climate change

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SeaEagleRock8

Sea Eagle Lach
Premium Member
Tipping Member
Some tips on how to keep cool and what happens to the human body if we can't

"It’s a matter of life and death that people know how to cool themselves down as the planet keeps warming."
 

MuzztheEagle

Bencher
Bob, it's us - Australia is doing it. On average each Aussie is responsible for more greenhouse gas emissions than the average citizen of anywhere bar Saudi Arabia (in a photo finish)
This graph was published a week or so ago, I'll find a link to the article
The personal responsibility argument is a dead end IMO. It makes people feel less guilty - even when they do things that make next to no difference.
The thing is, even if western/global north countries dramatically scale back their current use of fossil fuels then the rest of the world will simply take up the surplus supply and at an increased rate as countries strive to reach our standard of living. This is the tragedy of the commons and it's going to take far bigger acts and conversations than are currently happening.
 

manly al

First Grader
Some of those countries mentioned that are building new coal power stations are also considerably increasing their renewable energy sources and namely with solar .
Most western countries with their relatively high wage rates just can not economically or viably continue to operate or built new coal plants also .
New coal plants in other countries with a lower wage structure are an inevitable reality in terms of trying to provide enough cheaper type energy and with updated pollution control measures, helping a bit in the process .
On any given or most days in Q L D , renewable energy sources provide 25 % or so of the state's power needs , not too sure about other states but with more battery storage in Q L D at least , no doubt could increase renewable capacity .
Countries like Norway with hydro and Denmark with wind farms are pretty much self sufficient in the renewable field but the exception also of course .
Gas and coal are still going to be a necessary power source for some time yet , nuclear where it is already established to play a role ongoing .
Seems to be some variation in increased temperature trends around the globe .
Sure that all countries acknowledge the continuing problem of global warming , just different levels of interest in trying to address it .
Might even suit some countries to have the more colder regions thaw out a bit but that is another issue
 

The '47ers

When Eagles are silent Parrots begin to chatter
Some of those countries mentioned that are building new coal power stations are also considerably increasing their renewable energy sources and namely with solar .
Most western countries with their relatively high wage rates just can not economically or viably continue to operate or built new coal plants also .
New coal plants in other countries with a lower wage structure are an inevitable reality in terms of trying to provide enough cheaper type energy and with updated pollution control measures, helping a bit in the process .
On any given or most days in Q L D , renewable energy sources provide 25 % or so of the state's power needs , not too sure about other states but with more battery storage in Q L D at least , no doubt could increase renewable capacity .
Countries like Norway with hydro and Denmark with wind farms are pretty much self sufficient in the renewable field but the exception also of course .
Gas and coal are still going to be a necessary power source for some time yet , nuclear where it is already established to play a role ongoing .
Seems to be some variation in increased temperature trends around the globe .
Sure that all countries acknowledge the continuing problem of global warming , just different levels of interest in trying to address it .
Might even suit some countries to have the more colder regions thaw out a bit but that is another issue

And we dig up our coal and send it overseas for them to burn 🤦🏻‍♂️. Obviously there needs to be a better way but no use cutting off our nose to spite our face. These countries continue to thrive while we will end up on rolling blackouts like a third world country and in a right mess.

Note: I work in a coal fired power station so maybe I'm biased. I have cattle too, that fart a lot, so maybe I should avoid the climate change topic.
 

SeaEagleRock8

Sea Eagle Lach
Premium Member
Tipping Member
Note: I work in a coal fired power station so maybe I'm biased. I have cattle too, that fart a lot, so maybe I should avoid the climate change topic.
Not at all, don't avoid it. I don't think anyone should avoid it.
Meanwhile I think a world-wide plebiscite on the question of climate change - restricted to people aged 15-30 - would be very interesting!
 

MuzztheEagle

Bencher
Note: I work in a coal fired power station so maybe I'm biased. I have cattle too, that fart a lot, so maybe I should avoid the climate change topic.
I think the fact that you are so invested makes you the type of person that people need to be having the conversation with. If we can accept that change needs to happen then, what would YOU need to see to support it?
And this something I would like to see more of when leaders of countries get together to discuss the issue - rather than pointing at the individual successes and failures.
 

The '47ers

When Eagles are silent Parrots begin to chatter
I think the fact that you are so invested makes you the type of person that people need to be having the conversation with. If we can accept that change needs to happen then, what would YOU need to see to support it?
And this something I would like to see more of when leaders of countries get together to discuss the issue - rather than pointing at the individual successes and failures.

As backward as this sounds I do support change, but I just don't know which way we should turn in relation to a better, dependable source. To me it's "just a job" here, plenty of other options personally out there if they shut us down.
 

manly al

First Grader
And we dig up our coal and send it overseas for them to burn 🤦🏻‍♂️. Obviously there needs to be a better way but no use cutting off our nose to spite our face. These countries continue to thrive while we will end up on rolling blackouts like a third world country and in a right mess.

Note: I work in a coal fired power station so maybe I'm biased. I have cattle too, that fart a lot, so maybe I should avoid the climate change topic.
Think that it going to be a given that the existing power stations in QLD at least and Australian thermal coal are going to be needed and used for power generation for many decades to come yet .
Again often overlooked , the necessary concept and implementation of energy source Renewable Off Sets in relation to new or existing coal and gas energy providers as part of the mix . .
Maybe a type of neutral outcomes and progression but probably the most practical situation when everything is put into perspective ..
Interesting that i noticed some time ago that South Australia was up to something like 60 - 70 % for Renewable daytime power input requirements on some days .
Pretty much a horses for courses situation when again the practical realities come into play .
Not just parts of Australia with households having the highest uptake of solar in the world , plenty of individual business premises as well .
One major engineering works in my region apparently self sufficient including battery storage and off the grid entirely .
Think that i have even noticed some Bunnings stores also considering extensive roof top solar installations and to no doubt also feed back into the grid then .
Bit more hopeful on some future pessimistic Australian blackout forecasts or predictions and not happening .
As long as the ideological climate denier type polies not try to stuff the inevitable adjustment and reasonably orderly process path up again or low grade politics coming into play again
 

Wombat64

Game day lubrication specialist
Premium Member
Tipping Member
I have been around for a few years. I definitely think climate change is happening. I have been studying an interesting regular annual pattern in the change of the climate. Has anyone else noticed that from December to March it seems that each year the weather gets hotter and then June to August it gets colder.I've also noticed that it is usually hotter up in the Northern part of Australia and than it is usually cooler down in the Southern states. I don't get how climate change sceptics don't see this. It's obvious.
 
Bob, it's us - Australia is doing it. On average each Aussie is responsible for more greenhouse gas emissions than the average citizen of anywhere bar Saudi Arabia (in a photo finish)
This graph was published a week or so ago, I'll find a link to the article


View attachment 25648
Graph doesn't say much really, it needs to go into detail and break down the reasons why otherwise it is just a scare campaign "mostly" against high living standards.

For example Australia does a lot of mining and agriculture for a small population, has extreme weather conditions to deal with, large travel distances etc etc.

Sure Australia has to diversify it's economy more and modernize to lower our emissions and over reliance on mining and agriculture but in saying that the countries we export to have to shoulder and absorb some of our per capita contributions surely in this area for a more fair comparison.

Australia is doing well with solar penetration, solar pv per capita and 9th in total capacity. Australia also has a weather advantage and vast expanses of vacant space to really take a lead in many areas with solar and help reduce our future emissions.

On top of that full electric cars is not the way to go with current battery technology. One 500kg Tesla battery could help produce 9 to 10 hybrid cars, hmmm 10 drivers with families each saving 20-25% fuel usage compared to one driver and probably less likely to have a family user of a Tesla.

How often do full electric users purchase a new car relative to ICE and Hybrid users?
Sure full electric should have long term gains emissions wise and improve the second hand market emissions also but are these gains nullified in the short to medium term with the type of demographic that wants a new car every 3-5yrs eating up more raw materials and increased mining.

The point i am trying to make is graphs are only as good as the detail and understanding behind the figures being displayed, in the same way most people don't understand the reasons behind the stats in the NRL just advertise them for simplistic viewing.
 

SeaEagleRock8

Sea Eagle Lach
Premium Member
Tipping Member
The point i am trying to make is graphs are only as good as the detail and understanding behind the figures being displayed, in the same way most people don't understand the reasons behind the stats in the NRL just advertise them for simplistic viewing.
Fair point, although the reason for putting up that graph was because some people argue "Australia shouldn't have to reduce fossil fuel emissions when we aren't one of the biggest producers."
As a country that is true, but it ignores the fact there are far more people in a place such as China, and their emissions are actually far less than ours on a per capita basis.
Also ignores the relevance of who is responsible historically for putting most of the CO2 into the atmosphere, ie, which populations have benefited by being the first to industrialise and become wealthy.
Obviously these are political issues, about which people will disagree.
 
Fine let Australia be "fruitful and multiply" and our per capita basis comes crumbling down problem solved----not.

The only relevance in relation to the "first to industrialise" viewpoint is that they too will be the first to more clean and efficient production methods and increased output hopefully staying ahead of the curve and increase our wealth even more relative to old methods of production and it's limited diversity.
 

Uber Eagle 72

Reserve Grader
Premium Member
I don’t think the current policy adopted by both sides of government is working or will work, once the cost of living further escalates ( and it will as a result of increases in energy costs) the first side of government who presents a trump like policy will be voted in and it’s already happening in other countries at the moment. Blindly transitioning to wind, solar and alike appears naive to me. Again once the working class of the population feels the pinch and it will get worse the environment will be put on the back burner and all our previous efforts would be all in vain as other countries shift to coal and or nuclear. We need to look to technology to get the world out of this environmental bind, technology that will encourage others like India and China follow suit not do as we did in the past…
 
Look at the emissions training just one AI model can emit, short to medium term not much is going to improve emissions wise until AI speeds up technological innovation to cleaner methods.
 
Team P W L PD Pts
12 9 3 83 22
14 10 4 78 22
13 9 4 110 20
13 8 5 66 20
13 7 6 81 18
12 7 5 -37 18
13 7 6 133 16
13 7 6 47 16
13 7 6 -34 16
13 6 6 27 15
13 6 6 26 15
14 7 7 -26 14
13 6 7 -47 14
13 4 9 -111 10
12 3 9 -123 10
12 3 9 -136 10
12 2 10 -137 8
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