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One very good reason for Sea Eagles to be confident of survival

susan

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Joined
Jul 29, 2010
Messages
2,799
I want to bed pretty sad feathered friends to be honest but have woken up pretty excited.With all the negative and foreboding press about the survival of our club I realised one very important point has been forgotten.

However this humanitarian and financial situation ( leaving out the low probability incredibly dire situation of a no treatment / vaccine high casualty world) pans out there is absolutely no doubt Rugby League will become a more streamlined less bloated cost effective game with a salary cap nowhere near the ten million of a few weeks ago. Both NRL and club staffing will be more cost effective and less orientated towards player payments as the whole of society takes a hit.

All of a sudden a Rugby League club with its streamlined structures and lower cost base becomes a business where good management may actually allow a club owner to make money. The spiralling player payments and demands for Cebtre of Excellence monoliths will be a thing of the past. Sure the financial situation may reduce the number of likely suitors but for those with funds at their disposal a famous club like Manly becomes something far more attractive under a lower cost structure.

Clubs may no longer be just toys for the rich but instead become affordable business vehicles with a customer ( club member) still yearning for the return of our great game to their lives in difficult times. A lower cost entity with a customer base that is still available and keen is a powerful thing. We will be one of the few businesses where the customers will be waiting in line for their beloved product. Indeed harsh circumstances may make our game even more in demand as a distraction from the troubles of their lives.The last couple of weeks has shown how much we want our game.

The great man himself Geoff Toovey hinted at the interest that remains in our brand this very evening.

We know we had suitors for our famous maroon and white prior to this mess and now our historical club is there to be grabbed at a price and future business conditions that makes it attractive.

All this asssumes Scott Penn wants out. Maybe he sees what I see and will not be going anywhere as his costs diminish.

We will be fine.

Rugby League cannot afford to cede the productive land al the way to Newcastle, our famous colours DEMAND a buyer and we will be going nowhere.feathered friends.In fact a new more humble affordable yet exciting era awaits as the gross excesses of our game are a thing of the past.

Over to you Bozo

PS. And the lower payments to players and possible season delay may very well bring about the loss of Scam Smith from our lives forever feathered friends. An incredible bonus in testing times.
 
Last edited:

Peter C

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Premium Member
Joined
Sep 15, 2010
Messages
2,562
I want to bed pretty sad feathered friends to be honest but have woken up pretty excited.With all the negative and foreboding press about the survival of our club I realised one very important point has been forgotten.

However this humanitarian and financial situation ( leaving out the low probability incredibly dire situation of a no treatment / vaccine high casualty world) pans out there is absolutely no doubt Rugby League will become a more streamlined less bloated cost effective game with a salary cap nowhere near the ten million of a few weeks ago. Both NRL and club staffing will be more cost effective and less orientated towards player payments as the whole of society takes a hit.

All of a sudden a Rugby League club with its streamlined structures and lower cost base becomes a business where good management may actually allow a club owner to make money. The spiralling player payments and demands for Cebtre of Excellence monoliths will be a thing of the past. Sure the financial situation may reduce the number of likely suitors but for those with funds at their disposal a famous club like Manly becomes something far more attractive under a lower cost structure.

Clubs may no longer be just toys for the rich but instead become affordable business vehicles with a customer ( club member) still yearning for the return of our great game to their lives in difficult times. A lower cost entity with a customer base that is still available and keen is a powerful thing.

The great man himself Geoff Toovey hinted at the interest that remains in our brand this very evening.

We know we had suitors for our famous maroon and white prior to this mess and now our famous club is there to be grabbed at a price and future business conditions that makes it attractive.

All this asssumes Scott Penn wants out. Maybe he sees what I see and will not be going anywhere as his costs diminish.

We will be fine.

Rugby League cannot afford to cede the land al the way to Newcastle, our famous colours demand a buyer and we will be going nowhere.feathered friends.In fact a new more humble affordable yet exciting era awaits as the gross excesses of our game are a thing of the past.

Over to you Bozo
What worries me though is that those perennial vultures North Sydney are always circling around waiting to take over, let's hope Penn doesn't sell to them
 

jbb/james

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jun 19, 2010
Messages
2,605
Im more of an eagle than a legal eagle so my thoughts are just that .

My biggest hope is that the NRL itself goes broke as the clubs are all independant. Over the years with essentially bribery for survival the NRL has captured most clubs balls and regularly squeeze them to achieve a result in favour of themselves. By going broke the power and the contracts that go along with them should be null

The clubs have never had the bargaining power because of the conflict of interest in the system,

The game has a great chance of reverting back to the clubs and the people who made the business. It will be a long road back but a much better journey without the baggage of the last 20 odd years

Only sad note is greenberg will go because of an unexpected event as opposed to ............. Well you can fill in the blanks. Im a bit of a potty mouth
 

Desert Eagle

Active Member
Joined
Oct 27, 2019
Messages
96
I want to bed pretty sad feathered friends to be honest but have woken up pretty excited.With all the negative and foreboding press about the survival of our club I realised one very important point has been forgotten.

However this humanitarian and financial situation ( leaving out the low probability incredibly dire situation of a no treatment / vaccine high casualty world) pans out there is absolutely no doubt Rugby League will become a more streamlined less bloated cost effective game with a salary cap nowhere near the ten million of a few weeks ago. Both NRL and club staffing will be more cost effective and less orientated towards player payments as the whole of society takes a hit.

All of a sudden a Rugby League club with its streamlined structures and lower cost base becomes a business where good management may actually allow a club owner to make money. The spiralling player payments and demands for Cebtre of Excellence monoliths will be a thing of the past. Sure the financial situation may reduce the number of likely suitors but for those with funds at their disposal a famous club like Manly becomes something far more attractive under a lower cost structure.

Clubs may no longer be just toys for the rich but instead become affordable business vehicles with a customer ( club member) still yearning for the return of our great game to their lives in difficult times. A lower cost entity with a customer base that is still available and keen is a powerful thing. We will be one of the few businesses where the customers will be waiting in line for their beloved product. Indeed harsh circumstances may make our game even more in demand as a distraction from the troubles of their lives.The last couple of weeks has shown how much we want our game.

The great man himself Geoff Toovey hinted at the interest that remains in our brand this very evening.

We know we had suitors for our famous maroon and white prior to this mess and now our historical club is there to be grabbed at a price and future business conditions that makes it attractive.

All this asssumes Scott Penn wants out. Maybe he sees what I see and will not be going anywhere as his costs diminish.

We will be fine.

Rugby League cannot afford to cede the productive land al the way to Newcastle, our famous colours DEMAND a buyer and we will be going nowhere.feathered friends.In fact a new more humble affordable yet exciting era awaits as the gross excesses of our game are a thing of the past.

Over to you Bozo

PS. And the lower payments to players and possible season delay may very well bring about the loss of Scam Smith from our lives forever feathered friends. An incredible bonus in testing times.
I totally agree with you susan.

The Manly Warringah Sea Eagles are not over by any stretch of the imagination. Sure the NRL incompetence and COVID-19 may have clipped our wings a bit, but this will only be a minor setback for out mighty Club.

I'm going to throw something out there that I've been thinking about for a while. Right now, it's just blue sky thinking.

Not really sure of the ownership structure of the Club, but I assume the Leagues Club owns some part and the Penns own the rest. Excuse my ignorance on this point.

Has there ever been any talk about a grass roots syndicate of supporters taking a stake in the Club. I'm not talking about the full amount, but just some part of it to give us more of a voice and say in the running of the Club.

Is there any reason why this could not be considered?

A Club with passionate supporters who have a vested interest in the all aspects of the success of the Club. Not open to just supporters, but ex-players as well.

This is not just about or necessarily even about making money, but about making our Club's future secure.

It's just something I've been mulling about in my head for a while, so there's been no real deep thought put into this, but I'm sure there's enough financial, legal and commercial types who support Manly, who, if we got together, could make something like this happen.

Honestly, I know it's a crap time for everyone with businesses potentially going to the wall and everything else, but I just want to throw it out there for discussion.
 

Mitch

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Joined
Jan 1, 1970
Messages
2,662
Three letters: URM. One business that won't be going bad is garbage collection. They, and others, won't let our club die.
I was thinking exactly the same thing. With people spending more time in the household etc, waste management will be hugely important and if there was a time when the Penns decide pull out, I’m sure there would be real interest there.
 

Loobs

Living in the demountable.
Joined
Jul 26, 2014
Messages
8,431
“Waste management” should have taken out Greenberg a while ago.

Anyway - pick your poison. Penn who wants to start a NY team as well and was holding out selling and I assume still has a fair amount of family cash to mooch off or a leagues club that has its doors forcibly shut with their beloved pokie rooms that steal the money of idiots falling silent...
 

Terry Zarsoff

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Joined
Jun 19, 2013
Messages
7,263
The Football Club still has a stake in all this, so discussions about North Sydney circling etc. sound extremely premature.

Susan’s points are on the money. As mentioned elsewhere, we don’t rely on significant grants from the LC anymore, so it’s the majority of other Sydney clubs that have to look at a more radical restructure of their finances, and quickly.

V’Landys’s comments re: Brookvale some months ago should also give people hope, even if (apart from the CoE) nothing comes of it. Clearly he gets rugby league tribalism and by extension the necessity of having a team north of the Harbour, even if it serves as a principal lightning rod for other teams’ supporters dislike - that feeds back into the tribalism.
 

SeaEagleRock8

Sea Eagle Lach
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Mar 8, 2009
Messages
18,060
Thanks @susan for that positive vision, Tooves comment last night made me more relaxed but helpful to know it all might make sense from a business viewpoint too. In fact it would be great if Manly Sea Eagles outlive not just Rothfield Kent and Co but also Foxtel (!)


Has there ever been any talk about a grass roots syndicate of supporters taking a stake in the Club
Supporters already have a stake in the Sea eagles via the District Football Club, which still owns a preference share in the Sea Eagles and I think buys back regular shares in dribs and drabs (have to check that). The MWRLFC (the football club) is the true custodian of the club's history and I certainly encourage supporters to join. However it has stuff-all money.

As to community owned models or private/community ownership models, there's been discussions here in the past, if I find one I'll post a link. I know there's been some success with such models in some European football clubs but I haven't looked at that for quite some time.
 

niccipops

un echidna spillo mia bevanda
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Mar 11, 2009
Messages
6,929
Of course the news limited hacks are going to death ride Manly. Nothing new. Every year it's the same. They can't stand the thought of our success so any opportunity to forecast our downfall.
Susan made excellent points. This could be the step back to reality that rugby league needed. Players don't need to be paid $1.2 mil for kicking a ball. Maybe it will go back to some needing to work two jobs instead of spending free time brawling in Bali or drinking pineapple cruisers on a roof.
Maybe even some club loyalty will come back into the game instead of just athletes chasing dollars?
Just maybe even the NRL's beloved teams like Parra, Storm, Chooks, Souths and Donkeys won't get scheduling and refereeing advantages anymore.
Hopefully, out the other side we'll see a better, fairer competition.
 

Terry Zarsoff

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Joined
Jun 19, 2013
Messages
7,263
SER8 makes a good point and I would encourage Bravo Oscar Bravo Oscar to start directing his regular spam posts to football club, not just season ticket holder, memberships.

You never know, it might actually work.
 

Terry Zarsoff

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Joined
Jun 19, 2013
Messages
7,263
Thanks @susan for that positive vision, Tooves comment last night made me more relaxed but helpful to know it all might make sense from a business viewpoint too. In fact it would be great if Manly Sea Eagles outlive not just Rothfield Kent and Co but also Foxtel (!)



Supporters already have a stake in the Sea eagles via the District Football Club, which still owns a preference share in the Sea Eagles and I think buys back regular shares in dribs and drabs (have to check that). The MWRLFC (the football club) is the true custodian of the club's history and I certainly encourage supporters to join. However it has stuff-all money.

As to community owned models or private/community ownership models, there's been discussions here in the past, if I find one I'll post a link. I know there's been some success with such models in some European football clubs but I haven't looked at that for quite some time.
The sporting community ownership model par excellence is possibly the Green Bay Packers.
 

manly al

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2,266
So the A F l have tentatively deferred their season until late May in the expectation that there may be a more favorable situation to resume fixtures , even with empty stadiums no doubt . The N R L and A F L will most likely choose a return to playing in a similar time sequence and it could even result in another month or so after this A F L time frame in any resumption . The A F L players have already agreed to a 50 % pay cut , got a feeling that it going to be a bit harder for N R L to accept this reduction amount but 25 % has to be the bare minimum at this stage surely . No reason why the N R L season can not extend to late November or so then . Also can not subscribe to the doom and gloom outlook for the club 's survival , eventually got through the early or one time post Northern Eagles crisis . Should become much more clear and reassuring in the next couple of weeks . Any more then a 3 month suspension of games could present some more challenges . In any case , for all stakeholders including the broadcasters , maintaining the present status quo of teams is in their best operating and commercial interests as well .
 

The Who

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Jun 29, 2010
Messages
11,292
Some things seem certain when RL returns:
  • Our Centre of Excellence won't happen for a long time, if ever
  • The SFS rebuild won't happen for some time and when it does it will be a greatly scaled down version
  • Likewise, Homebush Stadium will not get its roof
  • The Brisbane Broncos will get bigger, stronger and wealthier because there will be no new expansion clubs in the region for years
  • Players will no longer have the upper hand in negotiating with clubs for contracts
  • The need for player-agents will be diminished
  • The salary cap will be significantly reduced

I'm also hoping:
* There will be a 'trade period' similar to the AFL and a tightening of rules surrounding negotiating with players under contract
 

susan

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Jul 29, 2010
Messages
2,799
Spoke to a great mate of mine in LA last night who was involved as Chairman and CEO of our club from 2003 to 2008.

He agreed with my observations and can see a situation arising where if the virus is worse than expected and the NRL itself folds the game can restructure via the clubs owning the game directly with each club having equal ownership and having its Chairman as a member of a controlling board with the Chairmanship of the board rolling from club to club on a yearly basis.

He goes further and suggests that all non football operations of each club may being housed in central offices in Brisbane and Sydney whereby marketing representatives from each club would operate targeting new club members but using state of the art pooled facilities and technologies for economies of scale .Other tasks like general admin etc could operate the same way from a state of the art central location.The clubs therefore maintain control of their tactics and methods but share in the expertise and better technology etc that facilitates those processes.

That would in itself engender a more community based and sharing approach to the running of the game.

The club ownership collective would of course employ people to conduct the non club specific tasks like junior footy , country and metropolitan leagues and strategic direction with an emphasis on quality personnel rather than quantity and jobs for the boys.

The football departments would operate as they do now out of their current homes and facilities with a small number of non football staff on site to liase between the central offices and carry out tasks that involve the local communities.

The players would need to realize that the next agreement will mean they receive less of a share of a smaller broadcast rights pool and those savings to the clubs plus a huge reduction in running costs due to leaner staff and shared technology and office space which drives economies of scale would make them viable business concerns in their own right with a common purpose.

I’m sure many could find improvents to that model but as a starting point for consideration it has a lot of merit.
 

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