Team List Tuesdays ... Should be a ripper.

[MuzztheEagle]

I just cannot get my head around these Croker to lock calls, especially when our go forward it struggling.

Yes the best locks can ball play a bit but they still take 10 plus hitups and make 100 plus metres.

I just cannot seee how people think this would be some sort of solution

I imagine the thinking is that there's F all happening in attack. Which is a pretty fair assessment when you look at he number of players standing around either not knowing how to add something or waiting for something to happen. And, throwing Croker there could definitely add some spark.
I get the idea, but it overlooks the obvious. Why are our forwards standing around waiting for things to happen? FFS It's not a complicated job. Does anyone else miss Foran giving it to the forwards when they didn't do their job?

 

[ManEagle]

I just cannot get my head around these Croker to lock calls, especially when our go forward it struggling.

Yes the best locks can ball play a bit but they still take 10 plus hitups and make 100 plus metres.

I just cannot seee how people think this would be some sort of solution

Can only speak for my own opinion on why I would like to see it in the next games, what have we got to lose and working with the cattle we have and not pie in sky "if only we sign this player stuff......"

We need faster more dynamic dummy half but at same time due to existing lazy cattle one we don't lose the tackle bots of Crocker and Jake.
Jake at lock is starting to get slow in his own right, tippytoe at times to the line with the ball and can slow it down further, but I love him and he will cut any ball runner in 2, as much as I do he isn't our lock moving forward and would love to see him get a freaking rest and not be so gassed picking up other slack.

By moving Crocker to lock Jake to prop rotation and bringing in GCKT we get the dynamic dummy half and cover in defence with Crocker and Jake on the field.
We get a ball playing prop out of Jake that won't let anyone down in defence.
Crocker is as tough as they come and will mix it with the best of them while utilising his 5/8 skills as an ball playing option.

Best of all we get rid of one of the lazy ass unfit props not up to it working in with what we have.

Jake at prop would give more hit ups than our present bench taking a little off the need for Crocker to do so. Wishful thinking he might also be barking at his prop partner to dig in more too.

Just My own thoughts of course, and working with what we have I can't see the harm in trying it now our season is practically over, at least trying something new.

 

[Mark from Brisbane]

I want to see both Lodge and Keppie coming off the bench, throw the cat amongst the pigeons with some aggro and thrust off the bench.

Keppie definitely deserves another crack , and you’ll know if that doesn’t happen that he’s gonski.

 

[SeaEagleRock8]

Agree it's disappointing BUT a team that saw themselves as even a slight hope would use the salary cap dispensation to top up a player and have a crack.

Never heard it mentioned that you can use that money to top up a player.
Pretty sure it is only available to sign a "like-for-like" player extra to the cap.
RTS would heave been great but we asked and he's not available.
I can't think of anyone else who is a) available and b) would improve the team, even for depth.
It's not much of a compensation scheme really, more of a token gesture scheme.

 

[Mark from Brisbane]

Never heard it mentioned that you can use that money to top up a player.
Pretty sure it is only available to sign a "like-for-like" player extra to the cap.
RTS would heave been great but we asked and he's not available.
I can't think of anyone else who is a) available and b) would improve the team, even for depth.
It's not much of a compensation scheme really, more of a token gesture scheme.

RTS would have been perfect , but I agree any others available were a downgrade on Garrick.

 

[Bearfax]

I just cannot get my head around these Croker to lock calls, especially when our go forward it struggling.

Yes the best locks can ball play a bit but they still take 10 plus hitups and make 100 plus metres.

I just cannot seee how people think this would be some sort of solution

Lets look at this point by point.

1. Croker is playing hooker. His role is to move the ball out of the ruck with snappy service and variety that gives his players room and time to initiate attacks. He does this adequately, though there is criticism about his speed and optional play
2. He is a former 5/8, so he has skills suited to that role, including some pace. Running 100mts per game would not be hard.
3. Cameron Murray who was the SOO lock for NSW is only slightly bigger than Croker, as was Watmough, so size isn't an issue.
4. Croker is easily the Sea Eagles most prolific defender, a skill essential for lock often doing near twice as many tackles in a game as Paseka and Olakau'atu
5. Something I mentioned elsewhere is that Manly has too many big not very mobile forwards. They need lighter, faster back rowers like Watmough, Menzies, Kosef, Gartner. Remember Des Hasler and Cliff Lyons often played lock and both were quite a deal smaller than Croker. That's why I plug for Burbo and Parker. Faster, good defenders, more mobile.

Croker is a tough cookie. He defends like someone much bigger. He doesnt need to do the grunt work with multiple hit ups. That's what your bigger players are there for. Like Schuster, he would be somewhat of a rover, like Watmough, Menzies etc were. So in answer I cant see how he wouldn't fill the role well.

 

[mickqld]

T.L.T is now a non event. It doesn't matter who is picked. We are sh*t and will remain sh*t for the rest of the year. We are no hope this weekend so who cares who the clowns pick.

 

[Sheikheagle]

Lets look at this point by point.

1. Croker is playing hooker. His role is to move the ball out of the ruck with snappy service and variety that gives his players room and time to initiate attacks. He does this adequately, though there is criticism about his speed and optional play
2. He is a former 5/8, so he has skills suited to that role, including some pace. Running 100mts per game would not be hard.
3. Cameron Murray who was the SOO lock for NSW is only slightly bigger than Croker, as was Watmough, so size isn't an issue.
4. Croker is easily the Sea Eagles most prolific defender, a skill essential for lock often doing near twice as many tackles in a game as Paseka and Olakau'atu
5. Something I mentioned elsewhere is that Manly has too many big not very mobile forwards. They need lighter, faster back rowers like Watmough, Menzies, Kosef, Gartner. Remember Des Hasler and Cliff Lyons often played lock and both were quite a deal smaller than Croker. That's why I plug for Burbo and Parker. Faster, good defenders, more mobile.

Croker is a tough cookie. He defends like someone much bigger. He doesnt need to do the grunt work with multiple hit ups. That's what your bigger players are there for. Like Schuster, he would be somewhat of a rover, like Watmough, Menzies etc were. So in answer I cant see how he wouldn't fill the role well.

Well thought out post. I agree. He is extremely tough. There are plenty of smaller, mobile locks around thats for sure. Definitely food for thought. What we have tried this year has not worked.

 

[manlyfan76]

We're on a road to nowhere, come on and try,
Sign up for membership - we'll take your cash.
Walking away to new York, he don't look back.

 

[Mark from Brisbane]

21 minutes until all hell breaks loose

 

[Disco]

Lets look at this point by point.

1. Croker is playing hooker. His role is to move the ball out of the ruck with snappy service and variety that gives his players room and time to initiate attacks. He does this adequately, though there is criticism about his speed and optional play
2. He is a former 5/8, so he has skills suited to that role, including some pace. Running 100mts per game would not be hard.
3. Cameron Murray who was the SOO lock for NSW is only slightly bigger than Croker, as was Watmough, so size isn't an issue.
4. Croker is easily the Sea Eagles most prolific defender, a skill essential for lock often doing near twice as many tackles in a game as Paseka and Olakau'atu
5. Something I mentioned elsewhere is that Manly has too many big not very mobile forwards. They need lighter, faster back rowers like Watmough, Menzies, Kosef, Gartner. Remember Des Hasler and Cliff Lyons often played lock and both were quite a deal smaller than Croker. That's why I plug for Burbo and Parker. Faster, good defenders, more mobile.

Croker is a tough cookie. He defends like someone much bigger. He doesnt need to do the grunt work with multiple hit ups. That's what your bigger players are there for. Like Schuster, he would be somewhat of a rover, like Watmough, Menzies etc were. So in answer I cant see how he wouldn't fill the role well.

Well we disagree, which is great, the beauty of a forum, but a few points.

You mention 'criticism of his speed' as an issue for him at hooker but then list that he has 'some pace' as a positive for him at lock. Seems conflicting for me but either way, speed doesn't necessarily equate to making hard yards through the middle.

Size in itself is not the issue, but players like Murray and Watmough are the exception not the norm. I struggle to envisage Croker winning the contact and being able to constantly win the wrestle and find his front thus getting a quick play the ball.

'Croker is easily the Sea Eagles most prolific defender'

What metric is this based on? Jake averages 39 tackles a game to Crokers 34. Crokers tackle effiency is 89% same as DCE and equal 8th most effective in the squad.

Look this is not a dump on Croker, he is a solid player I just personally dont see him as a starting lock, or at least not one that would have a positive net effect on the team.

I could perhaps see a situation where Croker starts in the 9 then after 30m transitions to a Walker type role for a Gordie etc to come on but again I just don't see him as dynamic enough to really make a dfference there.

 

[BOZO]

21 minutes until all hell breaks loose

What else do you expect from Passionate Manly people feathered friend ?

 

[Seagles68]

Lets look at this point by point.

1. Croker is playing hooker. His role is to move the ball out of the ruck with snappy service and variety that gives his players room and time to initiate attacks. He does this adequately, though there is criticism about his speed and optional play
2. He is a former 5/8, so he has skills suited to that role, including some pace. Running 100mts per game would not be hard.
3. Cameron Murray who was the SOO lock for NSW is only slightly bigger than Croker, as was Watmough, so size isn't an issue.
4. Croker is easily the Sea Eagles most prolific defender, a skill essential for lock often doing near twice as many tackles in a game as Paseka and Olakau'atu
5. Something I mentioned elsewhere is that Manly has too many big not very mobile forwards. They need lighter, faster back rowers like Watmough, Menzies, Kosef, Gartner. Remember Des Hasler and Cliff Lyons often played lock and both were quite a deal smaller than Croker. That's why I plug for Burbo and Parker. Faster, good defenders, more mobile.

Croker is a tough cookie. He defends like someone much bigger. He doesnt need to do the grunt work with multiple hit ups. That's what your bigger players are there for. Like Schuster, he would be somewhat of a rover, like Watmough, Menzies etc were. So in answer I cant see how he wouldn't fill the role well.

I think @Disco has a point but I do like the idea of Croker at 9, Shu at 13 (next year of course) and then bringing Gordie on at 9 and moving Croker to 13 whilst Shu has a rest. I say that coz we all think Shu will be 13 next year and we all think he's not going to have the legs to play big minutes at 13. I'm not sure this is the best use of players but it's certainly another way of seeing whether Gordie is up to FG and can be the long term 9. I can see Croker doing the 13 role for a portion of the game.

 

[StuBoot]

Keppie and Lodge on the bench.
No Bully or Toff

 

[Sheikheagle]

Keppie and Lodge on the bench.
No Bully or Toff

Seems fair they were both pretty poor last week.

 

[Mark from Brisbane]

Woods
Keppie
Lodge
Matterson

On the bench

Let the fun begin

 

[JakeyB789]

Woods over Bullemor is disgusting. **** Seibold is an imbecile

 

[Sheikheagle]

Woods
Keppie
Lodge
Matterson

On the bench

Let the fun begin

I’m glad Matterson retained his spot. Thought he did ok last week.

 

[silver]

What an absolute Gong Show we have with that muppet Seibold in charge. How the fark does Woods get selected over Bullemor is astounding.

 

[mickqld]

Woods and Aloiai. F*ck me dead. Clueless clown posse.