater, Boyd, Stewart, Dugan all played rep footy out of position

Slater debuted for Australia around 25
Minnichello around 23
Tedesco 25
Stewart around 22 (1 test)

I know he has been around a while and it is easy to think Turbo is the finished product but he is 3-5 years from hitting his peak as a footballer, which is amazing for Manly fans as he is starting from an incredibly high base

 

[Woodsie]

TT hasn't played fullback in any rep teams, only wing and centre, which brings us to another question - is he a centre/winger or a fullback?

Maybe Cherry was thinking Mitchell Marsh, rather than Shaun?

I was going to say 2nd row .... but that would just get me in trouble again ...

 

[andyw]

Batty was a very very good club fullback, and any team would have been happy to have him .... but he was not a great fullback ...

With only 40 tries from over 200 appearances and no representative honours it is difficult to argue that he was in the elite class of Eadie, Snake and Ridgey ..... Tom is well on the road to emulate and even surpass them ... to be even mentioned in the same sentence is an honour ...

somewhat agree, but don't forget, batty played in the era of 4 tackle football. not many fullbacks scored tries. churchill only managed 13 tries in 150+ games when it was unlimited tackles.

 

[Woodsie]

somewhat agree, but don't forget, batty played in the era of 4 tackle football. not many fullbacks scored tries. churchill only managed 13 tries in 150+ games when it was unlimited tackles.

Good point ...he was a player of his time ..... but even at the time of watching him I believe he was considered a very good player ... but can;t remember ever thinking or being told that he was anything more than that ....

 

[Mark from Brisbane]

I think it’s almost impossible comparing players of the 1950’s-1980’s with players of today.

Different game, different rules and VASTLY different training regimes.

Some of the skills the current players have are sublime, take the wingers ( diving through the air to place the ball down) , however, in years gone by most of those tries would be no tries as they’d have hit the corner post.

 

[EOL now nesting on the GC]

I think it’s almost impossible comparing players of the 1950’s-1980’s with players of today.

Different game, different rules and VASTLY different training regimes.

Some of the skills the current players have are sublime, take the wingers ( diving through the air to place the ball down) , however, in years gone by most of those tries would be no tries as they’d have hit the corner post.

Very insightful post. Exactly my thinking.
We can argue all we like at who's the greatest but comparing players from different generations can't be done objectively. Most on here who saw wombat play and note him as undisputed no.1 were probably an age when he was their hero. Likewise someone who saw Brett dazzle with
speed and skill may say he is the greatest.
For me my favourite player was Michael O'Connor. That guy had it all. Speed, step, footy brain, kick everything. I remember as a 14 year old his last game v Illawarra at Brookie ( I think that was it but please correct me if not) and I cried because it was so sad.
My point being the player that made your heart pound will always be your greatest hero and while he may not be the greatest he was the greatest to you.

 

[manly al]

Remember as a youngster reading an article about the Road Runner , Bob Batty at the end of his career and then expecting soon to call it a day and with a seventeen year old Wombat sitting beside him as the heir apparent , Think that Wombat debuted not long after barely 18 years of age and was regarded just destined for greatness which of course he did attain , Same as when Snake first emerged , rated as being as good a prospect as the great Eadie and also reached the greatness category . And now Tom held in the same regard . Let "s hope that like Wombat and Snake who again of course reached the champion level , that Tom [ even though he is very good now in most respects ] can attain this status very soon as well .

 

[Mark from Brisbane]

Very insightful post. Exactly my thinking.
We can argue all we like at who's the greatest but comparing players from different generations can't be done objectively. Most on here who saw wombat play and note him as undisputed no.1 were probably an age when he was their hero. Likewise someone who saw Brett dazzle with
speed and skill may say he is the greatest.
For me my favourite player was Michael O'Connor. That guy had it all. Speed, step, footy brain, kick everything. I remember as a 14 year old his last game v Illawarra at Brookie ( I think that was it but please correct me if not) and I cried because it was so sad.
My point being the player that made your heart pound will always be your greatest hero and while he may not be the greatest he was the greatest to you.

Snoz was fantastic , what an addition to our side at the time.

Obviously the pundits have picked a “ greatest ever” team ( at the 100 year anniversary of the game), and I can’t disagree BUT I still say it’s almost impossible to compare the era’s for the most obvious reason that today it’s 100% professional, with diets, training tailored to their position and skill coaches.

Compare that to the Cliffy Lyons era, day job, couple of training sessions running around for a bit, practice a few moves , have a ciggy or Twenty and play at the weekend.

 

[cherry_poppins]

TT hasn't played fullback in any rep teams, only wing and centre, which brings us to another question - is he a centre/winger or a fullback?

Maybe Cherry was thinking Mitchell Marsh, rather than Shaun?

Mitchell Marsh is too far, he's the worst all rounder of all time bar one big score with the bat, Shaun had pure raw talent but he couldn't cut out the dumb ****ery

I wasn't bagging TT I'm just saying he has more natural talent than he's shone so far

I have no doubts that he'll be up there in the GOAT talks if he realises his raw potential, for what I see if he was a piece of steak the ****er would still be mooing, he's potentially THAT good

Letting balls bounce, positional play, ****ing passing cut outs from the 9ers playbook, organisation of defence

These are his weaknesses and if he can trim those then nobody will touch him in the GOAT conversation and immortality awaits

 

[Chip and Chase]

I think it’s almost impossible comparing players of the 1950’s-1980’s with players of today.

Different game, different rules and VASTLY different training regimes.

Some of the skills the current players have are sublime, take the wingers ( diving through the air to place the ball down) , however, in years gone by most of those tries would be no tries as they’d have hit the corner post.

You're right, but the flipside to that is imagine some of those previous generation with the benefit of full time professionalism and modern training regimes. I reckon Wombat would still be a weapon in current times, maybe moreso with all the extra training and support

 

[Bearfax]

I think you can compare players from different periods, by comparing their effectiveness on the field compared with others of that generation.

If a player is a standout in one generation, it is most probable with all the different training diet, skill testing etc of this generation they would still be a standout. Sure the number of people playing the game has increased but cream always rises to the top.

I remember this argument in respect of Tendulkar and Bradman, and claims Tendulkar was a better all round batsman. Rubbish. Though fewer people played when Bradman played and the circumstances were different, when you compare other batsmen of his age with him, he was vastly superior. Tendulkar was very good, but so was Brian Lara, and now we have Steve Smith. Check their test averages and Tendulkar was on a par with Lara and both so far inferior to Smith (though this may change). None were exceptional standouts in this regard compared to other greats of that time. Bradman was.

So it is with players in Rugby League such as Eadie. His only challenger was Langlands, and Langlands had the advantage of playing in a St George side that was almost unbeatable for a decade. Same issue relates to Fulton and later Lyons. Lyons skill was almost unique with possibly only Andrew Johns comparable for the silky passing skill. Some would be standout no matter the generation

 

[Volley]

TT hasn't played fullback in any rep teams, only wing and centre, which brings us to another question - is he a centre/winger or a fullback?

Maybe Cherry was thinking Mitchell Marsh, rather than Shaun?

If he was as poor playing fullback as some on here would have you believe, he wouldn’t be making those rep sides. He must be doing something right to be noticed and selected.

 

[Briza]

I think you can compare players from different periods, by comparing their effectiveness on the field compared with others of that generation.

If a player is a standout in one generation, it is most probable with all the different training diet, skill testing etc of this generation they would still be a standout. Sure the number of people playing the game has increased but cream always rises to the top.

I remember this argument in respect of Tendulkar and Bradman, and claims Tendulkar was a better all round batsman. Rubbish. Though fewer people played when Bradman played and the circumstances were different, when you compare other batsmen of his age with him, he was vastly superior. Tendulkar was very good, but so was Brian Lara, and now we have Steve Smith. Check their test averages and Tendulkar was on a par with Lara and both so far inferior to Smith (though this may change). None were exceptional standouts in this regard compared to other greats of that time. Bradman was.

So it is with players in Rugby League such as Eadie. His only challenger was Langlands, and Langlands had the advantage of playing in a St George side that was almost unbeatable for a decade. Same issue relates to Fulton and later Lyons. Lyons skill was almost unique with possibly only Andrew Johns comparable for the silky passing skill. Some would be standout no matter the generation

And Bradman did it all with a bloody fence post, I can't even fathom how good he'd be with one of today's bats.

 

[SeaEagleRock8]

As a kid I remember being at Brookie on the Hill (was a slightly intimidating place to be as a kid) and all the talk was of this teenage prodigy fullback who was tearing it up each game, sure enough I saw him come out and do exactly that. Can't recall if it was reserve grade or the old under 23s but he was spectacular. That probably means Batty was in first grade though I don't remember him (first grade for me at the time was Fulton 'and the rest'. This was probably late season in the year before Batty retired and Eadie took over as our fullback.

 

[midsteyne]

Seriously , haven’t we been absolutely blessed with fullbacks over the years.

From Wombat, to Ridgey, to the Prince and now young Turbo.

And I know there’s a few in between through the years, but overall we’ve been damn lucky haven’t we?

Ron Murray is one we all forget.

 

[cherry_poppins]

And Bradman did it all with a bloody fence post, I can't even fathom how good he'd be with one of today's bats.

On the flip side people forget fielders clapped him instead of diving for a catch

 

[andyw]

As a kid I remember being at Brookie on the Hill (was a slightly intimidating place to be as a kid) and all the talk was of this teenage prodigy fullback who was tearing it up each game, sure enough I saw him come out and do exactly that. Can't recall if it was reserve grade or the old under 23s but he was spectacular. That probably means Batty was in first grade though I don't remember him (first grade for me at the time was Fulton 'and the rest'. This was probably late season in the year before Batty retired and Eadie took over as our fullback.

would have been 3rd grade in those days. seem to remember wombat came straight out of reserve grade though.