Yep Koula attracted a very good offer from the Warriors last year (Roughly 1.2m over 3 years), only to knock that back and re-sign with Manly.
Parks n Harper - you have competition
- Thread starter maxta
- Start date
40 nil
It's only a game ...
That's true.
However, can our current centres win us a comp? If so, it would break the mold of our previous premiership teams which all had top flight centres. Despite the game changing in recent years, having pace across the backline is still a big plus for any team seeking premiership glory.
2011 - Lyon & Matai
2008 - Bell & Matai
1996 - Hill & Innes
1987 - O'Connor & Williams
1978 - Knight & Gartner
1976 - Fulton & Gartner
1973 - Fulton & Branighan
1972 - Fulton & Branighan
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StuBoot
Bencher
I get that but the centre role has changed a bit even over the past five years.
At a guess between our wingers and centres they probably scored 60odd tries last season.
Would we score any more if we had faster centres?
Maybe, maybe not. They’d probably just share the spoils.
madmax
Bencher
I didn't mention Hopoate.....
47MVEagle
Bencher
I know hahaha
40 nil
It's only a game ...
Yes, you are correct. There were 65 tries scored by our three quarters - Saab 26, Garrick 23, Parker 8, Harper 8. Last night, I watched highlights of a few matches in which Harper scored some very good tries - a mixture of hole running, evasive skills & strength. However, nearly all were against weaker sides with poor defence.
I agree that having a faster centre wouldn't necessarily equate to more tries - maybe Saab would score less. However, I think having a fast evasive player capable of breaking the line would help us get on the front foot from our own end. DCE is capable of doing this, but it occurred more regularly when he was younger & faster. Also, Fainu could do this with his elusive dummy half running. Currently, I don't think we have any player doing this regularly (not even Turbo) through their own ability (without a line break assist). I think most teams have at least player of this type who can break the line to help get them out of trouble at their own end.
IMO, it works having one 'reliable' centre who is strong defensively and runs lines to score tries, but it would be better if the other is a strike centre (who can defend) - the team would be much stronger. Of course, the best scenario is having both centres strong in both facets of the game. All our great centres of the past were like this.
Brookie Bob
"I come back to you now at the turn of the tide"
This!
Let's look at the Panthers, Bunnies, Storm and Roosters centres for this year - obviously all still contenders for the trophy this year - like us, and the best yardstick we have. If these teams have these particular players in the centre position, obviously they trust them to do the job. (I've put in players from each team who may be listed on their club site as 'winger', but may have played a lot of centre as well):
Panthers:
Official NRL profile of Stephen Crichton for Penrith Panthers | NRL.com
The NRL profile of Stephen Crichton including career statistics, season stats, games, tries, goals, tackles and fantasy scores.
www.nrl.com
Official NRL profile of Taylan May for Penrith Panthers | NRL.com
The NRL profile of Taylan May including career statistics, season stats, games, tries, goals, tackles and fantasy scores.
www.nrl.com
Official NRL profile of Izack Tago for Penrith Panthers | NRL.com
The NRL profile of Izack Tago including career statistics, season stats, games, tries, goals, tackles and fantasy scores.
www.nrl.com
Official NRL profile of Robert Jennings for Penrith Panthers - NRL
The NRL profile of Robert Jennings including career statistics, season stats, games, tries, goals, tackles and fantasy scores.
www.nrl.com
Bunnies:
Official NRL profile of Taane Milne for South Sydney Rabbitohs | NRL.com
The NRL profile of Taane Milne including career statistics, season stats, games, tries, goals, tackles and fantasy scores.
www.nrl.com
Official NRL profile of Isaiah Tass for South Sydney Rabbitohs | NRL.com
The NRL profile of Isaiah Tass including career statistics, season stats, games, tries, goals, tackles and fantasy scores.
www.nrl.com
Official NRL profile of Jed Cartwright for South Sydney Rabbitohs - NRL
The NRL profile of Jed Cartwright including career statistics, season stats, games, tries, goals, tackles and fantasy scores.
www.nrl.com
Official NRL profile of Zane Bijorac for South Sydney Rabbitohs - NRL
The NRL profile of Zane Bijorac including career statistics, season stats, games, tries, goals, tackles and fantasy scores.
www.nrl.com
Storm:
Official NRL profile of Justin Olam for Melbourne Storm | NRL.com
The NRL profile of Justin Olam including career statistics, season stats, games, tries, goals, tackles and fantasy scores.
www.nrl.com
Official NRL profile of Jack Howarth for Melbourne Storm | NRL.com
The NRL profile of Jack Howarth including career statistics, season stats, games, tries, goals, tackles and fantasy scores.
www.nrl.com
Official NRL profile of George Jennings for Melbourne Storm | NRL.com
The NRL profile of George Jennings including career statistics, season stats, games, tries, goals, tackles and fantasy scores.
www.nrl.com
Official NRL profile of Reimis Smith for Melbourne Storm | NRL.com
The NRL profile of Reimis Smith including career statistics, season stats, games, tries, goals, tackles and fantasy scores.
www.nrl.com
Roosters:
Official NRL profile of Joseph Manu for Sydney Roosters | NRL.com
The NRL profile of Joseph Manu including career statistics, season stats, games, tries, goals, tackles and fantasy scores.
www.nrl.com
Official NRL profile of Billy Smith for Sydney Roosters | NRL.com
The NRL profile of Billy Smith including career statistics, season stats, games, tries, goals, tackles and fantasy scores.
www.nrl.com
Official NRL profile of Kevin Naiqama for Sydney Roosters - NRL
The NRL profile of Kevin Naiqama including career statistics, season stats, games, tries, goals, tackles and fantasy scores.
www.nrl.com
Official NRL profile of Adam Keighran for Sydney Roosters - NRL
The NRL profile of Adam Keighran including career statistics, season stats, games, tries, goals, tackles and fantasy scores.
www.nrl.com
The only 3 out of that lot that I would take with almost complete certainty to do a better job / have more upside, more consistantly than Parker / Harper as a centre would be (in order) Manu from the Roosters, Olam from the Storm and Crichton from the Panthers.
Surprisingly - or maybe not - centre seems to be a position where even so-called 'top clubs' have little depth / experience / 'star power' going into 2022.
Penrith look ok, even after Burton's loss. The Bunnies look like a star-power black hole in the centres without Gagai. The Drizzle will have to rely on Olam and probably Reimis Smith - injuries will test them in the outside backs this year. Even the Roosters - who supposedly have a lot of depth this year - will be relying on the versatile Manu and 'somebody' to put up their hand in the trials.
Also - I don't see much in the way of 'strike' centres in the above list; someone who can make a try out of nothing, when there's nothing on and the defense is tight (think Gasnier, Fulton, O'Connor, Jamie Lyon). No length of the field tries from that lot above, not really even from Manu, Olam and Crichton; even they are best as 'finishers' and being very sound defensively.
Which is (hopefully) what we have already at Manly in Parker & Harper (and probably on less $$). I can't fault the attitude or application of either, and I (quietly) think Harper in particular is set to go up a gear this year. Harper has a couple of young mouths to feed - and he's young himself - and I think we'll see Harper bust a gut in self-improvement and application to make his mark for those he cares for.
'Kouca' Koula may be the next 'real thing' - but I'll leave it to Des as to when he gets a full-time first grade gig. His time will definitely come. We're fortunate to have him waiting in the wings - to be a centre (or...........fullback). 😎
40 nil
It's only a game ...
I disagree - these three are all strike centres, esp. Olam & Manu.
By the way, in your list you haven't included
In life, we are sometimes comfortable with something that appears to be doing the job well, and it's after only a change is made that we realize we should have made it earlier 🙂
edited
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Brookie Bob
"I come back to you now at the turn of the tide"
You're (of course) free to disagree - all of our collective observations are subjective (mine included), rather than objective.
Apologies for missing off Momrovski, Graham and Suaalii - Momrovski is not amongst the Roosters' players for this year on the NRL website (Players ), Graham is listed as a winger (I did forget that he plays as a centre), with Suaalii listed as a fullback...(possibly exceeding the quotient of doubled-up letters in a name causes me to be forgetful - but I digress. If his name was Sssuuuaaallliiii I'm sure I would forget him altogether).
Still - none of the above names fills me with a sinking feeling of "oh - no - we have to play _________ this weekend, who have ______ playing for them in their centres".
No Steve Renouf's , Mal Meninga's, Steve Rogers, Steve Ella's, Gene Miles, type of players.
Manu I like - he would go well at Manly. Does most things very well. Perhaps my memory isn't that good, but I can't recall Manu cutting a big game open (a la Fulton in the '73 GF, or..(sigh) Inglis in the 2007 GF). Olam - for 93 kgs he runs and tackles hard, but then again he has based his game on Steve Matai. I think Matai had a better step than Olam has, but maybe I'm biased. I still see Olam as fairly one-dimensional; maybe when he bobs up all over the field and can do a chip and chase like O'Connor - maybe I'll change my tune. As he is, I'd love to develop a strategy to stifle him (Olam) out of every game Manly plays, and I think it's very do-able.
All in all, if we've got to call Manu and Olam the games best 'strike' centres we can, if we must; but if we do, then then (IMO) our definition of what is a 'strike centre' has been watered down over the past 10 years or so.
40 nil
It's only a game ...
I agree. He played in a GF winning team last year - probably due o the emergence of Burton as a centre & Crichton replacing the poorly performing Staines on the wing.
True, although Mitchell was an established rep. centre before he became a regular NRL fullback. There there are some exciting young centres coming through - Best, Tabuai-Fidow, Staggs, Lomax, Crichton, Burton (?) and so on.
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Rocky
Bencher
Yep. Momorovski at a similar level to Parker.
Dunder Mifflin
That's what she said!
The fasterer the betterer 😉and fastness
TokyoEagle
Bencher
Olam is the best in the business IMO and has pulled our pants down on a few occasions these last couple of years.
While the game has changed so that centres are used differently these days, there are not too many grandfinalists from recent memory that don't have at least one very good centre that helps to give them an extra point of attack.
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Only one of the younger crew that is now struggling.
Olam is just raw power really, with decent pace.
In other era's where there were O'Conner, Lyons, ,Renouf, Inglis ect he would have just been rated a tough - hard centre.....in fact he just runs "through" players and close to the line especially, has made half comitted defence including Manly's - look ordinary.
Olam is a Solid player who hits hard and usually defensively great like most at Storm, but have seen him have sloppy mits and not always great at getting his winger away....more a solo crashball runner, which is his most effective Trump card.
In the current game, there is only 1 who stands out to me like the dangerous centres who turned games on their own and that would be Staggs in the 3 games a season he plays, or Latrell Mitchell when picked at centre.
I think in general, centres these days the role is different.
Lets go back to 80's and 90's it was all about the sweeping ball movement to get to your strike centre who would use a step, fend, or pure speed to make the break.
Since 2000's the game has shifted far more prominantly to blowing up the ruck/middle and the backline shift works off this momentum to use that 2nd man play (usually involving a fullback) , to put away the winger.....the centre will sometimes be often used as a decoy/option runner, with the key goal to hit the unmarked winger....though the short play to the centre is still often used close to the line with defnce backpeddling or in 2 minds to crash over the try line...
This does not mean it's not a bonus to have a super flashy centre, as Koula showed the other night, gaves another dimension, as early ball he can basically run a line outside his centre and create the defensive winger inwards to provide his winger open spaces.
I just feel the games evolution has seen the "Star centre" almost extinct with the key roles of dummy half and fullback becoming far more important for the reasons above...
To see a Flying Koula in action does still add so much strike and I know 1 thing for sure, opposition will have him in their checklist as a man to watch in the future which will only help Tom and others create mayhem.
In other era's where there were O'Conner, Lyons, ,Renouf, Inglis ect he would have just been rated a tough - hard centre.....in fact he just runs "through" players and close to the line especially, has made half comitted defence including Manly's - look ordinary.
Olam is a Solid player who hits hard and usually defensively great like most at Storm, but have seen him have sloppy mits and not always great at getting his winger away....more a solo crashball runner, which is his most effective Trump card.
In the current game, there is only 1 who stands out to me like the dangerous centres who turned games on their own and that would be Staggs in the 3 games a season he plays, or Latrell Mitchell when picked at centre.
I think in general, centres these days the role is different.
Lets go back to 80's and 90's it was all about the sweeping ball movement to get to your strike centre who would use a step, fend, or pure speed to make the break.
Since 2000's the game has shifted far more prominantly to blowing up the ruck/middle and the backline shift works off this momentum to use that 2nd man play (usually involving a fullback) , to put away the winger.....the centre will sometimes be often used as a decoy/option runner, with the key goal to hit the unmarked winger....though the short play to the centre is still often used close to the line with defnce backpeddling or in 2 minds to crash over the try line...
This does not mean it's not a bonus to have a super flashy centre, as Koula showed the other night, gaves another dimension, as early ball he can basically run a line outside his centre and create the defensive winger inwards to provide his winger open spaces.
I just feel the games evolution has seen the "Star centre" almost extinct with the key roles of dummy half and fullback becoming far more important for the reasons above...
To see a Flying Koula in action does still add so much strike and I know 1 thing for sure, opposition will have him in their checklist as a man to watch in the future which will only help Tom and others create mayhem.
manly al
First Grader
Good post . Just think the extra appeal of having such a natural athlete like Koula out wider is that , like Turbo can virtually create something out of nothing so to speak through not only speed but a good step as well . Have no doubt that just like the real advantage of having a finisher like Saab with the ability for run away tries , same can apply to koula and looks like he can defend as well . Will be required to take the occasional hit up as well but should be able to acquit . Saab in open space , Koula and Turbo , even Garrick . would rate right up there with some of the better speedy Manly back lines of old .
I can't disagree with any of your points here mighty al....in fact we get another chance to see Koula Friday night against Canberra and trial or not - class is class , quality is quality and speed is.....ask Bozo
....if he shows enough, I really hope he gets a gig and though not as concerned about the limited abilities of current centres who can get the job done....this bloke can take us to another level and is such an excitement machine, would be a shame to not see him get an opportunity.Users who are viewing this thread
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