omnipotent beings discussion

[MuzztheEagle]

Well they can see things which are thousands and thousands of light years away now. (billions too) Think about that. Light travels at a speed of 300 000 km per second in the vacuum of space (apparently). But they can’t show us the American flag or the space buggy and other junk on the moon... because the moon is a loooooooong way from earth they say. Imagine all the doubting dummies who could be silenced by seeing such wonderful vision.

Happy to explain some of this to you (again) Kev. Still waiting on your experience of finding faith though

 

[MuzztheEagle]

They sure do lose a lot of important stuff at NASA! Perhaps they need to employ an administrator.

Way to derail a thread ken777. Can't justify religion - let's trash science then. Doesn't really work though. As I keep saying the two aren't comparable and science is claiming to have disprove god.

 

[Kevinward777]

Muzz, have you taken these scriptures to a minister of religion? Could you take these questions to a christian minister? If not, why not? They would be able to offer you answers. Why not ring the local Anglican church and set up a meeting with a pastor and present your questions. It's not hard to do and I hope you do.

This is quite possibly the best post of this entire thread.

 

[MuzztheEagle]

This is quite possibly the best post of this entire thread.

From memory, you have stated that you feel organised religion is a bad thing and that religions can use their own interpretation to make their own justifications. So why would you advocate this? We go back to the same argument, which church/sect/etc?
There is also the question of which bible to use.
You're also assuming that I haven't already done this

 

[Kevinward777]

From memory, you have stated that you feel organised religion is a bad thing and that religions can use their own interpretation to make their own justifications. So why would you advocate this? We go back to the same argument, which church/sect/etc?
There is also the question of which bible to use.

What I am advocating is that if you are truly determined to find out more about the scriptures then seek out a theologian who has studied them. Whether they be Anglican/Pentecostal/Baptist whatever.

 

[MuzztheEagle]

What I am advocating is that if you are truly determined to find out more about the scriptures then seek out a theologian who has studied them. Whether they be Anglican/Pentecostal/Baptist whatever.

And what makes you assume that I haven't?

 

[Kevinward777]

From memory, you have stated that you feel organised religion is a bad thing and that religions can use their own interpretation to make their own justifications. So why would you advocate this? We go back to the same argument, which church/sect/etc?
There is also the question of which bible to use.
You're also assuming that I haven't already done this

And yes... I do believe that many churches have definitely been infiltrated by crooks and perverts.

 

[Kevinward777]

And what makes you assume that I haven't?

Well then, if you have... let it go man. Believe what you want.

 

[Kevinward777]

And what makes you assume that I haven't?

But if you truly had, then you wouldn’t be throwing up the scriptures you have as an example that Jesus Christ was not about love. You would have a better understanding as to what he meant when he suggested removing one’s eye or cutting off one’s hand... yet clearly, you do not.

 

[MuzztheEagle]

Well then, if you have... let it go man. Believe what you want.

As I have stated many times; I have no issue with people believing in God. I do however have a big issue with people using religion to justify all sorts of hateful and judgemental treatment towards others.
Perhaps you should accept the fact that there is no valid justification for your religion and therefor should never be used for that purpose. Keep it in your head where it belongs and no one will criticise it. Try and use it to justify a stance on something and others will burn the idea down to what it really is...a lie.

 

[MuzztheEagle]

But if you truly had, then you wouldn’t be throwing up the scriptures you have as an example that Jesus Christ was not about love. You would have a better understanding as to what he meant when he suggested removing one’s eye or cutting off one’s hand... yet clearly, you do not.

A question then: what was Jesus' stance on homosexual relationships?

 

[Kevinward777]

As I have stated many times; I have no issue with people believing in God. I do however have a big issue with people using religion to justify all sorts of hateful and judgemental treatment towards others.
Perhaps you should accept the fact that there is no valid justification for your religion and therefor should never be used for that purpose. Keep it in your head where it belongs and no one will criticise it. Try and use it to justify a stance on something and others will burn the idea down to what it really is...a lie.

Mate I will speak about my faith whenever I choose... neither you nor anybody else will ever change that. But sometimes it’s best not to throw it onto the ground to be trampled upon. So in this instance at least, I’ll grant you your wish.

 

[MuzztheEagle]

Mate I will speak about my faith whenever I choose... neither you nor anybody else will ever change that. But sometimes it’s best not to throw it onto the ground to be trampled upon. So in this instance at least, I’ll grant you your wish.

Feels like your just trying to avoid difficult questions and truths again. Please answer my last question:
What was Jesus' stance on homosexual relationships?
If you have the understanding of Jesus that you claim to it should be an easy answer.

or you could just post this:

...but IMO that ship sailed a while ago for you (and it's really dumb)

 

[Kevinward777]

Feels like your just trying to avoid difficult questions and truths again. Please answer my last question:
What was Jesus' stance on homosexual relationships?
If you have the understanding of Jesus that you claim to it should be an easy answer.

or you could just post this:
View attachment 13505...but IMO that ship sailed a while ago for you (and it's really dumb)

I have no moral high ground mate... zilch, zero, nada. The only thing I have is the grace of the cross, and because of that grace my life has changed. In answer to your question... Jesus instructs me not to judge... it ain’t my job to do so because that would make me a hypocrite.

 

[MuzztheEagle]

I have no moral high ground mate... zilch, zero, nada. The only thing I have is the grace of the cross, and because of that grace my life has changed. In answer to your question... Jesus instructs me not to judge... it ain’t my job to do so because that would make me a hypocrite.

Did that mean you couldn't vote in the gay marriage plebiscite? As to do so would be to judge. Did you vote?

 

[MuzztheEagle]

To @Kevinward777 , @eaglebuzz and any other religious person wanting to push the validity of their belief:
The argument appears to go like this:
I ask a difficult question around religion which is answered with: Well that's because you don't know/understand God?
I ask how that can happen I get: You need to embrace god. It's a personal journey.
I then say that that doesn't really mean anything to me so ask for some personal experiences and I get: Well it's a long story over many years and I don't really think I could put it on paper etc etc. or worse, you just need to trust in God.
The thing is; that conversation happens all the time...with con men. Just trust me, it's a once in a lifetime opportunity, just commit and you will believe to.

If it WAS there I would be happy to believe, but I'm yet to find anything of any substance. And I have looked - I had somewhat of a religious upbringing, my partner works for a religious organisation, I have religious friends and I have spent enough time in churches and discussing with ministers and the like. Am I broken? Unworthy of God's love? Or have I just missed something obvious? Please enlighten me. How did you get to really know God?
And if God's love is so universal why is it so hard for any of you to explain?

 

[Kevinward777]

Did that mean you couldn't vote in the gay marriage plebiscite? As to do so would be to judge. Did you vote?

No I didn’t vote...

 

[Kevinward777]

To @Kevinward777 , @eaglebuzz and any other religious person wanting to push the validity of their belief:
The argument appears to go like this:
I ask a difficult question around religion which is answered with: Well that's because you don't know/understand God?
I ask how that can happen I get: You need to embrace god. It's a personal journey.
I then say that that doesn't really mean anything to me so ask for some personal experiences and I get: Well it's a long story over many years and I don't really think I could put it on paper etc etc. or worse, you just need to trust in God.
The thing is; that conversation happens all the time...with con men. Just trust me, it's a once in a lifetime opportunity, just commit and you will believe to.

If it WAS there I would be happy to believe, but I'm yet to find anything of any substance. And I have looked - I had somewhat of a religious upbringing, my partner works for a religious organisation, I have religious friends and I have spent enough time in churches and discussing with ministers and the like. Am I broken? Unworthy of God's love? Or have I just missed something obvious? Please enlighten me. How did you get to really know God?
And if God's love is so universal why is it so hard for any of you to explain?

If there is one recurring thing that I have encountered amongst true believers it’s their complete awareness of their need for forgiveness.

 

[MuzztheEagle]

If there is one recurring thing that I have encountered amongst true believers it’s their complete awareness of their need for forgiveness.

I'm not sure what this means. What are "true believers"? Are there different levels of belief? What would make someone a true believer compared to the alternative?
Is the need for forgiveness the same as guilt? Are you more likely to become a believer if you have a greater level of guilt?

 

[Captain Moondog]

I'm pretty sure this will explain everything...Roky's gone but he'll be back

Bedoin in tribes ascending
From the egg into the flower
Alpha information sending
States within the heaven shower
From disciples the unending
Subtleties of river power
They slip inside this house as they pass by
If your limbs begin dissolving
In the water that you tread
All surroundings are evolving
In the stream that clears your head
Find yourself a caravan
Like Noah must have led
And slip inside this house as you pass by
Slip inside this house as you pass by
True conception, knowing why
Brings even more than meets the eye
Slip inside this house as you pass by
In this dark we call creation
We can be and feel and know
From an effort, comfort station
That's surviving on the go
There's infinite survival in
The high baptismal glow
Just slip inside this house as you pass by
There is no season when you are grown
You are always risen from the seeds you've sown
There is no reason to rise alone
Other stories given have sages of their own
Live where your heart can be given
And your life starts to unfold
In the forms you envision
In this dream that's ages old
On the river layer is the only sayer
You receive all you can hold
Like you've been told
Every day's another dawning
Give the morning winds a chance
Always catch your thunder yawning
Lift your mind into the dance
Sweep the shadows from your awning
Shrink the fourfold circumstance
That lies outside this house don't pass it by.
Higher worlds that you uncover
Light the path you want to roam
You compare there and discover
You won't need a shell of foam
Twice born gypsies care and keep
The nowhere of their former home
They slip inside this house as they pass by.
Slip inside this house as you pass by.
You think you can't, you wish you could
I know you can, I wish you would
Slip inside this house as you pass by.
Four and twenty birds of Maya
Baked into an atom you
Polarized into existence
Magnet heart from red to blue
To such extent the realm of dark
Within the picture it seems true
But slip inside this house and then decide
All your lightning waits inside you
Travel it along your spine
Seven stars receive your visit
Seven seals remain divine
Seven churches filled with spirit
Treasure from the angel mine
To slip inside this house as you pass by
Slip inside this house as you pass by
The space you make has your own laws
No longer human gods are cause
The center of this house will never die
There is no season when you are grown
You are always risen from the seeds you've sown
There is no reason to rise alone
Other stories given have sages of their own
Draw from the well of unchanging
And its union nourishes on
In the right re-arranging
Till the last confusion is gone
Water-brothers trust in the ultimust
Of the always singing song they pass along
One-eyed men aren't really reigning
They just march in place until
Two-eyed men with mystery training
Finally feel the power fill
Three-eyed men are not complaining
They can yo-yo where they will
They slip inside this house as they pass by
Don't pass it by