Fainu and Suli

[Woodsie]

From my non-technical experience ... it often takes footballers up to 3-4 years of preseasons and playing to reach the level of fitness and endurance of 80 mins of first grade in the modern game ... especially in the role of hooker ....

It is no secret ... or world shattering observation that Fainu fatiques during fast games without stopages .... most ST's have said the same in many threads .... even an old Punchie like me opinined that it may have been one of the reasons for Dessie to try Walker going to 5/8 .. so that Crokr could be held back on the bench to cover for Fainu ....

At 20 yo Fainu make take another year or so to become fit enough to be called a genuine 80 min goer .... but until then he will do me ...

 

[susan]

There is a difference between "all night" and "throughout the night", Manly in the second half did not play all that lateral at all due to Melb's intensity, fatigue and going into our shell/overly playing percentages a little at times with less adventure while in the lead. Yes there are moments in the second half when Manly tried to do so but it wasn't at an "all night level"--- the first half was much better in that regard.(in saying that i don't expect the same amount of lateral play as an afternoon game on a dry track against a weaker opposition)

Most enterprising plays in the second half had errors, i recall 3-4, fatigue related execution errors for the most part with poor lines and timing.

Your comment about Fainu not making it to the ruck is not referencing my comments correctly, i am not suggesting Fainu make every play the ball especially in the early parts of the set but he struggles to get to marker often more than he should----and also during attacking positions.

Fainu does some really nice things around the ruck and some beautiful offloads, as i said i'm not all that fussed about his attack at such a young age, variety will come and what he does he does very well----it is the overall energy especially in defence after either prolonged play or high intensity workloads---he fatigues much too fast in such situations.

Many times i see forwards overtaking Fainu running back the 10mtrs in sets, Fainu has a steady gliding pace about his work i just want to see more energy and spark.

Sue referencing Fainu's past cramping issues as proof it is not fitness related is missing the point, whatever the underlying issue is it is impacting/reducing his performance.

Fainu has to remain on his toes through the middle covering for his fatiguing forwards, at 10:28 to go in the game (where i think Paseka ankle taps a Melb player running into a hole) you see Fainu switching off for a brief second for a rest then reacting too late to cover if the player got through.

In saying that the cover play in the final stages of the second half is a great effort to get to the ball when the tank is running on or nearing empty----Fainu has a motor but you have to have an intensity about your work mixed in also, unless you are Cam Smith and have the highest Football IQ at your disposal to offer.

Talk about rewriting history.Me referencing his ongoing cramping issues is exactly the point. Your knock on him has been lack of effort and intensity and general laziness. You have harped in about it for months. That’s what I was addressing.

If the issues with his mobility and intensity actually exist as you see them ( I don’t by the way) then they are down to his calf problem. They are NOT down to laziness, lack of effort and lack of fitness as you have bandied around ad nauseum. Des doesn’t do players who aren’t fit or don’t do the one percenters.Its his trademark. You don’t meet his standard then you are mucking out the bogs or having a week off.Ask Moses Suli.

It is a totally different thing to criticise a player for not putting in like you have on numerous occasions than to observe he is struggling with pain and not playing to potential .I played 6 years of footy at grade level in Brisbane, was super fit yet struggled badly with prematch calf and shin soreness and it was a nightmare. I can just imagine what it must be like suffering it at elite level and playing 80 minutes.

All I can say he will be one helluva player if he can shake the calf problem because he is going pretty damn well with it. And many knowledgeable people , including your idol Bellamy have noted that very fact.

As a few other posters have suggested you obviously know and enjoy your football and having an opinion is fine and yours is often informative.... it’s your condescending and superior delivery of said opinion that grates on everyone. Leave that rubbish out and I’d enjoy reading your stuff. It’s not that hard.

 

[QueefRichards]

Fainu has room to improve. A scary prospect for other teams indeed.

 

[Technical Coach]

I posted that as a joke mate.
That after 2 days you feel the need to explain why the punctuation mark was missing reveals a LOT about the way you deem yourself.
Maybe if you would be a tad more relaxed presenting your opinions if you didn't take yourself so seriously and the "against the grain" opinions may have a better reception.

By the way; what are the 3 hyphens (---)for and did you forget the comma after "Ok" and the full stop after "something to do" in the post you didn't completely delete, or only in your response here?

Chill out buddy and you will enjoy your time here more. Cheers.

1. Not on the site daily to reward you with an instant reply.

2. You are so far off my radar a delayed reply is to be expected.

3. “Grammar” based predictable sense of humour/comeback style is synonymous with the lacking content types.(Never proclaimed I am perfect with my grammar, I am in game and performance analysis over several sports lol so correct me or offer a counter response in this area to be a productive contributor)

4.Following in the boring footsteps of others in this regard tells me you have a “blender” personality who tends to fall to the levels of humour at the expense of others to fit in. (fine when responding to a direct attack but in this instance we had a boring contributor add his pointless two cents worth and a lazy third man in to pad his stats up)

5. The topics I instigate/bring up are all footy related and in line with what this site is all about unlike others who take potshots because they really have nothing worthy to add. (My potshots will be a response to an instigator)

6. You must be desperate to fit in spotting the “ok” error, i'm fine with the so called cheeky “technical” responses to my grammar failings given my nick but you are clutching at straws on the “ok” error to make a new friend it appears.(this is why I responded)

7. People here need to develop a more broad sense of humour, some here take my serious technical responses to heart sometimes, I will compliment and bring to attention the weaknesses of any player be it a young up and coming star or an established one, I'm not a fanboy.

8. “Delusions of grandeur” will be my new nick if that helps people add me to their block list.

9. I also get annoyed when people use "to" instead of "too" and "loose" instead of "lose" but i don't see the point of bringing it up and maybe embarrassing the individual, what matters more to me is that the response is interesting/informative.

OK then I have 10mins for selfies next…..

 

[Technical Coach]

Talk about rewriting history.Me referencing his ongoing cramping issues is exactly the point. Your knock on him has been lack of effort and intensity and general laziness. You have harped in about it for months. That’s what I was addressing.

If the issues with his mobility and intensity actually exist as you see them ( I don’t by the way) then they are down to his calf problem. They are NOT down to laziness, lack of effort and lack of fitness as you have bandied around ad nauseum. Des doesn’t do players who aren’t fit or don’t do the one percenters.Its his trademark. You don’t meet his standard then you are mucking out the bogs or having a week off.Ask Moses Suli.

It is a totally different thing to criticise a player for not putting in like you have on numerous occasions than to observe he is struggling with pain and not playing to potential .I played 6 years of footy at grade level in Brisbane, was super fit yet struggled badly with prematch calf and shin soreness and it was a nightmare. I can just imagine what it must be like suffering it at elite level and playing 80 minutes.

All I can say he will be one helluva player if he can shake the calf problem because he is going pretty damn well with it. And many knowledgeable people , including your idol Bellamy have noted that very fact.

As a few other posters have suggested you obviously know and enjoy your football and having an opinion is fine and yours is often informative.... it’s your condescending and superior delivery of said opinion that grates on everyone. Leave that rubbish out and I’d enjoy reading your stuff. It’s not that hard.

It is not his fitness it is the intensity and overall energy in defence i have issues with (i've mentioned this a million times Sue) Yes it can be classified as "fitness" related maybe he needs more high intensity training but it is not fitness in the sense of racking up big km's in a game, i'm sure he has a motor, well he should at the steady pace he works at. (I'm sure Fainu has a good GPS reading Km wise, that is not the point or issue here)

If he has cramping issues so be it, means nothing to me, i'm addressing and analyzing his performance levels, if the cramping is a limiting factor the club has a few options, work with him either fitness or stretching wise to fix the issue, seek medical advice, or if it will be an ongoing issue i would be letting him go, why pay big money for a weakness that will continuously be a limiting factor ---or see Fainu as a quality 40min option and his pay grade represents that.

 

[Technical Coach]

Before the Storm game, Fox commentators reported that Fainu suffered severe calf cramp twice during the warm up and required up to an hour's massage to be able to take the field. From his facial expressions, it seemed he was under physical duress for much of the game.

Not sure what this adds to the discussion, it just gives reasons that could impact performance.

 

[manlyfan76]

@Technical Coach with Api's being injured so much (this year and last few) and Fainu not up-to your standard what cheap dummy half would you buy to replace Fainu and why.

 

[Technical Coach]

@Technical Coach with Api's being injured so much (this year and last few) and Fainu not up-to your standard what cheap dummy half would you buy to replace Fainu and why.

Fainu is up to my standard but not at overs.

Some of Api's injuries have been unlucky also.

I would keep both players but keep Api ahead of Fainu and find another young supporting dummy half on the cheap in a supporting role.

What Manly could be thinking is Fainu will have less impact on the cap in the short to medium term compared to Api and find a strong young defensive workman like hooker to compliment Fainu on the cheap.

If Fainu doesn't improve to the next pay scale in a few years they can renew Fainu as a steady 40min hooker around the same price relatively speaking and hopefully upgrade the new hooker.(this keeps consistency for a few years)

With Api you know you get high intensity and energy in defence, nippy in attack with leadership by actions, but you might find it hard to attract some of the better young hookers in the game as presently Api would be on a lot more than Fainu now and in the near future.

I don't have the time to watch other games so don't have a list of players in mind, but i do know when i see it in a player. (If i have the time during the Christmas break would be more than happy to watch over lower grade video to find a cheap option)

 

[Kiwi Eagle]

Letting Fainu go, LOL

 

[Lyonstomenzies]

Fainu is up to my standard but not at overs.

Some of Api's injuries have been unlucky also.

I would keep both players but keep Api ahead of Fainu and find another young supporting dummy half on the cheap in a supporting role.

What Manly could be thinking is Fainu will have less impact on the cap in the short to medium term compared to Api and find a strong young defensive workman like hooker to compliment Fainu on the cheap.

If Fainu doesn't improve to the next pay scale in a few years they can renew Fainu as a steady 40min hooker around the same price relatively speaking and hopefully upgrade the new hooker.(this keeps consistency for a few years)

With Api you know you get high intensity and energy in defence, nippy in attack with leadership by actions, but you might find it hard to attract some of the better young hookers in the game as presently Api would be on a lot more than Fainu now and in the near future.

I don't have the time to watch other games so don't have a list of players in mind, but i do know when i see it in a player. (If i have the time during the Christmas break would be more than happy to watch over lower grade video to find a cheap option)

“Keep Api ahead of Fainu” I cant really see this happening the way they have been playing. You would be one of the only people thinking this, as most people that watch multiple games every week think this kid is the goods.

Obviously time will tell, injuries, off field drama and club politics can all derail a player, but on current form he will be getting offers in the mail.

 

[mave]

I'm convinced that TC is either Api, or Api's Dad.

 

[Spartan Eagle]

I'm convinced that TC is either Api, or Api's Dad.

Or Api's agent.

 

[40 years an eagle]

1. Not on the site daily to reward you with an instant reply.

2. You are so far off my radar a delayed reply is to be expected.

3. “Grammar” based predictable sense of humour/comeback style is synonymous with the lacking content types.(Never proclaimed I am perfect with my grammar, I am in game and performance analysis over several sports lol so correct me or offer a counter response in this area to be a productive contributor)

4.Following in the boring footsteps of others in this regard tells me you have a “blender” personality who tends to fall to the levels of humour at the expense of others to fit in. (fine when responding to a direct attack but in this instance we had a boring contributor add his pointless two cents worth and a lazy third man in to pad his stats up)

5. The topics I instigate/bring up are all footy related and in line with what this site is all about unlike others who take potshots because they really have nothing worthy to add. (My potshots will be a response to an instigator)

6. You must be desperate to fit in spotting the “ok” error, i'm fine with the so called cheeky “technical” responses to my grammar failings given my nick but you are clutching at straws on the “ok” error to make a new friend it appears.(this is why I responded)

7. People here need to develop a more broad sense of humour, some here take my serious technical responses to heart sometimes, I will compliment and bring to attention the weaknesses of any player be it a young up and coming star or an established one, I'm not a fanboy.

8. “Delusions of grandeur” will be my new nick if that helps people add me to their block list.

9. I also get annoyed when people use "to" instead of "too" and "loose" instead of "lose" but i don't see the point of bringing it up and maybe embarrassing the individual, what matters more to me is that the response is interesting/informative.

OK then I have 10mins for selfies next…..

Good grief! You sir are certainly one self-aggrandising, A grade wanker.

 

[Spartan Eagle]

How good was Suli today. Great barnstorming runs and giving us plenty of momentum. He's really enjoying himself out there.

 

[Mark from Brisbane]

Thought both players had great games today , Suli his best to date and young Fainu made a huge difference when he came on.

****ed if I know wether the stats agree with this but I know what I saw!!

 

[40 nil]

it just gives reasons that could impact performance.

Yes, even under physical duress, Fainu performed very well against the Storm - 11 runs, 94 metres, 5 offloads, 42 tackles, 0 missed tackles

Fainu has his own style of dummy half play, has an exciting running game and is great to watch. Over time, his ball skills should continue to develop. In comparison, Damien Cook, now 28 years old, seems to have reached his full potential only in the last couple of years (afaik).

 

[susan]

Good grief! You sir are certainly one self-aggrandising, A grade wanker.

He doesn’t watch other games. Interesting for a self designated expert. How he decides Fainus status in the pantheon of hookers when he doesn’t watch his peers is so ridiculous it beggars belief.

Yep. It would be very interesting to see our friend apprise the rugby league punters of his insightful thoughts on the game face to face over a beer at the local pub Me thinks he may have to adjust his presentation style or face a long and painful stint on the coaching sidelines.Although then again with his personality you would have to be a black belt in something to still be walking around.


“ I would be more than happy to go over old video over the Christmas break to find a cheaper option” lol.

Will you do it for free or should we all chip in for your effort?

You just have to shake your head and move on really.It is just simply staggering.

 

[Technical Coach]

Yes, even under physical duress, Fainu performed very well against the Storm - 11 runs, 94 metres, 5 offloads, 42 tackles, 0 missed tackles

Fainu has his own style of dummy half play, has an exciting running game and is great to watch. Over time, his ball skills should continue to develop. In comparison, Damien Cook, now 28 years old, seems to have reached his full potential only in the last couple of years (afaik).

Yes he can add new elements to the role like engaging the markers in a different way to Cam Smith by actually offloading during the tackle and not just engaging and passing.

But once again everyone keeps focusing on his attacking elements which is only half the job.

I don't find Fainu's running game any more exciting than most young hookers that come through the ranks these days, glides around with grace and some footwork, nice offloads in tackles done skillfully and with intelligence.

Once again as i said he can have all the attack but if his defence is average he will only ever flourish behind a team that dominates possession and has punch, i don't see him digging in when things are not going well or offer leadership through defence.

 

[Technical Coach]

Good grief! You sir are certainly one self-aggrandising, A grade wanker.

Lol i really want to jump on board the grammar/spelling police train right now, so tempting but i'm American....

 

[40 years an eagle]

Lol i really want to jump on board the grammar/spelling police train right now, so tempting....

Go right ahead dude, and while you are at it you can explain what the 4 dots are at the end of your post.