Realistically is 2019 a Top 8 Shot ??

[Technical Coach]

One thing that was obvious was that Fittler gave Turbo a licence to roam the field and utilise his running game. About the only time he had to stick to his wing was in defence. It worked because Tom was damn near the player of the series, and personally I think he should have won that instead of Tedesco.

As I've said in the past, its fine to play him on the wing or in the centres for NSW and Australia because there is quality right across the park. At Manly we don't have that option in the backline. He's best off being our fullback and with LG in the halves with DCE he can get back to just being a fullback and not have to try and be a play maker like he was forced to last year because we played pretty much the whole year with only one half.

Tom will make a good fullback, even better behind a more structured organized attacking squad---Des will get more out of him that is for sure, still that being the case Tom has several limitations to his game that can make him a little too predictable.

When the team is performing well Tom will be very dangerous, but i don't see Tom ever being the type that can change the course of a game or reverse a team fortunes by having a great performance in a poorly playing squad "all that often"---he just doesn't have the variety in his game or football smarts to generate options.

 

[Technical Coach]

One area we need to improve is leadership, specifically on-field leadership. The Trent-can't-coach debate has been done to death but regardless of his failings he is not solely to blame for our string of weak showings. I'm a DCE fan but he needs to be a more assertive leader or else make way for someone who is.

Melbourne has provided a blueprint for over a decade: have the smartest players in the central positions maintaining the team's focus and organisation. And by smartest I certainly don't mean fastest or most elusive or most individually brilliant. In recent years we had Orford and later Foran playing that role with success.

The need for effective strong and footy-smart on-field leadership is even more critical when a team includes several players inexperienced at NRL level, which Manly has, and will again this year. I have some hope that Elgey can develop as an organiser for us. He was certainly outstanding as a rookie half before a confidence-sapping leg injury. Should be ready now to step up - if he's good enough.

Intelligence and Footy IQ are not appreciated enough or focused on especially during the younger years, too much emphasis (at times) is directed towards physical attributes, output numbers that are not analyzed in detail or questioned, that will probably not cross over/show up against more professionally drilled and fit defenses.

Green had Footy smarts and a sense of composure that DCE could feed off.

You will get times when pure ability and size in squads is enough to distance themselves from the pack in all team sports but their dominance doesn't tend to last long.
(individual sports you can have prolonged benefits like Serena Williams or Tiger Woods etc)

 

[Ryan]

Tom will make a good fullback, even better behind a more structured organized attacking squad---Des will get more out of him that is for sure, still that being the case Tom has several limitations to his game that can make him a little too predictable.

When the team is performing well Tom will be very dangerous, but i don't see Tom ever being the type that can change the course of a game or reverse a team fortunes by having a great performance in a poorly playing squad "all that often"---he just doesn't have the variety in his game or football smarts to generate options.

If we had a halfback like Ox right now, Turbo would be outstanding. The synergy Stewart built with Ox was outstanding, to the degree that we could use a centre at 5/8 and still win a competition.

Appreciate everyone loves and adores DCE. But he isn't as controlling, organised, demanding, and have as much leadership as the little warrior. Ox was certainly one of my favorites, and very under rated.

Very unlucky to not play more rep footy.

 

[Bearfax]

If we had a halfback like Ox right now, Turbo would be outstanding. The synergy Stewart built with Ox was outstanding, to the degree that we could use a centre at 5/8 and still win a competition.

Appreciate everyone loves and adores DCE. But he isn't as controlling, organised, demanding, and have as much leadership as the little warrior. Ox was certainly one of my favorites, and very under rated.

Very unlucky to not play more rep footy.

I think Orford benefitted from having one of the best 5/8s of the age in Jamie Lyon and he also came to Manly when Des had already put together a strong team. In recent years DCE has been left to handle all of the backline plays with only Turbo as a consistent back line support. Walker has been good in patches (when on the field) and Kelly was developing but there was no Lyon, Matai, Bell, Robertson, Williams even Hicks to share the backline load. DCE would thrive with a backline like that with Stewart at full back. Look what he has had in recent years.

Orford was a solid reliable distributing half who never let the side down. But DCE is faster (one of the quickest players over 30 mts), has a better kicking game (not talking of goal kicking here), better defender, better overall attacker. With a backline that offers good support and a 5/8 who shares some of the work including distribution, the DCE/Turbo partnership would be explosive. Up to now sides have known to concentrate on DCE and Turbo and you've shut Manly's backline down.

 

[ALinda]

One area we need to improve is leadership, specifically on-field leadership. I'm a DCE fan but he needs to be a more assertive leader or else make way for someone who is.

Spot on SER8...I've been saying this for some time. I want to see DCE revving up the players behind the goalpost while the opposition is converting yet another try - not them all just standing around with their heads down. If he hasn't got time to lead, bark at, or encourage players, then give the captaincy to someone who has.

 

[HoldenV8]

Tom will make a good fullback, even better behind a more structured organized attacking squad---Des will get more out of him that is for sure, still that being the case Tom has several limitations to his game that can make him a little too predictable.

When the team is performing well Tom will be very dangerous, but i don't see Tom ever being the type that can change the course of a game or reverse a team fortunes by having a great performance in a poorly playing squad "all that often"---he just doesn't have the variety in his game or football smarts to generate options.

Tom is a running fullback and personally I think he's the best running outside back in the NRL, better than Tedesco, better than RTS and better than Ponga. But he's not a play maker and shouldn't be considered one, though that was the role he was basically forced into in 2018 because of Barrett's refusal to play a decent half alongside of DCE for pretty much the entire bloody season.

When he was able to be just a fullback in 2017 when we had Green alongside Cherry, he was easily the best fullback in the competition and I think with LG in the squad now he can get back to that. However, I don't see him ever being the ball playing, play making type fullback that Snake was, not now, not even in 10 years from now when he'd be loaded with experience. He's got good skills, don't get me wrong there, but I tend to agree with you that his football smarts aren't as good and won't ever really be.

In all seriousness, Snake was one of those special players who could do just about anything on a football field and do it better than anyone. And while Tom is bloody good himself and is probably a bit more versatile in that he can play more than just fullback, I don't think we should expect him to be the same type of player Brett was for us. But he'll be class in his own way.

Personally, I see Tom as more like Rowdy Shearer than Snake as a fullback.

 

[Harvies elbow]

Spot on SER8...I've been saying this for some time. I want to see DCE revving up the players behind the goalpost while the opposition is converting yet another try - not them all just standing around with their heads down. If he hasn't got time to lead, bark at, or encourage players, then give the captaincy to someone who has.

Most teams are a reflection of their coach.
Expect change...

 

[Woodsie]

Most teams are a reflection of their coach.
Expect change...

Sweet pelican poop on a stick ..... I pray to Krishna's ballsack we don't start to reflect the '17 Bulldogs ....

 

[Harvies elbow]

Sweet pelican poop on a stick ..... I pray to Krishna's ballsack we don't start to reflect the '17 Bulldogs ....

Seriously don't think so.
I think Des was stale there and his team reflected that.
As I've said before Des competitive nature would have been burning away in his down time and he will be fresh and reinvented as will the team.
Albeit the squad does have it's shortcomings I think we'll have structure and enthusiasm at the very least ...

 

[Technical Coach]

If we had a halfback like Ox right now, Turbo would be outstanding. The synergy Stewart built with Ox was outstanding, to the degree that we could use a centre at 5/8 and still win a competition.

Appreciate everyone loves and adores DCE. But he isn't as controlling, organised, demanding, and have as much leadership as the little warrior. Ox was certainly one of my favorites, and very under rated.

Very unlucky to not play more rep footy.

Stocky,sharp over short distances and could take the line on, didn't over complicate his game----Bellamy polished Matt off real well.(seems to be the physical foundations and skillset Bellamy looks for in a halfback before providing and encouraging a limited structured set of options per play to excel at)

Like most players had his weak points like crabbing and his passing game was not all that great but made the most of his talents and showed leadership.

I just wish Tom had a turn of speed (we are not talking about top end speed) just able to change direction and explode that would make him more dangerous from the back.

Tom's strong point is pushing up through the middle at a decent pace and then exploding into space.

 

[Technical Coach]

Tom is a running fullback and personally I think he's the best running outside back in the NRL, better than Tedesco, better than RTS and better than Ponga. But he's not a play maker and shouldn't be considered one, though that was the role he was basically forced into in 2018 because of Barrett's refusal to play a decent half alongside of DCE for pretty much the entire bloody season.

When he was able to be just a fullback in 2017 when we had Green alongside Cherry, he was easily the best fullback in the competition and I think with LG in the squad now he can get back to that. However, I don't see him ever being the ball playing, play making type fullback that Snake was, not now, not even in 10 years from now when he'd be loaded with experience. He's got good skills, don't get me wrong there, but I tend to agree with you that his football smarts aren't as good and won't ever really be.

In all seriousness, Snake was one of those special players who could do just about anything on a football field and do it better than anyone. And while Tom is bloody good himself and is probably a bit more versatile in that he can play more than just fullback, I don't think we should expect him to be the same type of player Brett was for us. But he'll be class in his own way.

Personally, I see Tom as more like Rowdy Shearer than Snake as a fullback.

The above three players all have better running games than Tom in an overall sense of the game.

I'm sure Tom probably has better average line break stats and metres per game over his entire NRL career than the above three but will see this side of his game stagnate and go backwards as his career progresses.(unless he plays behind a successful outfit then it might hold up)

Yes better stats tend to be generated playing in a successful outfit but i think the drop will be drastic when the team struggles.

 

[EOL now nesting on the GC]

Bar humbug.

Top 4 all the way. Originally I was thinking about 10 - 8 but i see a Fairy tale in the making.

With the band of brothers coming back together in Ballen, snake and possibly more anything could happen.

TT could with some guidance from snake take a huge step forward. The forward pack with the right attitude could be great. A manly us against the world attitude could return. Ballen was Mr indestructible and a bit of that could also rub off on the team. Fitness shouldn't be an issue under Donny. Dessie might tear off his fair share of doors and scare the ****e out of some of the boys.

Of course none of the above could always happen and if that's the case were stuffed. Just covering my bets.

Bump. Just because....

 

[manlyfan76]

The above three players all have better running games than Tom in an overall sense of the game.

I'm sure Tom probably has better average line break stats and metres per game over his entire NRL career than the above three but will see this side of his game stagnate and go backwards as his career progresses.(unless he plays behind a successful outfit then it might hold up)

Yes better stats tend to be generated playing in a successful outfit but i think the drop will be drastic when the team struggles.

And hasnt Tom gone backwards this year.
Pmsl.

 

[Mark from Brisbane]

More comments to be embarrassed by!!

 

[Woodsie]

A bit more optimistic than you .... with the qualifer of course being that one or two of the young centres stand up ...... Garrick in the centres and Suli on the wing are my tips ....

I think if we make the 8 .... then it stands to reason that a couple of those young backs did .... with a forward pack that can mix it with the best and are no longer rookies we should be a competetive unit come Sept.

You would think after 67 years of always being right you numbnuts would start to listen ... but Alas .... as Einstein said when asked what is the difference between intelligence and numbnuttery ... he replied ... " there is a limit to intelligence ... "

 

[Ron E. Gibbs]

All right, I’m going to come out and say it: Yes, I think, realistically, we’re a top 8 shot this year. No fence sitting for me.

 

[Kevinward777]

Mmm...

 

[globaleagle]

You would think after 67 years of always being right you numbnuts would start to listen ... but Alas .... as Einstein said when asked what is the difference between intelligence and numbnuttery ... he replied ... " there is a limit to intelligence ... "

Pssssssssssssssssssh You said Suli wing and Garrick centres.

You know nothing John Wood-snow

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOTHIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIING!!!!!

 

[BOZO]

Realistically is 2019 a Top 8 Shot ??

The 2018 Trent Barrett nightmare is over

We are living the dream feathered friends .

Enjoy !!!

 

[globaleagle]

Yes

Now there's an answer to the original question!

I am so smart
S...M...R...T !