omnipotent beings discussion

[manlyfan76]

A Classic Christian hymn of faith. I never get bored singing this hymn at church. One of my favourites among others to say the least.

I've been reading the exchanges in this thread for a few days now Bozo, and been enjoying it.
Some of the best christians thinkers and apologists today; Ravi Zacheraus, Don Carson, Wayne Grudem, John Lennox (and more) are worth listening to.
Keep it up Bozo.

Classic slavery song originally.

 

[mozgrame]

John Newton was a horrible violent drunk in his younger years, by most reports. He left the slave trade in 1754....but didn't have any feelings of remorse about his past straight away, but he certainly changed his mind in a big way as time passed. After studying the word (brought about by a brush with the Almighty)....and a complete turn around in his character, he became a minister. Newton took a role at a parish in the town of Olney...that's where he and Willaim Cowper came up with hundreds of "Olney hymns". One of those hymns was Amazing Grace....sometime between 1760 and 1770. (At least 6 years after changing his occupation)

A classic slave song? No. It's a hymn by an ex slave trader that found God and worked hard to abolish slavery in England. He died at 82, twelve years befor they ended slavery in England. He compiled a wealth of information about the slave trade. His story is fascinating. I stumbled across him while researching historical documents about the bible.

Interesting side note.....the original melody for AG was from a protestant hymn called "New Britain"

 

[mozgrame]

Some on here claim to be atheist. Fine.

Some on here seem much more agnostic. Great!

Some on here display attitudes and opinions that much closer resemble gnostic atheists. That's OK too!

Please explain which one you are...and why you are certain of your standpoint. Can you also please give examples and evidence that support your views.

Thanks. I look forward to some intelligent reading instead of the childlike and boringly repetitve "sky fairy" and the like obtuseness.

 

[manlyfan76]

Hey Moz, what do you make of the kabalah?
It seems (on the surface) to be a sort of common denominator / reading between the lines, with most religions.
The powerful "above" figure
The "journey" and goal of heaven / improvmebt
The suffering issue that man has.

I'm not across it all that much but I am interested in learning more. But not ready to become an Allister Crawley disciple just yet lol.

 

[manlyfan76]

John Newton was a horrible violent drunk in his younger years, by most reports. He left the slave trade in 1754....but didn't have any feelings of remorse about his past straight away, but he certainly changed his mind in a big way as time passed. After studying the word (brought about by a brush with the Almighty)....and a complete turn around in his character, he became a minister. Newton took a role at a parish in the town of Olney...that's where he and Willaim Cowper came up with hundreds of "Olney hymns". One of those hymns was Amazing Grace....sometime between 1760 and 1770. (At least 6 years after changing his occupation)

A classic slave song? No. It's a hymn by an ex slave trader that found God and worked hard to abolish slavery in England. He died at 82, twelve years befor they ended slavery in England. He compiled a wealth of information about the slave trade. His story is fascinating. I stumbled across him while researching historical documents about the bible.

Interesting side note.....the original melody for AG was from a protestant hymn called "New Britain"

You surely cannot deny it was a big song among the slaves of USA? From memory the song (and tune) changed a bit since its conception?

 

[Woodsie]

Please explain which one you are...and why you are certain of your standpoint. Can you also please give examples and evidence that support your views.

I am an athiest ..... if God existed ... Parramatta wouldn't.

 

[SeaEagleRock8]

Those people that wrongly power over others only gain short term . How long does one live ? average 80 years ? But after their old and wrinkly and sick bodies die at an old age , they miss out on the eternal life . Thats the choice and gamble they take .

Cold comfort I'm afraid.
Oh well I'll leave you (along with all the Muslims, and all the rest) to enjoy your afterlife together.
Hope it's not too crowded up there.
By the way, have you thought about what you might do for eternity? Do they play footy up there? Probably won't have foxtel. I suppose you could have games of chess, or do crosswords or something.
Anyway enjoy, knock yourselves out!

 

[manlyfan76]

Some on here claim to be atheist. Fine.

Some on here seem much more agnostic. Great!

Some on here display attitudes and opinions that much closer resemble gnostic atheists. That's OK too!

Please explain which one you are...and why you are certain of your standpoint. Can you also please give examples and evidence that support your views.

Thanks. I look forward to some intelligent reading instead of the childlike and boringly repetitve "sky fairy" and the like obtuseness.

On my beliefs i would answer that i am a desciple of Ra. Hard to imagine an existance without him.

If really pressed i would define myself as an agnostic Atheist. I see no evidence for that i do not believe in, but give me the proof and i am open to it.

The best description of religon i have found is this Hans Wilhelm video:

Unfortunately for most religons they have strayed too far from the source (matrix complex - insert here)
The lessons from hinu, jesus, Buddah ARE great lessons. This does not mean mean they are the one and only but maybe just interpretation of the way.

To finish with how can one say he is not "this" if one does not understand it?

 

[wombatgc]

As I’ve learnt over the years not to take life too seriously ..... I give you The Butterfield effect.....

 

[mozgrame]

I am an athiest ..... if God existed ... Parramatta wouldn't.

Parramatta are proof of satan's existence....if he is real then............

 

[mozgrame]

Cold comfort I'm afraid.
Oh well I'll leave you (along with all the Muslims, and all the rest) to enjoy your afterlife together.
Hope it's not too crowded up there.
By the way, have you thought about what you might do for eternity? Do they play footy up there? Probably won't have foxtel. I suppose you could have games of chess, or do crosswords or something.
Anyway enjoy, knock yourselves out!

Up there? Up.....there???? You're a funny bugger!! You proudly announce you don't believe in something....yet you show that you have barely any knowledge of the subject. I'm sorry.....I couldn't let that one pass. Oh my.......You've come out with some pearlers of late!

Hahahaha!!! Up there!!! You crack me up........

Thanks for that, mate!

 

[mozgrame]

Hey Moz, what do you make of the kabalah?
It seems (on the surface) to be a sort of common denominator / reading between the lines, with most religions.
The powerful "above" figure
The "journey" and goal of heaven / improvmebt
The suffering issue that man has.

I'm not across it all that much but I am interested in learning more. But not ready to become an Allister Crawley disciple just yet lol.

Mate....I'm no happy clapper and I don't claim to be all over every religious outfit. I'm just following the evidence. All "religions" have common denominators. If they didn't, they'd have to be something very odd that people can't relate to......so, how would they make money and accumulate power? So far......all religions I have looked at fall flat on one key point.

Wicca, scientology, Jehova witness, Hinduism, Osho - Zorba the Buddah (check that one out @Woodsie ) lol, Buddhism, The Hermitic order of the golden dawn.......sure religion serves a purpose in society.....but do you seek truth, order and peace? You won't find it in this hodge-podge.

What have I (for one) been saying all along? I don't much like religion. I like what Jesus taught. I'll put it another way.....if we stuck to what Jesus taught...instead of letting greed, power and lust get in the way, as religion tends to do......we'd be better off. Why do people want to compare the incomparable? I don't get that. All religions have similarities, then they branch off from each other. That's why I am (and you don't have to) digging for truth. It's like a hobby for me....except the more I dig, the more evidence I find for a creator.

About Crowley......it's interesting where his love of dark things got him. He seems to have received his reward from the masters he served. After all of his bravado, claims of higher intelligence and debauchery.......he died sick, penniless, drug addicted and scared of the dark in a boarding house. You reap what you sow?

Now...you seem to put more thought into this than most.......can you see and tell me how Jesus was different from all the rest? Can you see something strange/incredible/amazing about scripture - the gospels and Jesus compared to all the rest? Something that seems to point to truth? I'll give you a nudge in the direction I've found. What's the difference between backing a favourite or putting your money on a long shot?

 

[Woodsie]

no matter what slings and arrows come their way.

As an enthusiastic Thespian I am offended that you would plagarise the words of the Bard to seek justification of your God ....

 

[mozgrame]

On my beliefs i would answer that i am a desciple of Ra. Hard to imagine an existance without him.

If really pressed i would define myself as an agnostic Atheist. I see no evidence for that i do not believe in, but give me the proof and i am open to it.

The best description of religon i have found is this Hans Wilhelm video:

Unfortunately for most religons they have strayed too far from the source (matrix complex - insert here)
The lessons from hinu, jesus, Buddah ARE great lessons. This does not mean mean they are the one and only but maybe just interpretation of the way.

To finish with how can one say he is not "this" if one does not understand it?

Yes...but Jesus doesn't give that option. That's why it's a little bizarre to label him simpy a great teacher. He claimed to be much more than that. The son of man/the son of God. He claimed to be God. Again, I'll ask you the question...in a different form (just in case you missed it in my other reply....I know you're not on here right now, but I'm eager to hear your thoughts)

Who wrote the Quran? Did Buddah actually record/write down his teachings or was it simply spoken by him and then it was up to the sangha (assembly) to memorise them?

Well....it seems that Buddah taught for about 45 years and everything he taught was orally. That's cool...Jesus did the same, but only for 3 years. Nothing was written down about Buddah's teaching until around 500 years after his death. The Quran was written by Mohamad, the words were given from Allah. Cool....so was the Christian bible.

So Buddhism's teachings were from one man and eventually put into text. Mohamad's teachings were through one man (from God) and put into text.

The Christian bible was written over a span of 1500 years. It has 40 different authors and 66 books (39 in the OT and 27 in the NT), and it has the same common thread throughout. The collusion rate is miraculous. It is the most studied and scrutinised book ever, yet it stands up. The prophecies are amazing!

Now........please understand that I'm not a froth at the mouth, hate filled christian elitist that believes something because a book says so. Far from it. I find evidence to either supprt or dismiss the claims of the book. I'm more of a backyard theologist/investigative journalist, hahaha. I believe strongly in free will....choose your own path. That's 100% fine with me. No issues.

What I want is evidence.....and Jesus so far seems to be the only one that stands up.

 

[SeaEagleRock8]

Up there? Up.....there???? You're a funny bugger!! You proudly announce you don't believe in something....yet you show that you have barely any knowledge of the subject.

Yes well fair enough, the subject raised by Bozo was eternal life, and I confess my lack of knowledge of this subject.
Nevertheless, it strikes me as a concept that is easy to bandy about, until one stops and asks what it actually means.
You clearly know something of this, so share your knowledge! What's your view - probably not chess or crosswords - do we just have to stand around glorying in the magnifience of the Creator the whole time?
Also, do we even have our bodies? If not, I guess we can't speak to each other, or eat or drink? do we go to sleep?
These surely are relevant considerations for anyone considering eternal life.
I'm hopeful but not confident of a serious response.

 

[Kevinward777]

Those people that wrongly power over others only gain short term . How long does one live ? average 80 years ? But after their old and wrinkly and sick bodies die at an old age , they miss out on the eternal life . Thats the choice and gamble they take .

Just because Christian hypocrites consider them selves good Christians does no mean jack sht as they will also be Judged by the all mighty like all the rest of us will

What I was referring about judging people is condemning them .

As for the saying of Religion is the opiate of the masses .

My view as a person who has experienced my faith is Freedom from my past scars hurts , failures , wrong doing and dissapoinments . . Freedom from keeping hatred of Others and feeling tormented in my soul because of it , An optimistic positive view in life and Secure in my future as it is in Gods hands .

Here is one of the many uplifting gospel songs from peoples experiences life with the faith

The power and freedom one receives from prayer and faith is immesurable .

A typical Prayer written by a person that was freed from his past ....

Amazing Grace, How sweet the sound
That saved a wretch like me
I once was lost, but now am found
T'was blind but now I see
T'was Grace that taught my heart to fear
And Grace, my fears relieved
How precious did that grace appear
The hour I first believed
Through many dangers, toils and snares
We have already come.
T'was grace that brought us safe thus far
And grace will lead us home,
And grace will lead us home
Amazing grace, Howe Sweet the sound
That saved a wretch like me
I once was lost but now am found
T'was blind but now I see

Great post Bozo.

 

[Kevinward777]

John Newton was a horrible violent drunk in his younger years, by most reports. He left the slave trade in 1754....but didn't have any feelings of remorse about his past straight away, but he certainly changed his mind in a big way as time passed. After studying the word (brought about by a brush with the Almighty)....and a complete turn around in his character, he became a minister. Newton took a role at a parish in the town of Olney...that's where he and Willaim Cowper came up with hundreds of "Olney hymns". One of those hymns was Amazing Grace....sometime between 1760 and 1770. (At least 6 years after changing his occupation)

A classic slave song? No. It's a hymn by an ex slave trader that found God and worked hard to abolish slavery in England. He died at 82, twelve years befor they ended slavery in England. He compiled a wealth of information about the slave trade. His story is fascinating. I stumbled across him while researching historical documents about the bible.

Interesting side note.....the original melody for AG was from a protestant hymn called "New Britain"

Don’t you just love facts.

 

[mozgrame]

Yes well fair enough, the subject raised by Bozo was eternal life, and I confess my lack of knowledge of this subject.
Nevertheless, it strikes me as a concept that is easy to bandy about, until one stops and asks what it actually means.
You clearly know something of this, so share your knowledge! What's your view - probably not chess or crosswords - do we just have to stand around glorying in the magnifience of the Creator the whole time?
Also, do we even have our bodies? If not, I guess we can't speak to each other, or eat or drink? do we go to sleep?
These surely are relevant considerations for anyone considering eternal life.
I'm hopeful but not confident of a serious response.

If you are honestly looking for answers....why don't you look for yourself? It's all there. Why would you take the word of someone that you aren't confident can provide a serious response?? Asking someone you consider foolish for evidence is absurd. Go to the source.

Just so I've got this straight........You freely admit to not having knowledge of the subject. That knowledge is available to all who search.....but you choose not to honestly search.....because you've predecided that the subject is nonsense and warrants no further investigation....and you formed this opinion because you don't possess enough knowledge on the subject.

Wow!

 

[mozgrame]

Don’t you just love facts.

Yes!

 

[BOZO]

Yes well fair enough, the subject raised by Bozo was eternal life, and I confess my lack of knowledge of this subject.
Nevertheless, it strikes me as a concept that is easy to bandy about, until one stops and asks what it actually means.
You clearly know something of this, so share your knowledge! What's your view - probably not chess or crosswords - do we just have to stand around glorying in the magnifience of the Creator the whole time?
Also, do we even have our bodies? If not, I guess we can't speak to each other, or eat or drink? do we go to sleep?
These surely are relevant considerations for anyone considering eternal life.
I'm hopeful but not confident of a serious response.

One needs to study the whole Christian Bible in order to understand fully as one paragraph of any book does not paint a clear picture

To simplify ....

Our bodies wrinkle and rot and decays but not our soul .

Example .

You are lying in bed sick, your body is weak but within your spirit you feel like going out but you know that your body wont carry your spirit

You try and get up from your sick bed but your sick body will not respond to your willing spirit
.
We often see old people young at heart like children as Peoples spirit and soul never changes with age only the body does

Fact

There are many confessions of people that have been clinically dead of what they saw before they were revived again

Some unknowns can never be explained but that does not mean they are not true

In the Gods galaxy we are a microscopic specie that think we all know everything but we know fck all .

In the the end what one believes sees

Eternal life is a bout faith and you have to be in it to win it .

IMO one needs a hell of a lot of faith to believe in nothing than something like the Christian faith with substance

In the end as I have said it before we ALL put our faith in the test . Christians are not the only ones that have faith

The moral of the story

At the end of the day I will never convince a parra supporter to follow the Sea eagles no matter how many wooden spoons they win

People will focus on what they want to focus on .