So you give them no credit for their principled stance? They had no choice you say?
Happy Australia Day
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I think age plays a very big factor in your views as well , those 60 and above on here were brought up in a very different era , but is that right and what’s happening with how kids are raised today now wrong ???
I also believe that the kids of today , to a certain extent , are either brainwashed or very influenced by what their being taught or what they read on Tik Tok or Instagram , whereas most of my views come from life experiences.
I rarely try and engage someone who is 20 in an argument for that very reason.
It doesn’t make them wrong , but it also does make me wrong because I’m older either.
And really I mainly comment on issues where I have life experiences.
Issues at heart with me is certainly Australia Day / Indigenous affairs and of course religion.
I would almost never argue about politics as let’s face it , if you are a Leftie no amount of arguing with change that, and if you’re in the Clive Palmer / Pauline Hanson brigade then arguing is even worse.
All I ask is that we respect each others views , and appreciate that they could be different.
I also believe that the kids of today , to a certain extent , are either brainwashed or very influenced by what their being taught or what they read on Tik Tok or Instagram , whereas most of my views come from life experiences.
I rarely try and engage someone who is 20 in an argument for that very reason.
It doesn’t make them wrong , but it also does make me wrong because I’m older either.
And really I mainly comment on issues where I have life experiences.
Issues at heart with me is certainly Australia Day / Indigenous affairs and of course religion.
I would almost never argue about politics as let’s face it , if you are a Leftie no amount of arguing with change that, and if you’re in the Clive Palmer / Pauline Hanson brigade then arguing is even worse.
All I ask is that we respect each others views , and appreciate that they could be different.
Red Pill
Enthusiastic Amateur
As I said choice is not always binary. Say if at work someone said to you that in order keep your job you needed to cheat on your partner. ( yes not a likely circumstance) I think it would be reasonable for you to conclude that you had no reasonable choice…. But to quit your job… but saying you still had a choice is technically correct but not reasonable imo and I would suggest in most peoples minds as well…
Brookie Bob
"I come back to you now at the turn of the tide"
100 - 39.6 = 60.4
When I mentioned two studies suggesting 61%, I wasn't far off.
Haha you aren't in danger of being identified in either of those camps Mark.
However your passionate views as someone who has seen first hand life in indigenous communities does not entitle you to speak for them.
Nor, if they were to get their Voice, ought white men select who is going to represent their Voice to parliament.
(I note you said you didn't want 'radicals' well surely it would be up to them to decide what is radical and who they want to give them a voice?) 🙂
So do you say a choice is only a choice when it is a free choice, totally unemcumbered by any repercussions?
Red Pill
Enthusiastic Amateur
You do not seem to be allowing for degree.. it’s becoming a circular discussion
Brookie Bob
"I come back to you now at the turn of the tide"
Or to be more specific - the individuals (within a particular religion) who act in particularly bad ways.
I - like all of us - have to be careful not to get caught up in generalizations.
We're all guilty of doing it.
I.e. 'All Parra supporters are misguided fools.........' - I'm having a lot of trouble trying to renounce that one............
Unenlightened barbarians Brookie Bob, unenlightened barbarians!
But does that excuse you from answering my question?
(Which was, do you say a choice is only a choice when it is a free choice, totally unemcumbered by any repercussions?)
Anybody care to have a serious go at answering my previous question? In case it was missed I will repeat it.Question for @Red Pill et al
Why is Australia the only First-World nation with a colonial history that doesn't provide constitutional recognition for its First Nations people? Paraphrased from statement by Linda Burnley 2019
Fact Checked below
We fact checked Linda Burney's claim on constitutional recognition. Here's what we found
Opposition spokeswoman for Indigenous Australians Linda Burney says the Australian constitution is the only one among first world nations with colonial histories that does not recognise its first people. RMIT ABC Fact Check investigates.www.abc.net.au
Why is Australia the only First-World nation with a colonial history that doesn't provide constitutional recognition for its First Nations peoples?
Answers will come, but it's fair that the hardest questions need time to answer. Give em time to regroup and think.
Far better to wait and get an honest and respectful answer than a rushed flippant one?
I found this as a starting point. It's old but like I say, a starting point.... maybe.
Why doesn't Australia have an indigenous treaty?
Unlike other Commonwealth countries, the nation has never had a treaty with its indigenous peoples.
www.bbc.com
Red Pill
Enthusiastic Amateur
We clearly see this differently. I don’t see the utility in answering your question which you are framing from your perspective.. I think we just agree to disagree and move on. I don’t see an exchange of opinion as one person constantly having to answer the other’s questions like some legal examination of sorts
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Red Pill
Enthusiastic Amateur
Hey mate,
I believe I have responded to this.
I think if this question has serious utility in our group exchange of opinions it needs to be specifically framed at a poster who is of the opinion that under no circumstance whatsoever!!they would consider this as an option in some way … from I have read most of the debate is around the conditions they would need to have clarified or in place etc to accept this.
It does not appear fair to me that you are now directing this at everyone in this way. Please let me know if I am somehow misunderstanding the situation or your intent?
Also out of sheer interest I would like to understand the current US model in place?
Cheers RP..
Off course
There are some lovely aspects to religion that is ruined (like all things) by fundamentalism
I thought the article I posted was illuminating. Did you give it a read? Also, not sure the US approach is worth much given they broke most of them. It's my 2nd home so I'm hopefully not talking thru my bum.
Red Pill
Enthusiastic Amateur
No mate, so much info flying around. I will try to find it. Yeah I am not surprised about the US. that’s one of the reasons I asked, the other and main reason was the diversity of tribes and diverse representation required to make it work…as this would more closely relate to Australia then say NZ.
Therin lies the issue , who chooses.
The government??
Those who make the most noise ??
No I don’t have the right to speak for them, but I can comment on my life experiences which is probably more than many ( not all ) on here.
We all agree that we have to move forward , but as I’ve stated I really believe it has to start with themselves. The voice needs to be about “ how do we fix the issues “ not “ we own the land so pay is rent “ or “ we want reparations for you stealing our land “ or the like.
It has to start with the elders , they need to be granted tribal justice to deal with their internal issues.
It shouldn’t be about money.
It shouldn’t be about white fellas doing what they think is best.
If it’s just the radical loud noise people chosen , absolutely nothing will be achieved.
I think I’ve said enough now , I’ll make this my last post.
Its just a couple of posts up from this one.
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