Trent Barrett Poll

[SeaEagleRock8]

Is a plonker any better than a plodder? Has any one emerged from the Plodder label to become a legend?

Cliff Young?

 

[double hoops]

Why would any self-respecting disciplinarian want to place himself in the midst of our 'complicated' set-up?

I agree. Like I said I feel our bigger issues lay in our management. I don't know Anthony personally but I know plenty of people that speak very highly of him. I can't help but wonder if his departure says more about the terrible state our club is in off field then in his performance.

If we seriously replace Seibold with a son of Fulton. I won't be receiving a ten year membership badge. Bozo can be brilliant, but Nepotism and placing self or family interest above the clubs interest has the potential to destroy this club completely.

 

[niccipops]

Sounds promising - can he teach Buhrer not to drop the ball?

Yes. Using Jedi mind tricks from the coach's box - This is not the ball you're dropping Jamie!

 

[double hoops]

Which coach would have done a better job then Baz with the team this year and why?

Open question to the BazBashers.

Righto I'll suggest Maguire. Hasler. Bennett. Robinson. Arthur. And Flanagan. Our issue is not tactics it is Discipline. the coach sets expectations and standards. We started the season a mile off the pace. And we finish there as well.

Lets just look at one area like goal kicking. Do you see a club or coach who expects overs and continual improvement.

It one in which Jamie Lyon is the goal kicker and what ever he serves up is good enough?

 

[Harvies elbow]

Which coach would have done a better job then Baz with the team this year and why?

Open question to the BazBashers.

Geoff Toovey. Finalists, Grand Finalist ( ripped off premiership winning coach) not a whinge but a fact, almost semi finalist last year with similar injury list to this year. 58% record....... need I go on.
Oh yeah.
Manly f*cking legend !!!

 

[Harvies elbow]

Agree that he's a legend. And he was shafted big time.

But that's irrelevant.

The same people calling for Baz's blood were the same people calling for Toovs blood when we sat last on the ladder last year after winning 3 games in the first 14 rounds.

So if Toovs was there now - the same Bashers would be calling for Toovs head....again....

It's totally relevant.
Your question was who and why.
I wasn't on silvertails last year so I can't comment on those calling for Tooves head, but if I was, I wouldn't have.
Tooves was sacked for political reasons not performance.
You don't sack coaches with his winning percentages.

 

[Harvies elbow]

He won 11 games last year from 24. That's 45%.
Baz is 8 from 20. That's 40%. With 4 games to play.

Not all that different really. And when you consider the team Toovs had last year...
Compared to the complete overhaul to the playing group we experienced this year...

How can u say Toovs performance was acceptable but Baz's isn't?

Simple answer really.
Similar injury situation.
Addition of 4 internationals.
We have a top four roster this year. The masterstroke of the overhaul was supposed to be beneficial I thought.

 

[wombatgc]

The same people calling for Baz's blood were the same people calling for Toovs blood when we sat last on the ladder last year after winning 3 games in the first 14 rounds.

Not me. It was clear that he was being white-anted from within. He had no chance.
Baz on the other hand had an open cheque book care of the Penn's.

 

[Harvies elbow]

Your spot on ... I agree but only if we had been able to field the same team consistently for a large portion of the 22 weeks. But we haven't.
So the team still hasn't gelled. They haven't had a decent chance to work together because of injury and suspension. You might argue the injuries were the same last year but the combinations were there - this year we don't have them. It takes time and a consistent group of players playing each week. Not chopping and changing a new spine every week.

Baz can't control the injuries. And we haven't fielded a full strength team this year. Let alone consistently for a few weeks.

So yes, our team is top 4 on paper - but the season never got off the ground due to injuries to core players within a newly assembled playing group. Simple really.

I'm not a Baz basher anyway. I don't blame the bloke for taking the job.
Cartwright on the other hand.....
I fail to see his credentials.
None the less in answer to your first question mate Tooves is still my answer.

 

[conanu]

The same people calling for Baz's blood were the same people calling for Toovs blood when we sat last on the ladder last year.

So if Toovs was there now - the same Bashers would be calling for Toovs head....again....

I can assure you that I have never asked for Toovey or Des for that matter to ever be sacked. Ever!

Peter Sharp, Nathan Green, Jye Mullane, Brayden Williame, Chris Bailey, Sam Murphy, James Hasson, Jayden Hodges, Adam Peters on the other hand yes I have at times called for them to be sacked.

 

[conanu]

Just curious. You seem a man on a mission. Have you always been anti-Baz since and before he arrived at Manly? Did you want him sacked during the recent string of wins? Did the loss to parra tip you over the edge and now you want his head on a platter?
Or did you always want his perfectly designed head on a platter?
Questions from a Barrett neutral, loyal Manly supporter.

Yeah I certainly am coming across as obsessed with BazBashing. To answer your question. Obviously I never wanted Baz as a coach, I used to give **** to my St George friends about Baz, I refered to him as Mr Mediocre on many occasions, I never rated him as a player. I have wished that he was moved on for every round this year. Basically he represents everything that is wrong with Manly at the moment. Baz as a person i'm am convinced he is a nice genuine bloke. Bozo thinks he is a coaching prodigy for some reason I will never understand.

If I had my way Toovey would have seen out his contract for 2016 and I would have moved heaven and earth to snatch Des back for 2017. Failing that, I would have signed Ivan Cleary for 2017 and got a coach that had at least taken a notoriously patchy side like the Warriors to a GF with the likes of Lewis Brown and Feliti Mateo. I actually believe Cleary was moved on from Penrith because his son was emerging as a superstar and they were worried that a players father being the coach wouldn't work & they would lose Nathan to a rival club or It would become a problem for the other players. If Toovey had to go this year I would have looked at a bloke like Griffin which sounds like hindsight now but at the time I actually thought he or Kevin Walters would have been good fits in the Manly culture. But we got Baz and it is what it is.

 

[double hoops]

So how are Madge and Robinson more disciplined? Their sides are having far worse seasons than our Eagles? I'm not sure I understand what u mean their more disciplined so they would have won more games....?

It's a pretty vague comment to name some coaches and say their just more disciplined so they would have done better?... Would they have sacked Lyon as kicker and brought in someone else who is worse but that shows failure will not be tolerated so we'd start to win?
Jamie Lyon is the goal kicker because he is better at it than anyone else. They'd have their own kicking comps to work out the pecking order. Same as all teams do.

I don't know about bashing baz. But I do question the job he is doing. I seriously feel sorry for Trent the same as I do for Toovs.

And I sure as **** wasn't Bagging Toovs. Toovs had his limitations as a coach. But I'll suggest off field distractions at our club already intent on flicking Tooves killed us last year? Not the little leader himself.

Why aren't we Disciplined under Trent you ask? Let's look at the small things. Overall you know a coach is big on Discipline when you see a big change in the culture the doing of the little things the one per centres players do or don't do is a good indicator.

As much as he ****s me at times this is where Bozo was brilliant. As old school as I am sure he now is, if Bozo was actually our coach this year, I just think we would have seen a marked improvement in one per centers.

So look we had room for improvement from Toovs.

Rooster have blooded a young roster this year. It looks like they set out to be on a rebuilding year. And they are doing it, and doing very nicely with kids in key positions. It's a lack of class and experience, not discipline or coaching which sees them where they are on the ladder. Robinson has done a marvellous job.

Cheery being out hurt us early in the year but our squad is in a very different position to the roosters.

South's issues are players not wanting to follow the coaches disciplined ways. What players aren't enjoying after having won a premiership dosent mean it isn't exactly what our team dosent need to get a premiership.

Watch us play. Then watch the Cows or Storm. We are a lazy team compared to them in the one per centers.

A simple tell Let's look at how unfit we have looked at times this year.

If the bar is set high enough our players just don't struggle aerobically like they have. Bennett teams may play a simple mistake free game plan. But he ups the training work rate weeks before finals so come finals they are on a decreased work rate.

Hasler may focus on building up to and being ready to peak in September.

But neither of these top coaches big on working hard and discipline ever has a team unfit.

How about setting up for a field goal. It tells a lot about how big the coach is on structures and every player knowing his role. Consider how many games the dogs won last year by a point? They knew their roles, went back to set plays, structures and handled pressure.

Sorry but we continue To look rubbish in these areas as well. We are disorganised kaos.

Donny would often say our boys were doing mental training working under fatigue a few years back. We probably were, but objectively we haven't looked like we handled pressure well since Des.

Coaches do coach dealing with pressure. I've had coaches who were big on calculations and spatial awareness assessments in the middle of a running drill. It's suppose to help the mind react to stimuli and process information whilst your football brain is still doing its thing with the drill.

The top sides handle pressure and play percentages.

As a group we look even less composed in 2016 compared to recent years.

We aren't or weren't on a rebuild like the roosters buying Kapow, Brown, Myles and with Snake, Skivvy and Killer in our squad. This was a top 8 squad who as a group just aren't showing signs of improving.

With the one exception of our defence in recent weeks, I just don't see what areas Baz is improving this group. Some Players have Improved individually sure.

I hope Baz proves me wrong and wins us a comp. But after almost a season in charge, I just don't know what area or thing you see that suggests he is transforming us into a premiership winning team?

 

[Eagleheart]

Has Barrett stated somewhere in the past week that we are done for the year? Not sure if true, but if it is true then that is not the mark of a great coach. You never give up even if everything is against you.

So Twent, should any Manly fans bother to watch anymore games this year if that is your attitude?

Anyway as far as the poll is concerned is Twent capable of taking us to a premiership, the answer from me is no. He has not shown to me he is capable of winning a spot in the top eight let alone a premiership. Loosing an important game like last Friday night proved how inept he is. We lacked an intensity and hunger that is so crucial and is the difference to being successful or not in a competitive arena. We look sluggish and more often than not we have very little composure and focus. All areas that can be coached mostly.

Can he improve? Maybe? Does he need to improve? Absolutely.

At this stage he has not got the skill or mind set to take a first grade team to a grand final and them win it. I really hope he can improve and I really hope that one day he is capable but as it stands right now, he is not.

 

[conanu]

I don't know about bashing baz. But I do question the job he is doing. I seriously feel sorry for Trent the same as I do for Toovs.

And I sure as **** wasn't Bagging Toovs. Toovs had his limitations as a coach. But I'll suggest off field distractions at our club already intent on flicking Tooves killed us last year? Not the little leader himself.

Why aren't we Disciplined under Trent you ask? Let's look at the small things. Overall you know a coach is big on Discipline when you see a big change in the culture the doing of the little things the one per centres players do or don't do is a good indicator.

As much as he ****s me at times this is where Bozo was brilliant. As old school as I am sure he now is, if Bozo was actually our coach this year, I just think we would have seen a marked improvement in one per centers.

So look we had room for improvement from Toovs.

Rooster have blooded a young roster this year. It looks like they set out to be on a rebuilding year. And they are doing it, and doing very nicely with kids in key positions. It's a lack of class and experience, not discipline or coaching which sees them where they are on the ladder. Robinson has done a marvellous job.

Cheery being out hurt us early in the year but our squad is in a very different position to the roosters.

South's issues are players not wanting to follow the coaches disciplined ways. What players aren't enjoying after having won a premiership dosent mean it isn't exactly what our team dosent need to get a premiership.

Watch us play. Then watch the Cows or Storm. We are a lazy team compared to them in the one per centers.

A simple tell Let's look at how unfit we have looked at times this year.

If the bar is set high enough our players just don't struggle aerobically like they have. Bennett teams may play a simple mistake free game plan. But he ups the training work rate weeks before finals so come finals they are on a decreased work rate.

Hasler may focus on building up to and being ready to peak in September.

But neither of these top coaches big on working hard and discipline ever has a team unfit.

How about setting up for a field goal. It tells a lot about how big the coach is on structures and every player knowing his role. Consider how many games the dogs won last year by a point? They knew their roles, went back to set plays, structures and handled pressure.

Sorry but we continue To look rubbish in these areas as well. We are disorganised kaos.

Donny would often say our boys were doing mental training working under fatigue a few years back. We probably were, but objectively we haven't looked like we handled pressure well since Des.

Coaches do coach dealing with pressure. I've had coaches who were big on calculations and spatial awareness assessments in the middle of a running drill. It's suppose to help the mind react to stimuli and process information whilst your football brain is still doing its thing with the drill.

The top sides handle pressure and play percentages.

As a group we look even less composed in 2016 compared to recent years.

We aren't or weren't on a rebuild like the roosters buying Kapow, Brown, Myles and with Snake, Skivvy and Killer in our squad. This was a top 8 squad who as a group just aren't showing signs of improving.

With the one exception of our defence in recent weeks, I just don't see what areas Baz is improving this group. Some Players have Improved individually sure.

I hope Baz proves me wrong and wins us a comp. But after almost a season in charge, I just don't know what area or thing you see that suggests he is transforming us into a premiership winning team?

Great Post!!

 

[eaglebuzz]

Tooves didn't deserve to be sacked, but until the malcontent players and meddling administrators who ensured his demise are rooted out Barrett will struggle to do any better.

Also, for the record, spelling "Trent" with a 'w' makes you look like a petulant child.

 

[BOZO]

A lot of us said the exact same thing about Toovey when he would insist with Hasson and co. People said the same about Des persisting with T-Rex.

Judgement should be reserved until he has all the tools at his disposal player-wise. If he makes poor decisions at that point, sure, lay the boot in. After all, we are all premiership winning coaches so we can speak from experience 😉 But seriously, if that is the case then I'll be as pissed off as the next guy.

To me though he's pushed to give the younger guys more responsibility and they've kicked on a notch. He's seen something in some former plonkers and give them an extended leash and they've responded. Not saying they're world beaters but they are giving it their all. Structure wise our game breaks down because of the lack of a 6. Walker is not the answer and Barrett has moved away from playing him there if he can. To me the fact we almost win with Walker at 6 shows that they've come a ways (because he is terrible at 5/8 *insert a crab or black hole emoji*).

At the end of the day Adversity shows what coaches are made of . They are either made of excuses like yours representing Barrett or wins like Arthur's eels back against the wall win against Barrett's team who was every punters favourites for good reason and you didn't have to be a premiership winning coach to understand why .
We will agree to disagree 🙂

 

[robbiea]

Can we have a PennBashin poll .Do u think we can win a GF with them in control ??

 

[BOZO]

Can we have a PennBashin poll .Do u think we can win a GF with them in control ??

With out the Penn's we have no team . Have you got any mates that would like to put their money where their mouth is and take over our club ?

 

[BOZO]

I haven't been on Silvertails all that long but for what is supposed to be a Manly supporters forum - their sure are a lot of negative people on here.
Baz is the coach. Bozo is the head of football. The Penns are the owners and that's our footy team. Being a supporter is about supporting your team.

Not white anting the coach, owners and players from the grandstands.

Comparing our situation to any other is pointless. "They've got a better coach" "their more disciplined" "lets get rid of the Penns" ...???

Other teams are other teams and we are Manly. Yes there are differences. We're all different teams - wow. Rocket science.

And perhaps if our team had more people show up at games and support without questions and doubt instead of white anting the club - we'd of won more games too....?

How do you know who goes to the games and who doesn't ?
We are proud supporters and financial members and attend games because we give a fck about our club and we don't like seeing our once great culture ruined by an incompetent coach .

 

[HoldenV8]

@Batty we're only really negative when we're losing like we have been the past two seasons because we're so used to this club winning and we want them to keep winning. Sure, sometimes we're negative even when we win but that is because some of us see things that aren't right or we think aren't right, but that is more constructive criticism than negativity.

Go to any of the other fan forums in the NRL, even the AFL, and you will see exactly the same thing. When you win things are great. When you lose.....

With regards to Manly under Barrett's coaching, there is really only one thing as a team that we have improved on in the second half of this season and that is our defence. Our attack still looks like its stuck in the mud, even when Killer plays at 5/8. Yes with Killer in the halves its much better simply because it gives the opposition someone else to think about other than DCE, but realistically most of our scoring plays still come from individual brilliance rather than set plays or structures.

Individual players have improved. Walker's form went up markedly moving from 5/8 to centre, Tom is getting better with experience and hell, even Wiliame has improved his game to a point. But as a team we're still not gelling and while a lot of that can be put down to the injuries which has meant we haven't come close to putting what should have been our best 17 on the field, some of it also has to come down to coaching.

As I've said previously, I would like to see how Barrett goes next year if he has at least somewhere close to a fully fit squad for the season. Can he take us to a premiership? Maybe.

No one thought at this stage of his first season that Des was going to take us to 3 GF's and 2 premierships. But then, Des was also a long time Sea Eagle where Barrett isn't. As much as people might have bitched about his first season results I think they were a bit more forgiving of Des simply because he had been around the club for almost 20 years and had won a premiership as a player. He had that instant respect from the fans for that reason alone. Barrett has to earn it from the ground up.