Manly in Crisis (a mega thread)

[Frogz]

To say that our once Premiership winning owner 2011 Mr Penn has never shown any leadership is way off the mark

To say he needs to step up to our legendary clubs great standards once again is on the mark

Yes and didnt it all turn to sh!t after that day.

 

[mave]

We have our relationship with Blacktown, and zero NRLW side, as a cost saving measure for our owner, who has made gazillions off us, as has been pointed out hundreds of times.

Until Scotty starts spending some of those $$, we will stay where we are.

 

[Chip and Chase]

If you go to the search forums function at the top and type in "crisis" you'll find plenty of threads over the years. Since the NE days we have thrived on crises, seems like it goes with the Penn territory.

It took us a while to rebuild after NE, but the reason we were successful on the field for a decade or more despite all the off field drama was that we had mentally tough leaders on the field. We don't have that anymore. We have one player that came from that era and still has that attitude, that's Foran and he is going. There's a leadership vacuum on the field that needs to get filled, otherwise we aren't going anywhere next year no matter how well Tommy plays.

 

[Frogz]

To say that our once Premiership winning owner 2011 Mr Penn has never shown any leadership is way off the mark

To say he needs to step up to our legendary clubs great standards once again is on the mark

and only had 40% until 2014 and how has that gone also

 

[ricardo]

Going from competing for a finals spot to looking like a reserve grade side in a matter of weeks, it is clear there is an element white-anting the team.

Identifying this and cutting it out of the team will go a long way towards making the team a success again.

The nucleus of a great team is there. A prop and a 9 would pretty much complete the picture.

 

[SeaEagleRock8]

A lot of people pointing the finger at the owner. Seems you are disputing the basis of private ownership? As Bozo so often reminds us, if Penn is clever enough to make profits by selling the leagues club then that just shows he is a canny businessman doing what he should.
And since when do we tell owners of anything they must sell? Or must spend more on the upkeep or development of their property? Crikey next minute you'll be demanding landlords spend money on insulation and removing mould in their rental properties!

 

[BOZO]

Going from competing for a finals spot to looking like a reserve grade side in a matter of weeks, it is clear there is an element white-anting the team.

Identifying this and cutting it out of the team will go a long way towards making the team a success again.

The nucleus of a great team is there. A prop and a 9 would pretty much complete the picture.

Going from a competing finals spot Perspective time .....

The fact is even with Tom in the first 7 rounds we could not beat a top 8 teams

We have not beaten a top 8 team all year

So how can you be a finals top 8 competitor when you have no been able to compete with any top 8 team all year

We were even called flat track bullies for good reason

 

[bob dylan]

We must be more active in recruiting players, and the best chance of getting big names at the club is while we have Tommy, Jake and DCE, as well as Des for that matter.

The Fainu saga has been the biggest disaster and one i think should of been handled differently. The first mistake here was listening to lawyers and QC's who are getting paid to defend - they are never going to tell they are going to lose the case. Its a bit like asking a footy coach before a match "do you think your team will win". Fact is once in the court system the case is at best 50-50.

Second mistake was worrying about his siblings playing futures. Forget them, they have never played first grade and have no Manly blood. Has the club learned nothing from the Hopoate clan.

Anyway not much point rehashing our bad decisions of the past.

The appointment of Mestrov is interesting. Dont expect VLandys type leadership. This guys was given the top Dog job after the idiots in the government axed the sport. It only had one direction it could go, and that was up. He also had a fantastic product to sell, greyhound racing which returns results in around 30 seconds. That said I think he exceeded all expectations.

If this ship isnt turned around in 18 months we will join the Tigers, Knights, Bulldogs and Titans as locked in at the bottom of the table with no light at the end of the tunnel.

 

[Terry Zarsoff]

A lot of people pointing the finger at the owner. Seems you are disputing the basis of private ownership? As Bozo so often reminds us, if Penn is clever enough to make profits by selling the leagues club then that just shows he is a canny businessman doing what he should.
And since when do we tell owners of anything they must sell? Or must spend more on the upkeep or development of their property? Crikey next minute you'll be demanding landlords spend money on insulation and removing mould in their rental properties!

You cast into doubt your whole point with that last sentence. What is your point?

 

[Maxim]

There are Clubs like the West Tigers that have failed to make the right changes and progress

Clubs like the West Tigers have had the same leaders all this time

And all this time those leaders have failed their club because they did not become the change their club needed to become a success .

A quote from the 44th President of United States of America
CHANGE WILL NOT COME IF WE WAIT FOR SOME OTHER PERSON OR SOME OTHER TIME
WE ARE THE ONES THAT WE HAVE BEEN WAITING FOR
WE ARE THE CHANGE THAT WE SEEK
End quote

Mr Penn you are the change that we seek and the great change that we need
Accountability, Direction and Inspiration starts at the top
We look forward to your leadership in 2023

el presidente #44 isn't exactly a good example of promising change and then actually getting it done...

 

[Terry Zarsoff]

Its been one tough old year to watch the team and its years like this that really show who the true fans are. To be frank its been a bludger of a season!

I went to Brookvale yesterday and it was a sobering day to see the state of the club in that we had 3 games to watch and after watching it you do question, Where the hell are we heading?

I will preface this post by stating that I am not interested in attacking individual players or officials. I want to give an opinion of what I have observed since our last great era ended at the end of 2014.

Yesterday had a touch of sentimentality to it as we said good bye to a host of players leaving the club at the end of the season.

I want to say that Kieran Foran in my eyes has redeemed himself after his unpleasant departure in 2015 and I wish him all the best in his new gig with the Titans. Marty has been a brave player for many years and maybe a change of club will revitalize him and Dylan did well off the bench over the last 2 seasons and improved. Jorge served Manly well over many years and the sad thing is we never saw the best of Andrew Davey who was injured for 2/3 of his time here.

The performances we saw yesterday were a contrast.

The Jersey Flegg boys played a great game and thumped the 4th placed Sharks, scoring 50 points in you dont mind. I always look for potential at this level and I saw some stand out performances and hopefully the club will retain as many of these quality kids.

Watching the Blacktown side is agony. It is evident that something is seriously wrong there as for them to record only 2 wins this season, be a distant last and concede up to 35 points a game is telling. Yesterday predictably the top team in Newtown put 50 on them. I context this by understanding that because our first grade is decimated with injury it has severely impacted this team. I believe that the Blacktown experience has run its course and that Manly must take over its reserve grade side as we cannot afford to have performances like this year and pretty much every year since we started our joint venture with them. The frightening thing for me is the Jersey Flegg boys who step up to the next level will be playing there and I have seen TOO many youngsters go there and end up leaving the system. I do understand that Blacktown was all about giving western Sydney juniors a chance to play for a club that is local and in our system. The club has to face facts that it is just NOT working!

The first grade is totally busted at the moment. Shorn of half the team basically and vital players out injured. This season never really got going and became terminal once Tommy was ruled out for the season. I thought the team coped quite well for about 6 weeks after that and put in some decent perfomances.

What is evident is that since the fiasco over the pride jumper our team has not looked close to winning a game! Its a sad reality because after the Newcastle game we were in the 8 and doing well. We faced Saints and covid hit us and then the jersey fiasco and subsequent boycott totally derailed the season.

I think it needs to be discussed, where the hell are we going?

Its obvious that we are not going to get any government money anytime soon to give Brooky the facelift it needs and I believe we will come under increasing pressure to take games to the new SFS over the upcoming years.

I admire the investment that the Penn family have put into the club and without them we would not have a club that needs to be acknowledged. What is also very evident is that we have been a dysfunctional basket case with a revolving door of CEOS and an owner who spends a lot of time living overseas. The club has been run on a shoe string budget and you can see how limited we are right now when it comes to our marketing and overall professionalism.

What we need in my opinion is a more hands on owner. Some investment in basic things like improving the customer service and communication to the members and fans. What was a red flag for me was the recent jersey fiasco where the playing group was not consulted and its caused such a rift that the team has barely functioned ever since. Every often we dont hear enough about things the club is doing. To get information about injured players for example is so difficult at times.

We also need to address our salary cap. Right now it is so unbalanced that we have 3 major players getting a combined third of it and it leaves us with little wriggle room for the squad.

I understood why the club kept the door open for Manase Fainu in the hope that he would beat the charge and be free to play and that also he has two outstanding younger siblings who will be a part of the future. The club took a gamble on this and its blown up in our faces. For 3 years we have not had a proper hooker and Lachlan Croker has worked miracles in a role that was not familiar to him. We need 2 x hookers if we are going to challenge for honours. Every top team at the moment has this.

I think there will be a big rethink about where we going on all levels at the club. I just hope that the decisions made are for what is best for the club.

The lessons learned from Where we are? and where we are heading? are vital for our future.

One thing I know, Manly have a capacity to hit back and defy everyone. We need to be real and this can happen.

Lets forget 2022, it was just not meant to be and focus on what we need to do to once again become a force in the game!

Great post Serreight but I’m not sure that we should be thanking the Penns for anything. Mum and dad apparently wanted to get out a couple of years ago, but sonny wanted to hang on. The club has been on an inexorable slide, with a few upticks, ever since they bought out the other ownership bloc. As someone else reminded us, a fish rots from the head.

As for being pressured to move elsewhere, the new Allianz Stadium already has a full dance card, with or without Souths moving back there. The onus is on the club and Council to work on Brookvale’s ‘rough edges’, before any federal or state funding boost comes along.

Plus whilst ever V’Landys is on the scene, the focus will be on the suburban ground experience, before any attempt at forcing all Sydney-based clubs to play out of two or three stadiums.

 

[Terry Zarsoff]

el presidente #44 isn't exactly a good example of promising change and then actually getting it done...

Bids fair to be their most disastrous president of the last century. And that’s being generous.

 

[SeaEagleRock8]

You cast into doubt your whole point with that last sentence. What is your point?

Just a reference to the fact that if you don't have a 'good owner' it can be bad for your health, and that applies if you're a football club just as if you were a tenant with a slack landlord.

 

[The '47ers]

 

[The Who]

A few years ago I thought the club was heading in a sensible direction. It had established a link to the South Island of NZ and the Crusaders RU team, the most successful team in that country. It would have guaranteed us a good pathway to NZ talent, plus developed a new supporter base. We could have played at least two matches per season in Christchurch, instead of giving the Broncos our home games (although I am a fan of the yearly match at Mudgee).
So, what happened? Was it too costly?
For me, this initiative would have stolen a march on all the other Australian clubs. Yet we end up with Blacktown, and the embarrassment of two consecutive wooden spoons.
People may wonder why I am calling on the Penns to sell up and let someone else with greater vision have a crack at regaining our greatness. The folly of abandoning the NZ link is just one example of flawed leadership.

 

[47MVEagle]

Second mistake was worrying about his siblings playing futures. Forget them, they have never played first grade and have no Manly blood. Has the club learned nothing from the Hopoate clan.

I think this has the potential to be a major thorn in Manly's side for several years to come.

Bear in mind also that the club wasn't just trying to keep the Fainu family happy, they were trying to keep all of Fainu's friends in the team (Saab, Aloiai, Olakau'atu, etc.) happy too, by standing by Fainu all throughout the past 3 years, many of whom seem to be managed by the same agent (Tartak).

The very same group that @Budgewoi Eagle referred to as the "power block" in her Deep Deep Doo Doo thread (which I initially read as "Derp derp de derp" lol).

The club has put themselves in a position where they're vulnerable to power plays by this block should they ever decide to abuse their power.

Who's to say the 2 younger Fainu brothers don't jump ship at the first offer of big money from another club once they've made their mark in first grade with us? We're not guaranteed their loyalty simply because we kept Manase on the books for 3 years.

 

[47MVEagle]

A few years ago I thought the club was heading in a sensible direction. It had established a link to the South Island of NZ and the Crusaders RU team, the most successful team in that country. It would have guaranteed us a good pathway to NZ talent, plus developed a new supporter base. We could have played at least two matches per season in Christchurch, instead of giving the Broncos our home games (although I am a fan of the yearly match at Mudgee).
So, what happened? Was it too costly?
For me, this initiative would have stolen a march on all the other Australian clubs. Yet we end up with Blacktown, and the embarrassment of two consecutive wooden spoons.
People may wonder why I am calling on the Penns to sell up and let someone else with greater vision have a crack at regaining our greatness. The folly of abandoning the NZ link is just one example of flawed leadership.

I think COVID might have killed the CHC opportunity, unfortunately.

 

[Woodsie]

A few years ago I thought the club was heading in a sensible direction. It had established a link to the South Island of NZ and the Crusaders RU team, the most successful team in that country. It would have guaranteed us a good pathway to NZ talent, plus developed a new supporter base. We could have played at least two matches per season in Christchurch, instead of giving the Broncos our home games (although I am a fan of the yearly match at Mudgee).
So, what happened? Was it too costly?
For me, this initiative would have stolen a march on all the other Australian clubs. Yet we end up with Blacktown, and the embarrassment of two consecutive wooden spoons.
People may wonder why I am calling on the Penns to sell up and let someone else with greater vision have a crack at regaining our greatness. The folly of abandoning the NZ link is just one example of flawed leadership.

Mate ... Penn won't sell as long as he has dreams of owning the New York franchise for the USA comp ... as long as that is on the table ... Penn will have dollar signs in the eyeballs ...

Also why he has suddenly become inclusive ...

 

[Darknstormy]

Who will make it from our nursery

Hoppa- didn’t live up to hype..maybe a late bloomer

Koula- hasn’t had a stand out 1st yr but solid

Schuster- hasn’t lived up to the hype has the skills though

Olakauatu- big and talented still learning his craft

S Fainu- ??? Went to tigers and hasn’t been seen

Felody- ??? Went to tigers

Fafita- ??? Dont hear anything

Tuitavake-??? Is he injured

Weekes- kills it in jersey f but will he ever get a run in 1st grade under des

Trbojevic- he is very average

Humphreys- we will lose him cause of dce extension

Gordo T- goes well in jersey f but will he live up to the hype and will des give him a chance

Sykes- is he any good?

Fulton- does he have what it takes

The 2 remaining Fainus- both sound like guns but who knows where they will end up

We also lost the young half to the knights I can’t think of his name

Is there anyone I’m missing and how does our potential line up against other mainly top 5 sides..Gus was saying our nursery ain’t great

 

[Ron E. Gibbs]

Where are we heading? Pretty sure it's in the opposite direction to "up".