PRE-GAME DISCUSSION: Chooks v Manly [Round 1, 2021]

Highflier said:
Well here is the facts ....round 2 2020
View attachment 17253

just sayin'......
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Um, I think if you go back a page or two, I was talking about ST GEORGE!

I said,
"I hope people aren't penciling the Dragons in as a win. Our record is terrible against them. Not a great match up for some reason..."

Kevin Ward replied,
"If we can't beat the side they have this year, then it might be a long time before we experience the joys of victory against the goons."

I have no idea how you got the impression I was talking about the Roosters...just sayin'

Actually, never mind.
 
Re-watching the trial (and only got to half-time so far) a few things I picked up on the 2nd watch.

The Good:
  • Harper at FB was very good in 1st half. Only error i picked up came when he had a bomb spilled by Tuipolotu back into him in heavy traffic, don't blame him for that. Otherwise played a great roaming role off Schuster/Cust, and a screamer of a try-saving tackle early on. Good inclusion if it happens.
  • Boyle was actually quite effective, but just needs more energy in the play-the-ball (too slow). I understand his inclusion if he has been training well too. He bombed a try though in my view from 1-2m out, he seemingly couldn't make that extra stretch to get over.
  • Schuster....what can I say. Was MVP in that first half on both teams, with daylight second. Whatever the reasons for leaving him out of the side, I don't agree with them.

The Bad:
  • Tuipolotu was caught out defensively on Manly's right edge a couple of times, and is not ready for 1st grade quite yet. He was the least effective on-ground 1st half (just, over Suli)
  • Suli backed off defensively too many times. Not sure if it's because he was told to exclusively mark his man, but he made bad calls that created overlaps and was caught backpeddling and sliding in defence in a bad way. He was also quite ineffective in attack too. I would be targeting him if I were the Rooters - and scrutinising him if I were Des.
  • Dummy half play, even before Cust went off hurt, was poor compared to Tigers. We didn't get effective roll-ons/momentum happening like Tigers did.

There was some interesting data on the nrl reddit that talked about pre-contact metres gained, and Manly rated dead last in gained and 3rd-last in conceded pre-contact metres. This to me explains a lot about our inability to get momentum - as the teams that finished near the top of this stat were the top of the table.

With post-contact metres now being almost detrimental in the speed of play-the-ball, if we are not making good ground, hitting the turf, and getting a fast play-the-ball and slick pass out of dummy-half, then we aren't going to compete with teams like the Rooters.

That's why Schuster is such a strange omission - his passing is crisp and fast, has a great kicking game that can win repeat sets and setup tries, and he would add another dimension when/if he comes on.
 
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AlxFromNthNarra said:
Re-watching the trial (and only got to half-time so far) a few things I picked up on the 2nd watch.

The Good:
  • Harper at FB was very good in 1st half. Only error i picked up came when he had a bomb spilled by Tuipolotu back into him in heavy traffic, don't blame him for that. Otherwise played a great roaming role off Schuster/Cust, and a screamer of a try-saving tackle early on. Good inclusion if it happens.
  • Boyle was actually quite effective, but just needs more energy in the play-the-ball (too slow). I understand his inclusion if he has been training well too. He bombed a try though in my view from 1-2m out, he seemingly couldn't make that extra stretch to get over.
  • Schuster....what can I say. Was MVP in that first half on both teams, with daylight second. Whatever the reasons for leaving him out of the side, I don't agree with them.

The Bad:
  • Tuipolotu was caught out defensively on Manly's right edge a couple of times, and is not ready for 1st grade quite yet. He was the least effective on-ground 1st half (just, over Suli)
  • Suli backed off defensively too many times. Not sure if it's because he was told to exclusively mark his man, but he made bad calls that created overlaps and was caught backpeddling and sliding in defence in a bad way. He was also quite ineffective in attack too. I would be targeting him if I were the Rooters - and scrutinising him if I were Des.
  • Dummy half play, even before Cust went off hurt, was poor compared to Tigers. We didn't get effective roll-ons/momentum happening like Tigers did.

There was some interesting data on the nrl reddit that talked about pre-contact metres gained, and Manly rated dead last in gained and 3rd-last in conceded pre-contact metres. This to me explains a lot about our inability to get momentum - as the teams that finished near the top of this stat were the top of the table.

With post-contact metres now being almost detrimental in the speed of play-the-ball, if we are not making good ground, hitting the turf, and getting a fast play-the-ball and slick pass out of dummy-half, then we aren't going to compete with teams like the Rooters.

That's why Schuster is such a strange omission - his passing is crisp and fast, has a great kicking game that can win repeat sets and setup tries, and he would add another dimension when/if he comes on.
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Just to add, the games with the biggest differential between 2 teams (ie team 1 Pre-contact metres minus team 2 pre-contact metres) involved Manly 3 times: vs Dragons (lost 34-4), Storm (lost 30-6) and Titans (lost 42-24) - so basically whenever a team had a huge pre-contact metre differential they not only beat us, they thrashed us, and put 30-40+ on us.

Very telling.

Pre-contact metres are something I'm going to keep an eye on - although I don't know how you would measure it in truth, but I have a feeling momentum will show you who is dominating that stat - and based on the above, it will show on the scoreboard too.

PS of the games where the team with the lower pre-contact metres actually won, Manly were there twice - against Rooters (won 9-8) and Parra (won 22-18) - the scores were super close in both cases.

Pre-contact metres Des. Work it out!!
 
Moops said:
Um, I think if you go back a page or two, I was talking about ST GEORGE!

I said,
"I hope people aren't penciling the Dragons in as a win. Our record is terrible against them. Not a great match up for some reason..."

Kevin Ward replied,
"If we can't beat the side they have this year, then it might be a long time before we experience the joys of victory against the goons."

I have no idea how you got the impression I was talking about the Roosters...just sayin'

Actually, never mind.
Click to expand...
ok... ok.... I give in !! stop...!!! ,your forensic breakdown of the threads and the contents and context contained there in has blunted my enthusiasm for the verbal thrust and parry .We play the Rorters this week and I thought most were talking about them ,anyway doesnt matter as long we win on saturday
Go Manly
just sayin'
 
Highflier said:
ok... ok.... I give in !! stop...!!! ,your forensic breakdown of the threads and the contents and context contained there in has blunted my enthusiasm for the verbal thrust and parry .We play the Rorters this week and I thought most were talking about them ,anyway doesnt matter as long we win on saturday
Go Manly
just sayin'
Click to expand...
Forensic? Simple comprehension mate. But, anyway, as long as the poster I was communicating with understood what I was saying is good enough for me.

Forensic..how cute!

Just Sayin'
 
I hope & think Harper will come in as FB, Walker to Centre, Schuster into the 17, Parker & Funa unfortunately drop out.
 
AlxFromNthNarra said:
PS of the games where the team with the lower pre-contact metres actually won, Manly were there twice - against Rooters (won 9-8) and Parra (won 22-18) - the scores were super close in both cases.

Pre-contact metres Des. Work it out!!
Click to expand...
Isn't that just a new way of saying an old truth? Move up fast in defence, because it limits the opponent's "pre-contact metres".
And also don't give up 6 again, otherwise the opponent will get get more "pre-contact metres" because your defence will be back-pedalling. Which happened to us a lot last season!
 
Been told dessie will be starting Saab at full back.

1. Saab
2. Funa
3. Walker
4. Suli
5. Garrick

Possibly


1. Saab
2. Suli
3. Walker
4. Parker
5. Garrick
 
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