Pre-Game Manly v Dragons [Round 18, 2021]

[Woodsie]

The most influential player in the game. The guy is a freak and before his career is over barring injury he will be close to the best ever for Manly. So huge huge out!

Agree ... his talent and abilities explain why we are so good with him in the side ... BUT ... they don't explain why 17 professional football players (some on big bucks) and the world's greatest Coach are so bog average shiitehouse when he is not in the team.

15 other clubs seem to be able to win games without Turbo in their team ...

 

[Ryan]

Agree ... his talent and abilities explain why we are so good with him in the side ... BUT ... they don't explain why 17 professional football players (some on big bucks) and the world's greatest Coach are so bog average shiitehouse when he is not in the team.

15 other clubs seem to be able to win games without Turbo in there team ...

Exactly, on every point raised mate.

 

[47MVEagle]

I don't think its simply a case of "no Turbo, no win" any more.

He wasn't in the team in our one point win over the Warriors but was in the squad in our 38-32 win over them, which was a difference only of a converted try, so both close games, one low scoring, the other high.

He was in the team when we lost to Newcastle but I put that loss down to the ref screwing us.

He wasn't in the squad in our 50-18 thrashing of the Cowboys, but DCE & Jake were.

He was out for our 30-16 loss to Canberra but so were DCE & Jake.

We can win without Turbo alone but we struggle when he &/or DCE &/or Jake are out. Schuster can be added to this list too.

 

[Kevinward777]

I don't think its simply a case of "no Turbo, no win" any more.

He wasn't in the team in our one point win over the Warriors but was in the squad in our 38-32 win over them, which was a difference only of a converted try, so both close games, one low scoring, the other high.

He was in the team when we lost to Newcastle but I put that loss down to the ref screwing us.

He wasn't in the squad in our 50-18 thrashing of the Cowboys, but DCE & Jake were.

He was out for our 30-16 loss to Canberra but so were DCE & Jake.

We can win without Turbo alone but we struggle when he &/or DCE &/or Jake are out. Schuster can be added to this list too.

Thank you - just thanks.

 

[47MVEagle]

In fact, in the 30-16 loss to Canberra, we had:

NO TURBO
NO DCE
NO SCHUSTER
NO JAKE

Our 3 most senior 80 minute players & our X factor all missing meant the only leaders we had in that game were Foran & Marty (on field for 40-60 minutes only).

Canberra ground out a gutsy win over a very depleted Manly yet it was only a 14 point margin.

Not bad, we just lacked composure after being steamrolled by Canberra on the back of so much possession.

 

[Ryan]

I don't think its simply a case of "no Turbo, no win" any more.

He wasn't in the team in our one point win over the Warriors but was in the squad in our 38-32 win over them, which was a difference only of a converted try, so both close games, one low scoring, the other high.

He was in the team when we lost to Newcastle but I put that loss down to the ref screwing us.

He wasn't in the squad in our 50-18 thrashing of the Cowboys, but DCE & Jake were.

He was out for our 30-16 loss to Canberra but so were DCE & Jake.

We can win without Turbo alone but we struggle when he &/or DCE &/or Jake are out. Schuster can be added to this list too.

I have no idea, in anyone's normal mindset or estimation, would you play Walker at halfback in a game Turbo was out. We have Cade Cust, Kieran Foran, Lachlan Croker who were specialist halves before Hasler turned them both into Hookers (heck, he even hinted at Foran being Hooker pre-season).

Why would you put a player, who's almost exponentially improved in the centres (and who plays a power game) on the wing, to facilitate Moses Suli, a player you've used in 10 minute bursts in the forwards in prior games?

I'm still miffed to the reason Ben Trbojevic has been dropped. His enthusiasm and mindset is infectious.

Lastly, since the start of 2019, Manly have won 10 games from 34 attempts without Tom Trbojevic in the team. Don't lambast me for stating a fact, the numbers are the numbers. of those 34 games, 33 of them we had DCE playing. Not sure how your argument fares against @Woodsie 's opinion, as the results sway heavily in his favour.

 

[Pete W]

4 from 8 gets us top 6.
5 from 8 probably locks up 5th
Like you say its all about keeping fresh and peaking come September. I like that Jake has had a long rest, he needed it and will come back ready to go. Schuster had a nice break too and in his first full season probably needed a break. Turbo still relatively fresh even though he's been in origin. I'm confident we can do some damage in the finals from outside the top 4

Agreed. But I think your numbers are a little optimistic. Roosters unlikely to drop 4 games, so unless we win at least 6, we won't finish 5th. Also, if we drop 4, huge chance we actually slip to 7th or 8th. In all likelihood, we would need to win a minimum of 5 of the last 8 games to lock in top 6. Turbo and Des can take it from there...

 

[Kevinward777]

The Wobbegongs are circling the raft again — baring their gums in such toothless alignment.

• The Des mockery (he's the worlds greatest coach.)
• We can't win without Tom.
• Des can't pick the right side.
• Turbo screwed us all by playing SOO.
• Walker is sh1t.
• Injuries were responsible for turning our season around.
• The team has an attitude problem.

Tomorrow night can't come quickly enough. I'm feeling much more confident now.

 

[47MVEagle]

I have no idea, in anyone's normal mindset or estimation, would you play Walker at halfback in a game Turbo was out. We have Cade Cust, Kieran Foran, Lachlan Croker who were specialist halves before Hasler turned them both into Hookers (heck, he even hinted at Foran being Hooker pre-season).

Why would you put a player, who's almost exponentially improved in the centres (and who plays a power game) on the wing, to facilitate Moses Suli, a player you've used in 10 minute bursts in the forwards in prior games?

I'm still miffed to the reason Ben Trbojevic has been dropped. His enthusiasm and mindset is infectious.

Lastly, since the start of 2019, Manly have won 10 games from 34 attempts without Tom Trbojevic in the team. Don't lambast me for stating a fact, the numbers are the numbers. of those 34 games, 33 of them we had DCE playing. Not sure how your argument fares against @Woodsie 's opinion, as the results sway heavily in his favour.

Geez you're a whinger.

I get it, all your dislikes are to get my attention to let me know you're displeased with me liking someone else's post you considered "bullying".

Stop being such a sook & I'll debate with you, continue acting like a petulant child & hiding behind your hackneyed "play the ball not the man" mantra & passively aggressively using team selection discussions as a front for having a go & this will be the last reply you receive from me.

In short, grow up & stop being so sensitive.

Cheers.

 

[Ryan]

The Wobbegongs are circling the raft again — baring their gums in such toothless alignment.

• The Des mockery (he's the worlds greatest coach.)
• We can't win without Tom.
• Des can't pick the right side.
• Turbo screwed us all by playing SOO.
• Walker is sh1t.
• Injuries were responsible for turning our season around.
• The team has an attitude problem.

Tomorrow night can't come quickly enough. I'm feeling much more confident now.

• Des: Great, amazing, experienced coach, frustrating selections (Walker at halfback, Gosiewski over Burbo) - in my opinion
• Without Tom: 10 wins from 34 games from the start of 2019
• Des picking the side: My opinion - play players in their best positions (just me though)
• Turbo: If Latrell backs up, I'd like to see Tom. Manly is more important than NSW to me
• Walker is ****: My favorite player, so I disagree with most there too haha
• Injuries: They certainly gave youngsters opportunity who grabbed them with both arms !
• Attitude: I just think we need to play intense every week. I think we get complacent. We have the talent to beat anyone and everyone, I think that's the frustration.

 

[Ryan]

Geez you're a whinger.

I get it, all your dislikes are to get my attention to let me know you're displeased with me liking someone else's post you considered "bullying".

Stop being such a sook & I'll debate with you, continue acting like a petulant child & hiding behind your hackneyed "play the ball not the man" mantra & passively aggressively using team selection discussions as a front for having a go & this will be the last reply you receive from me.

In short, grow up & stop being so sensitive.

Cheers.

I don't see one thing about the team or players there. All I saw was complete and utter diahrer. Try hard to focus on the club, not me, your obsession with forum posters is cumbersome at best ! There's a little clique of you (most of us see who that is), that consistently play the man, and it's boring as ****.

I won't debate me (or other forum members you dribble on about). I'm happy to debate players, club, membership, anything. If your post relates to me, or another forum member like you do, you can basically float away all I care.

I answered your prior post with stats. I'm sorry it proved your point wrong.

 

[Waz13]

Agree re the mindset area. This team needs to learn to win without tom so all other 16 players (maybe not DCE and Schuster) can learn to push the attack without relying on Tom.

If we don't win this way and our players don't bring the right mindset to create points, come finals time the top teams will have one area to defend: shut down Tom.

Teams are already game planning to shut him down and imo this is a big part of what’s creating so much opportunities for others. Tom is a freak no question but what’s just as important is what the attention on him has created opportunity wise for others. We were really down last Thursday v Raiders and I’m hoping/expecting more of a nth Qld game like performance tomorrow night. The big test for mine will be Melb in a few weeks. That will tell us where we are really at. And I don’t doubt Bellamy snd co will already have game planned a strategy against Turbo. Interested to see what that looks like as Tom is such a threat in so many ways now, either side, through the middle, from dummy half, one off the ruck. He stays fit and we will go deep into the finals.

 

[Kevinward777]

• Des: Great, amazing, experienced coach, frustrating selections (Walker at halfback, Gosiewski over Burbo) - in my opinion
• Without Tom: 10 wins from 34 games from the start of 2019
• Des picking the side: My opinion - play players in their best positions (just me though)
• Turbo: If Latrell backs up, I'd like to see Tom. Manly is more important than NSW to me
• Walker is ****: My favorite player, so I disagree with most there too haha
• Injuries: They certainly gave youngsters opportunity who grabbed them with both arms !
• Attitude: I just think we need to play intense every week. I think we get complacent. We have the talent to beat anyone and everyone, I think that's the frustration.

The way I see it is as follows.

• Des is a superb coach and he will get the side into the finals AGAIN this year.
• The side is building very nicely.
• We are going to lose games.
• We were well in the game during our last three losses.
• Des was always going to pick Haumole, Schuster, Harper and co at some point.
• Des was mocked for signing Lawton.
• Des has a long game plan going on.
• Look out if we get a full strength side together come finals time.
• I wouldn't be risking Tom two days after SOO in a game we should win.
• SOO is the pinnacle for 99% of footy players. Killer is the ONLY player I know of who thought otherwise, and his reasons were more anout lifestyle.
• Go Manly!

 

[Tragic Eagle]

Geez better get on the blower to Des and share your years of Premiership coaching know how asap Court. 🙄

How many games have you coached? How many Premiership rings? Whats your win percentage again.

FMD.........

Geez what's with the aggression? I don't think we will win without Turbo either.

 

[Ryan]

The way I see it is as follows.

• Des is a superb coach and he will get the side into the finals AGAIN this year.
• The side is building very nicely.
• We are going to lose games.
• We were well in the game during our last three losses.
• Des was always going to pick Haumole, Schuster, Harper and co at some point.
• Des was mocked for signing Lawton.
• Des has a long game plan going on.
• Look out if we get a full strength side together come finals time.
• I wouldn't be risking Tom two days after SOO in a game we should win.
• SOO is the pinnacle for 99% of footy players. Killer is the ONLY player I know of who thought otherwise, and his reasons were more anout lifestyle.
• Go Manly!

Agree with most of that mate.

Was a devastating day, the day Killer retired from the game. Was my favorite all time player usurping Beaver at number one, Gary Larson number two.

Egg on my face for a few of those things. Lawton for example. Injured. We have Croker (extended), Fainu at the club (who was also extended), and I didn't think of Lawton as a backrower.

Agree, full strength, we could become absolutely anything.

In regards to the games we lost, I thought attitude and positional selections were the reasons we lost them. We SHOULD have won like you said.

Des: Like any coach, people have differing opinions. I love Des, in all aspects. I don't like some of his team selections on a week to week basis at times. I don't think there's a more suited coach to us alive today.

Tom: He's young. He's missed a swathe of games over the last three years (should be capable). Statistically winning only 10 from 34 without him since the start of 2019 is very concerning. This is an important game, because the teams below us are creeping closer on the ladder. Given these results, not sure it's a "should win" arrangement. Hope you're right though.

 

[Tragic Eagle]

Agree ... his talent and abilities explain why we are so good with him in the side ... BUT ... they don't explain why 17 professional football players (some on big bucks) and the world's greatest Coach are so bog average shiitehouse when he is not in the team.

15 other clubs seem to be able to win games without Turbo in there team ...

Agree but why do we have such a low win rate when he is not playing?

 

[pjayz]

The way I see it is as follows.

• Des is a superb coach and he will get the side into the finals AGAIN this year.
• The side is building very nicely.
• We are going to lose games.
• We were well in the game during our last three losses.
• Des was always going to pick Haumole, Schuster, Harper and co at some point.
• Des was mocked for signing Lawton.
• Des has a long game plan going on.
• Look out if we get a full strength side together come finals time.
• I wouldn't be risking Tom two days after SOO in a game we should win.
• SOO is the pinnacle for 99% of footy players. Killer is the ONLY player I know of who thought otherwise, and his reasons were more anout lifestyle.
• Go Manly!

I agree with all of that; however, I am interested to know: do you think Des has made any poor/incorrect selection decisions at any point this year?

 

[davohan123]

Toffs shoulder looks ok to me

 

[Kevinward777]

I agree with all of that; however, I am interested to know: do you think Des has made any poor/incorrect selection decisions at any point this year?

Of course he has. Every coach does.

 

[Ryan]

If Turbo is out guys, I'd move Harper to fullback (he was amazing there in a very beaten team in the trial against the Tigers - especially defensively).

01. Morgan Harper
02. Jason Saab
03. Dylan Walker
04. Brad Parker
05. Reuben Garrick
06. Kieran Foran
07. Daly Cherry-Evans
08. Marty Taupau
09. Karl Lawton
10. Taniela Paseka
11. Haumole Olakau'atu
12. Sean Keppie
13. Josh Schuster

14. Lachlan Croker
15. Toafofoa Sipley
16. XXXXXXXXX
17. Ben Trbojevic

would be my team - the 16 could be whoever.