The jersey debacle: Why did nobody work towards a compromise?
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highlandeagle
Where eagles soar
Yeah only in Frank's world. Good on the magnificent 7. So proud of them.
Uk eagle
Bencher
All it would have taken was some intervention from the NRL once they knew the quality of their product was going to be compromised.
To Manly " are you ok with 7 players wearing a slightly different jersey?"
To the roosters" are you ok playing against a team in a one off situation with slightly different jerseys?"
And going forward make sure that in future every jersey change is ratified by them at the start of the year and all players have it built into their contracts that once passed by the NRL it is their duty to play or they are breeching their contract.
It doesn't sound like rocket science to me
Oh and surely put a limit on how many different jerseys can be worn in one season, this year has been ridiculous
To Manly " are you ok with 7 players wearing a slightly different jersey?"
To the roosters" are you ok playing against a team in a one off situation with slightly different jerseys?"
And going forward make sure that in future every jersey change is ratified by them at the start of the year and all players have it built into their contracts that once passed by the NRL it is their duty to play or they are breeching their contract.
It doesn't sound like rocket science to me
Oh and surely put a limit on how many different jerseys can be worn in one season, this year has been ridiculous
Well written post mate. At first, I was of the opinion the club could and should not back down, but you make some valid and well thought out points.
Firstly, the scenario (not one in the above post btw) where players 'pick and choose' which jersey they where flies in the very face of the intended message of inclusivity.
As @Woodsie has said, after the press conference (which should never have been conducted by a coach and captain btw), the management release a statement similar to above, highlighting the intended causes of this round. Then suggest the they acknowledge PV's intention of holding a 'Pride' round in the future and, in that vain, will apply to the NRL to wear the jersey later this year.
They also state they respect the the right of any player / official / fan to their own beliefs, however the club believes strongly in making the LGBTQ community feel welcome in Rugby League and, to that point, ask Ian Roberts to relay to the playing group, and wider MSWE staff, some of the issues he faced.
As I mentioned in another post, I would still like Ian Roberts to be given the opportunity to speak to anyone in the club who views homosexuality as a sin or immoral. Completely voluntary and very casual. You never know, someone may challenge their beliefs and become the advocates of change within their communities. I thing I'll guarantee, if not presented with a different viewpoint, the attitudes won't change.
Apologies @Woodsie if I hijacked your post a bit.
Terry Zarsoff
First Grader
From the SMH:
July 27, 2022 — 2.52pm
Six of the seven players refusing to wear the Manly Sea Eagles rainbow jersey in their match on Thursday night are from a Pasifika heritage.
I’ve been working alongside wellbeing and education with the NRL since 2010. My involvement includes counselling NRL players, supporting mental health policies and programs, and promoting diversity and inclusion approaches.
Jason Saab, Christian Tuipulotu, Haumole Olakau’atu, Josh Aloiai and Josh Schuster are five of the seven Manly players who have withdrawn from Thursday’sclash with the Roosters.CREDIT:GETTY/NRL PHOTOS
I have facilitated Pasifika cultural workshops with all the clubs across the game. This involved everyone across the whole NRL club at all levels, including Pasifika and non Pasifika players, coaching staff, administration and management. Part of this workshop was to create a safe space for Pasifika players to feel better understood within their clubs.
With just over 45 per cent of NRL players identifying from a Pasifika heritage, it is important that we understand and celebrate cultural diversity and their differences.
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The players say they can’t wear a gay pride jersey for cultural and religious reasons. I’m assuming, similar to what we saw with Israel Folau, that such staunch views against diverse sexualities is based on conservative family values and a deep commitment to the Christian faith.
From a wider community perspective, we may view Pasifika cultures as being homophobic — full of fear for the queer. But this was taught to us by white, Western attitudes brought with colonisation.
Before the missionaries visited our beautiful island homes in the period of colonisation during the 1800s, sexuality among many Pacific communities was fluid. Men would have sex with men without fear and shame. Sexuality was seen as an expression of connecting socially and relationally with others.
From various written accounts by missionaries, they were appalled with how comfortable we were with our nakedness. They saw our nudity as lewd and forced us to cover up. They saw men expressing affection for other men as morally corrupt and dangerous.
Over time, we learnt to repress our natural sexual desires and regard our physical bodies as sinful. This has then carried over into our modern Pasifika cultural values, perpetuated by Western and white conservatism.
As a result, Pasifika cultures have been influenced to maintain this line of sin and shame to our detriment. We don’t discuss or express any form of sexuality, seeing sex exclusively reserved for a married straight couple for procreation.
Play Video
Play video
17:16
We abide by our religious leaders’ directives in upholding respect for our elders and never question or critique such rules and regulations. This translates to the respect we show our parents and broader family, where our individual identities are inextricably connected. Questioning such views would be to question your own family and your connection to them.
In essence, our ability to care and connect within our families is a cultural strength; something I relish and cherish. Our lives revolve around caring and supporting each other; everyone is part of the collective and has a role to play across the family and the community.
However, if we are taught to uphold unhelpful religious views and values that come from conservative Westernised world views, we may limit our ability to truly embrace diversity.
As part of my workshops for the NRL, I would ask players to reflect on how they would celebrate ethnic, religious, and sexual diversity. Most players would giggle at first when I encouraged them to think about sexuality — but this was also encouraging them to think through their own sexual expression without shame or stigma.
Overall, players would then engage in a proactive conversation around supporting each other irrespective of how one may identify with their sexuality. My aim was to create scope to promote a sense of connection and community in which cultural diversity and its difference is seen as a source of celebration rather than a barrier.
If we are truly going to support diversity to thrive in all shapes and sizes, whether based on ethnicity, religion or sexuality, we need to continue to create a shared conversation across NRL clubs that allows players to share their views and values without fear.
However, to create a genuinely inclusive culture, we need a shared approach to diversity. If we, including Pasifika people, expect to be respected for our diversity, we need to also genuinely respect others for their own.
Manly jersey: Churches back boycott players
Pasifika people need to be proud of our pre-colonial views of queerness and reclaim such views as part of our ability to love our neighbour as ourselves.
Such relational and fluid views on sexuality can also be something white and Western societies could learn from traditional Pasifika cultures. We could all benefit from demystifying the shame and stigma we place on sexuality – and allow people to live their lives where we embrace diversity and its differences.
By doing so, we allow multiple worldviews to be welcomed, which allows everyone to contribute to a truly multicultural, multi-faith and queer-friendly game.
OPINION
Don’t blame Pacific Island cultures for queer fear. Blame colonisation
Jioji Ravulo
Head of social work and policy studies, University of SydneyJuly 27, 2022 — 2.52pm
Six of the seven players refusing to wear the Manly Sea Eagles rainbow jersey in their match on Thursday night are from a Pasifika heritage.
I’ve been working alongside wellbeing and education with the NRL since 2010. My involvement includes counselling NRL players, supporting mental health policies and programs, and promoting diversity and inclusion approaches.
Jason Saab, Christian Tuipulotu, Haumole Olakau’atu, Josh Aloiai and Josh Schuster are five of the seven Manly players who have withdrawn from Thursday’sclash with the Roosters.CREDIT:GETTY/NRL PHOTOS
I have facilitated Pasifika cultural workshops with all the clubs across the game. This involved everyone across the whole NRL club at all levels, including Pasifika and non Pasifika players, coaching staff, administration and management. Part of this workshop was to create a safe space for Pasifika players to feel better understood within their clubs.
With just over 45 per cent of NRL players identifying from a Pasifika heritage, it is important that we understand and celebrate cultural diversity and their differences.
Advertisement
The players say they can’t wear a gay pride jersey for cultural and religious reasons. I’m assuming, similar to what we saw with Israel Folau, that such staunch views against diverse sexualities is based on conservative family values and a deep commitment to the Christian faith.
RELATED ARTICLE
Opinion
NRL 2022
I wore my Manly jersey, and my sexuality, with pride. Now I’m heartbroken
Ian Roberts
From a wider community perspective, we may view Pasifika cultures as being homophobic — full of fear for the queer. But this was taught to us by white, Western attitudes brought with colonisation.
Before the missionaries visited our beautiful island homes in the period of colonisation during the 1800s, sexuality among many Pacific communities was fluid. Men would have sex with men without fear and shame. Sexuality was seen as an expression of connecting socially and relationally with others.
From various written accounts by missionaries, they were appalled with how comfortable we were with our nakedness. They saw our nudity as lewd and forced us to cover up. They saw men expressing affection for other men as morally corrupt and dangerous.
Over time, we learnt to repress our natural sexual desires and regard our physical bodies as sinful. This has then carried over into our modern Pasifika cultural values, perpetuated by Western and white conservatism.
As a result, Pasifika cultures have been influenced to maintain this line of sin and shame to our detriment. We don’t discuss or express any form of sexuality, seeing sex exclusively reserved for a married straight couple for procreation.
Play Video
Play video
17:16
Ian Roberts speaks on Manly pride jersey fiasco
Former NRL player and gay rights advocate Ian Roberts addressed the media on the Manly pride jersey fiasco.We abide by our religious leaders’ directives in upholding respect for our elders and never question or critique such rules and regulations. This translates to the respect we show our parents and broader family, where our individual identities are inextricably connected. Questioning such views would be to question your own family and your connection to them.
In essence, our ability to care and connect within our families is a cultural strength; something I relish and cherish. Our lives revolve around caring and supporting each other; everyone is part of the collective and has a role to play across the family and the community.
However, if we are taught to uphold unhelpful religious views and values that come from conservative Westernised world views, we may limit our ability to truly embrace diversity.
As part of my workshops for the NRL, I would ask players to reflect on how they would celebrate ethnic, religious, and sexual diversity. Most players would giggle at first when I encouraged them to think about sexuality — but this was also encouraging them to think through their own sexual expression without shame or stigma.
Overall, players would then engage in a proactive conversation around supporting each other irrespective of how one may identify with their sexuality. My aim was to create scope to promote a sense of connection and community in which cultural diversity and its difference is seen as a source of celebration rather than a barrier.
If we are truly going to support diversity to thrive in all shapes and sizes, whether based on ethnicity, religion or sexuality, we need to continue to create a shared conversation across NRL clubs that allows players to share their views and values without fear.
However, to create a genuinely inclusive culture, we need a shared approach to diversity. If we, including Pasifika people, expect to be respected for our diversity, we need to also genuinely respect others for their own.
Manly jersey: Churches back boycott players
Pasifika people need to be proud of our pre-colonial views of queerness and reclaim such views as part of our ability to love our neighbour as ourselves.
Such relational and fluid views on sexuality can also be something white and Western societies could learn from traditional Pasifika cultures. We could all benefit from demystifying the shame and stigma we place on sexuality – and allow people to live their lives where we embrace diversity and its differences.
By doing so, we allow multiple worldviews to be welcomed, which allows everyone to contribute to a truly multicultural, multi-faith and queer-friendly game.
Terry Zarsoff
First Grader
Ultimately it’s just another SPIOG - Scott Penn Induced Own Goal.
Use the report function if you are unhappy with a post. At the best of times it is a struggle to read all posts let alone across this issue
Son of Manly Beach
Reserve Grader
The most obvious solution was to let the 7 players wear the regular jersey, as you mention - its not all that different and very hard to see the difference from a distance. I'm surprised at the NRL's stubborn stance regarding this.
Terry Zarsoff
First Grader
In the last few days I have wondered how this would have panned out if Stephen Humphreys’ CEO stint hadn’t flamed out.
He didn’t strike me as someone who would reject any notion of consulting broadly before going ahead with this. That may or may not have led to conflict with Penn anyway - but we will never know.
Penn has given (to my knowledge) no indication that he thinks they erred by not consulting with the players beforehand.
He didn’t strike me as someone who would reject any notion of consulting broadly before going ahead with this. That may or may not have led to conflict with Penn anyway - but we will never know.
Penn has given (to my knowledge) no indication that he thinks they erred by not consulting with the players beforehand.
Son of Manly Beach
Reserve Grader
pretty much! I really doubt we'll hear much more about this again - well I'm hoping anyway haha
Its become such a distraction and a gift to all the other teams
| Team | P | W | L | PD | Pts |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|
|
6 | 5 | 1 | 59 | 12 |
|
6 | 5 | 1 | 20 | 12 |
|
6 | 4 | 2 | 53 | 10 |
|
6 | 4 | 2 | 30 | 10 |
|
7 | 4 | 2 | 25 | 9 |
|
7 | 4 | 3 | 40 | 8 |
|
7 | 4 | 3 | 24 | 8 |
|
7 | 4 | 3 | -8 | 8 |
|
7 | 4 | 3 | -18 | 8 |
|
7 | 3 | 3 | 20 | 7 |
|
7 | 3 | 4 | 31 | 6 |
|
7 | 3 | 4 | 17 | 6 |
|
6 | 2 | 4 | -31 | 6 |
|
7 | 3 | 4 | -41 | 6 |
|
7 | 2 | 5 | -29 | 4 |
|
6 | 1 | 5 | -102 | 4 |
|
6 | 0 | 6 | -90 | 2 |
