madmax
Bencher
Mate I disagree with you on a lot of things but this time I'm up there with you mate!!!!!!
Manly in Crisis (a mega thread)
- Thread starter Chip and Chase
- Start date
madmax
Bencher
As much as we should appreciate how much money the Penn's have invested into the club, I still believe we would be a much more powerful club if they just sold out to another party. The Penn's are holding us back.....we need fresh owners with vision, something the Penn's obviously don't have. Our squad this year IS / WAS a top 8 squad even with the loss of Trbo. WTF has transpired to go from top 4 to bottom 4 yet the squad, i believe, is stronger than last season with the addition of Koula, Tuipulotu etc. As much as we think Des is making wrong calls on team selections I believe there's more to it & management has a lot to answer for? For a while the club was humming with Humphries in charge....bringing in many sponsors & heading upwards. Team morale seemed great. For whatever reason Humphries left i kinda feel it's when the club started to spiral downwards. I don't believe that the Schuster management demands, the Des contract crap, the $hit with the rainbow jersey etc. which has divided the players, club & supporters, would have been front page news under his watch. Club management / owners completely fu<ked up the whole Pride jersey fiasco & then threw Des & DCE under the bus! I sincerely hope Tony Mestrov can nip this $hit in the bud & get us back on track. As for our Islander boys.....none of them have done anything untoward apart from support their mate Manase & sticking to their beliefs whether we agree with them or not. I would hope my mates would support me if i was charged & found guilty of a crime. None of us are privy to the truth & if Manase did commit the crime then he will have to do the time.....the boys are still allowed to be his mates & give him support as much as it pi$$es people off. This gangster sign crap is not just at Manly...it's rife thru every NRL team. It's just that focus is now on Manly & there for all to bag us about. I'll bet my balls there are plenty of Islander boys throughout the NRL supporting Manase & wishing him well & offering so called gangster signs discreetly. Anyway just my opinion!
Michael Clare
Reserve Grader
I am feeling ashamed for Des. Club culture is right down there with Newcastle's ... and we can all see where they're at presently!
Also, some people need to learn how to use the 'Karen' meme.
The '47ers
Your resident two-headed Queenslander
Should be a bargain after Liverpool put 6 on them come next Tuesday!
SeaEagle007
Reserve Grader
AMEN brother
Hold on, I did it in my head ... didn't know I would be checked haha
There are possible variable with what constitutes the available pool ... but I am supposing they would want known players not unknown reggies
So, From a starting pool of say the regular 17 .. 3 were unavailable due to Covid ISO .. Crocker, Jake, and Davey ... leaving a possible pool of 14 players ..
in that 14, I had 4 vanilla's available in DCE, Foran, Keppie and Garrick .... and 10 Polynesian or Kiwi unknowns in Saab, Haumole, Alaoai, Schuster, Sipley, Koula, Tuipaloopa, Harper, Kapow, Walker ..
so to get 3 vanilla's ... the first random pick is a chance of 4/14 ... next random pick is at 3/13 .. and final pick would be at 2/12 ... this would result in 24/2184 .. which simplfies to 1/91
As I said ... almost mathematically impossible to get ... at random ..
Brooke
Bencher
What makes you say that?
double hoops
First Grader
sheridanstand78
First Grader
Its been one tough old year to watch the team and its years like this that really show who the true fans are. To be frank its been a bludger of a season!
I went to Brookvale yesterday and it was a sobering day to see the state of the club in that we had 3 games to watch and after watching it you do question, Where the hell are we heading?
I will preface this post by stating that I am not interested in attacking individual players or officials. I want to give an opinion of what I have observed since our last great era ended at the end of 2014.
Yesterday had a touch of sentimentality to it as we said good bye to a host of players leaving the club at the end of the season.
I want to say that Kieran Foran in my eyes has redeemed himself after his unpleasant departure in 2015 and I wish him all the best in his new gig with the Titans. Marty has been a brave player for many years and maybe a change of club will revitalize him and Dylan did well off the bench over the last 2 seasons and improved. Jorge served Manly well over many years and the sad thing is we never saw the best of Andrew Davey who was injured for 2/3 of his time here.
The performances we saw yesterday were a contrast.
The Jersey Flegg boys played a great game and thumped the 4th placed Sharks, scoring 50 points in you dont mind. I always look for potential at this level and I saw some stand out performances and hopefully the club will retain as many of these quality kids.
Watching the Blacktown side is agony. It is evident that something is seriously wrong there as for them to record only 2 wins this season, be a distant last and concede up to 35 points a game is telling. Yesterday predictably the top team in Newtown put 50 on them. I context this by understanding that because our first grade is decimated with injury it has severely impacted this team. I believe that the Blacktown experience has run its course and that Manly must take over its reserve grade side as we cannot afford to have performances like this year and pretty much every year since we started our joint venture with them. The frightening thing for me is the Jersey Flegg boys who step up to the next level will be playing there and I have seen TOO many youngsters go there and end up leaving the system. I do understand that Blacktown was all about giving western Sydney juniors a chance to play for a club that is local and in our system. The club has to face facts that it is just NOT working!
The first grade is totally busted at the moment. Shorn of half the team basically and vital players out injured. This season never really got going and became terminal once Tommy was ruled out for the season. I thought the team coped quite well for about 6 weeks after that and put in some decent perfomances.
What is evident is that since the fiasco over the pride jumper our team has not looked close to winning a game! Its a sad reality because after the Newcastle game we were in the 8 and doing well. We faced Saints and covid hit us and then the jersey fiasco and subsequent boycott totally derailed the season.
I think it needs to be discussed, where the hell are we going?
Its obvious that we are not going to get any government money anytime soon to give Brooky the facelift it needs and I believe we will come under increasing pressure to take games to the new SFS over the upcoming years.
I admire the investment that the Penn family have put into the club and without them we would not have a club that needs to be acknowledged. What is also very evident is that we have been a dysfunctional basket case with a revolving door of CEOS and an owner who spends a lot of time living overseas. The club has been run on a shoe string budget and you can see how limited we are right now when it comes to our marketing and overall professionalism.
What we need in my opinion is a more hands on owner. Some investment in basic things like improving the customer service and communication to the members and fans. What was a red flag for me was the recent jersey fiasco where the playing group was not consulted and its caused such a rift that the team has barely functioned ever since. Every often we dont hear enough about things the club is doing. To get information about injured players for example is so difficult at times.
We also need to address our salary cap. Right now it is so unbalanced that we have 3 major players getting a combined third of it and it leaves us with little wriggle room for the squad.
I understood why the club kept the door open for Manase Fainu in the hope that he would beat the charge and be free to play and that also he has two outstanding younger siblings who will be a part of the future. The club took a gamble on this and its blown up in our faces. For 3 years we have not had a proper hooker and Lachlan Croker has worked miracles in a role that was not familiar to him. We need 2 x hookers if we are going to challenge for honours. Every top team at the moment has this.
I think there will be a big rethink about where we going on all levels at the club. I just hope that the decisions made are for what is best for the club.
The lessons learned from Where we are? and where we are heading? are vital for our future.
One thing I know, Manly have a capacity to hit back and defy everyone. We need to be real and this can happen.
Lets forget 2022, it was just not meant to be and focus on what we need to do to once again become a force in the game!
I went to Brookvale yesterday and it was a sobering day to see the state of the club in that we had 3 games to watch and after watching it you do question, Where the hell are we heading?
I will preface this post by stating that I am not interested in attacking individual players or officials. I want to give an opinion of what I have observed since our last great era ended at the end of 2014.
Yesterday had a touch of sentimentality to it as we said good bye to a host of players leaving the club at the end of the season.
I want to say that Kieran Foran in my eyes has redeemed himself after his unpleasant departure in 2015 and I wish him all the best in his new gig with the Titans. Marty has been a brave player for many years and maybe a change of club will revitalize him and Dylan did well off the bench over the last 2 seasons and improved. Jorge served Manly well over many years and the sad thing is we never saw the best of Andrew Davey who was injured for 2/3 of his time here.
The performances we saw yesterday were a contrast.
The Jersey Flegg boys played a great game and thumped the 4th placed Sharks, scoring 50 points in you dont mind. I always look for potential at this level and I saw some stand out performances and hopefully the club will retain as many of these quality kids.
Watching the Blacktown side is agony. It is evident that something is seriously wrong there as for them to record only 2 wins this season, be a distant last and concede up to 35 points a game is telling. Yesterday predictably the top team in Newtown put 50 on them. I context this by understanding that because our first grade is decimated with injury it has severely impacted this team. I believe that the Blacktown experience has run its course and that Manly must take over its reserve grade side as we cannot afford to have performances like this year and pretty much every year since we started our joint venture with them. The frightening thing for me is the Jersey Flegg boys who step up to the next level will be playing there and I have seen TOO many youngsters go there and end up leaving the system. I do understand that Blacktown was all about giving western Sydney juniors a chance to play for a club that is local and in our system. The club has to face facts that it is just NOT working!
The first grade is totally busted at the moment. Shorn of half the team basically and vital players out injured. This season never really got going and became terminal once Tommy was ruled out for the season. I thought the team coped quite well for about 6 weeks after that and put in some decent perfomances.
What is evident is that since the fiasco over the pride jumper our team has not looked close to winning a game! Its a sad reality because after the Newcastle game we were in the 8 and doing well. We faced Saints and covid hit us and then the jersey fiasco and subsequent boycott totally derailed the season.
I think it needs to be discussed, where the hell are we going?
Its obvious that we are not going to get any government money anytime soon to give Brooky the facelift it needs and I believe we will come under increasing pressure to take games to the new SFS over the upcoming years.
I admire the investment that the Penn family have put into the club and without them we would not have a club that needs to be acknowledged. What is also very evident is that we have been a dysfunctional basket case with a revolving door of CEOS and an owner who spends a lot of time living overseas. The club has been run on a shoe string budget and you can see how limited we are right now when it comes to our marketing and overall professionalism.
What we need in my opinion is a more hands on owner. Some investment in basic things like improving the customer service and communication to the members and fans. What was a red flag for me was the recent jersey fiasco where the playing group was not consulted and its caused such a rift that the team has barely functioned ever since. Every often we dont hear enough about things the club is doing. To get information about injured players for example is so difficult at times.
We also need to address our salary cap. Right now it is so unbalanced that we have 3 major players getting a combined third of it and it leaves us with little wriggle room for the squad.
I understood why the club kept the door open for Manase Fainu in the hope that he would beat the charge and be free to play and that also he has two outstanding younger siblings who will be a part of the future. The club took a gamble on this and its blown up in our faces. For 3 years we have not had a proper hooker and Lachlan Croker has worked miracles in a role that was not familiar to him. We need 2 x hookers if we are going to challenge for honours. Every top team at the moment has this.
I think there will be a big rethink about where we going on all levels at the club. I just hope that the decisions made are for what is best for the club.
The lessons learned from Where we are? and where we are heading? are vital for our future.
One thing I know, Manly have a capacity to hit back and defy everyone. We need to be real and this can happen.
Lets forget 2022, it was just not meant to be and focus on what we need to do to once again become a force in the game!
The Who
Journey Man
What an excellent summation.
I do question whether the club "has the capacity to hit back", unfortunately. I've lost hope, given that the current owners don't look like selling out.
I'm disillusioned and have no hope for the future of the club unless something drastic changes. And change must start from the top.
I do question whether the club "has the capacity to hit back", unfortunately. I've lost hope, given that the current owners don't look like selling out.
I'm disillusioned and have no hope for the future of the club unless something drastic changes. And change must start from the top.
There are Clubs like the West Tigers that have failed to make the right changes and progress
Clubs like the West Tigers have had the same leaders all this time
And all this time those leaders have failed their club because they did not become the change their club needed to become a success .
A quote from the 44th President of United States of America
CHANGE WILL NOT COME IF WE WAIT FOR SOME OTHER PERSON OR SOME OTHER TIME
WE ARE THE ONES THAT WE HAVE BEEN WAITING FOR
WE ARE THE CHANGE THAT WE SEEK
End quote
Mr Penn you are the change that we seek and the great change that we need
Accountability, Direction and Inspiration starts at the top
We look forward to your leadership in 2023
Clubs like the West Tigers have had the same leaders all this time
And all this time those leaders have failed their club because they did not become the change their club needed to become a success .
A quote from the 44th President of United States of America
CHANGE WILL NOT COME IF WE WAIT FOR SOME OTHER PERSON OR SOME OTHER TIME
WE ARE THE ONES THAT WE HAVE BEEN WAITING FOR
WE ARE THE CHANGE THAT WE SEEK
End quote
Mr Penn you are the change that we seek and the great change that we need
Accountability, Direction and Inspiration starts at the top
We look forward to your leadership in 2023
Rocky
Bencher
I read a lot of comment about Penn and the need for a more hands on owner.
What does a more hands on owner mean? That seems to me to mean he should be more involved in a decision making basis on a day to day basis.
Is that what we actually want? I'd prefer the owner to be less visible and hire the best qualified people to make the decisions for the club.
Or are we talking the same thing?
What does a more hands on owner mean? That seems to me to mean he should be more involved in a decision making basis on a day to day basis.
Is that what we actually want? I'd prefer the owner to be less visible and hire the best qualified people to make the decisions for the club.
Or are we talking the same thing?
Has never shown any leadership and never will. They just leave it all up to Des to cop it week in week out. Wish Hugh jackman, or someone, had the passion for the club like a Crowe does (I don't like crowe). We need a winner with passion leading the club from the top not a leachThere are Clubs like the West Tigers that have failed to make the right changes and progress
Clubs like the West Tigers have had the same leaders all this time
And all this time those leaders have failed their club because they did not become the change their club needed to become a success .
A quote from the 44th President of United States of America
CHANGE WILL NOT COME IF WE WAIT FOR SOME OTHER PERSON OR SOME OTHER TIME
WE ARE THE ONES THAT WE HAVE BEEN WAITING FOR
WE ARE THE CHANGE THAT WE SEEK
End quote
Mr Penn you are the change that we seek and the great change that we need
Accountability, Direction and Inspiration starts at the top
We look forward to your leadership in 2023
To say that our once Premiership winning owner 2011 Mr Penn has never shown any leadership is way off the mark
To say he needs to step up to our legendary clubs great standards once again is on the mark
Hugh is too nice. Winning clubs or companies have hard arsed bastard leaders who are ruthless in business deals with win at all cost attitudes. We used to have that with Arko, Bozo. Storm have it with Ponissi and Bellamy, Roosters have it with Politis and Robinson, Panthers and Rabbits have it, Sharks Fitzgibbon , Cows Payten, Broncos Ikin have improved either their business models or their coaching leadership. We have treaded water with a revolving door of CEOs who can't get along with the owners. No one is on the same page and the discipline from the top to the lower grades is appalling and evident in the results.
Ryan
Journey Man
Great post mate. I'd simplify it though , with we need leadership in any fashion. I know I'm biased because I'm involved with the family , but the non support of Ken , while the entire club was right there in QLD epitomises our culture right now.
That, and our new CEO hasn't thought it pertinent enough to address the playing group on either the jersey situation, OR the gangland stuff (Des even saying the NRL should have addressed it instead). Mestrov should have stepped right up here, and failed in my opinion.
Agree on Blacktown. Time to dissolve that relationship. Bring back Manly reserve grade, and if possible, bring in a women's team for us to support. I'd actually prefer watching them at present given the personalities we have in the men's team.
I do want to correct you about Penn saving the club. He acquired the leagues club and car park properties extremely cheap, then quickly sold them to foreign developers at astronomical profits. He's put in a mere fraction of the profits back into our club. Penn has rheemed us of assets , and profiteered from them BIG time mate. The only thing he could possibly whinge about is capital gains tax !! But agree, we need a more plugged in, more honest, more transparent owner.
Our playing group and recruitment is downright insipid. I'm struggling to have an affinity with any of them. Jake is easily lovable, but his contract is an albatross. Like I say, for the TEAM, if he'd take a haircut to 500k, but is rewarded with a 3 year extension on the same dollars, that would work out for all parties.
And DCE is done. He makes excuses. He doesn't take ownership. His performances are rubbish. Last night was an example of Schuster / DCE in the field at the same time. And it was ROUGH.
I've stated where I think we'll be next season unless huge changes occur , but I honestly don't see any of that happening.
That, and our new CEO hasn't thought it pertinent enough to address the playing group on either the jersey situation, OR the gangland stuff (Des even saying the NRL should have addressed it instead). Mestrov should have stepped right up here, and failed in my opinion.
Agree on Blacktown. Time to dissolve that relationship. Bring back Manly reserve grade, and if possible, bring in a women's team for us to support. I'd actually prefer watching them at present given the personalities we have in the men's team.
I do want to correct you about Penn saving the club. He acquired the leagues club and car park properties extremely cheap, then quickly sold them to foreign developers at astronomical profits. He's put in a mere fraction of the profits back into our club. Penn has rheemed us of assets , and profiteered from them BIG time mate. The only thing he could possibly whinge about is capital gains tax !! But agree, we need a more plugged in, more honest, more transparent owner.
Our playing group and recruitment is downright insipid. I'm struggling to have an affinity with any of them. Jake is easily lovable, but his contract is an albatross. Like I say, for the TEAM, if he'd take a haircut to 500k, but is rewarded with a 3 year extension on the same dollars, that would work out for all parties.
And DCE is done. He makes excuses. He doesn't take ownership. His performances are rubbish. Last night was an example of Schuster / DCE in the field at the same time. And it was ROUGH.
I've stated where I think we'll be next season unless huge changes occur , but I honestly don't see any of that happening.
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