Manly football department had to change

  • We had an issue with background services between march 10th and 15th or there about. This meant the payment services were not linking to automatic upgrades. If you paid for premium membership and are still seeing ads please let me know and the email you used against PayPal and I cam manually verify and upgrade your account.
All we have had this year is positive media coverage
So there can be one explanation why Penn wants his face on a story to get on all the positives with Manly this year, but to go over things of the past to try and justify what they did to Toov's and Ballin ??
Penn wants everyone to know that he is charge and gives the ultimatums
whether its egotistic or just how he runs his business and after all it is a business now and we are just customers ( to quote Mark )
While i was disappointed and peeed off by the treatment of Toov's and Ballin i'll leave it in past (i wont forget )
So hurry up and bring on the season proper so then its about the team and hopefully winning many games and the only time i see Penn again is when he is standing in the background as Jamiie lifts the premiership trophy
 
These comments acccompany the article. Clearly the third correspondent (Warnie) is a complete f---wit, with no idea.

Manly has no railway line but they keep running off the tracks.
  • Commenter
    enough is enough
    Date and time
    February 10, 2016, 11:16PM
    • and yet they are still the most successful club over the last 50 years... go figure....
      Commenter
      Tim
      Location
      Brisbane
      Date and time
      February 11, 2016, 8:36AM
  • The picture of Toovey shaking hands and looking elsewhere sums up Geoff perfectly. Grown men sooking. Geoff and Warnie may be long lost brothers!
    Commenter
    Warnie
    Location
    In the Jungle
    Date and time
    February 11, 2016, 6:15AM
    • Really ?
      Tooves picked up the pieced and held the playing side together - The Club has major issues with Dinosaurs at the helm - they are stuck it the 'footy show' world of business of the 80's - they squabble like seagulls over a chip.
      Glen Stewart decision was the right decision. Players have been left to cultivate an idea they are the ones with all the power in the absence of real managerial and commercial insight. DCE is a classic example of not seeing the forest for the trees. He is a slightly better than average player - can only pass in one direction - has a mediocre kicking game , and team have worked out id you Shepard him to his weak side he is controllable. BUT they chased him like he is another 'joey' and made huge fuss about him and his ability - its BS
      Commenter
      gman
      Location
      nsw
      Date and time
      February 11, 2016, 6:50AM
 
You say you won't criticise anyone's views but then you say nobody on this site is capable of objective analysis on this topic. Some might take that as criticism, and I don't think it's true.

Are your own views based on your own current pre-disposition?
Fact: Quantum controlled the Board when the Gift contract debacle occurred.
Fact: The Penn faction wanted to offer Gift a contract.
Fact: After the Gift debacle the Team attitude collapsed and we exited 2014 with a whimper.
Fact: New Management requested change and offered funds to do it.
Fact: After 7 rounds of 2015 we were 1-7.
Fact: The new Management commissioned an external consultant (Bozo) to advise them on the best way forward.
Fact: The new management took the advice of that consultant and chose the path they are now on and paid out IN FULL the contract of the current coach.

These are simple facts when viewed dispassionately. To conclude from these facts that one person or another has been wronged is to cease to be dispassionate.

Could things have been done better, yes, but I have seen this precise process occur many times over when business get a new owner. NRL clubs are now a business whether or not we the fans like it. If an owner is going to invest $$millions then they have a right to set teh strategic direction and move forward with executing that plan.
 
Must of been because of DCE returning that everyone else in the whole place got the @rse also. I wouldn't of thought that DCE would care who is in the front office, but he obviously must, cause they all got punted.
And of course DCE would of wanted the Football Club to be treated like they are nothings. And it was probably him that also wanted Penn and Co to come up with a nothing Life Membership token award so he doesn't have to play as many games to get a medal.
I have read enough. If they are so successful and don't care for members, why do they need our coin.
 
Whilst I understand elements of the article, even the part citing the playing group as a collective were unhappy and that things had to change. It has got to be one of the biggest examples of engaging your mouth before brain to come from Sea Eagles in a while. Naming players specifically, especially those still at the club is ridiculous. He has potentially managed to divide the squad and paint DCE as a trouble maker and coach killer
 
Fact: The Penn faction wanted to offer Gift a contract.

FACT: We don't know if that was to be a serious offer or a token offer out of respect. His words below

We were adamant that we needed to put forward an offer to Glenn. And even though it wasn't a great offer, we were adamant that still needed to occur out of respect for him

The other fact is that we will never know if

a) Glenn would have accepted the "not so great" offer
b) If he did whether the NRL would have ratified it given their desire to see players paid what they perceive they are worth

So it's a bit rich for the Penns to be painting themselves as the good guys here because it seems highly unlikely that their offer would have been anything other than a PR exercise, not totally without merit but did they REALLY want to keep him at the club ?
 
Fact: Quantum controlled the Board when the Gift contract debacle occurred.
Fact: The Penn faction wanted to offer Gift a contract.
Fact: After the Gift debacle the Team attitude collapsed and we exited 2014 with a whimper.
Fact: New Management requested change and offered funds to do it.
Fact: After 7 rounds of 2015 we were 1-7.
Fact: The new Management commissioned an external consultant (Bozo) to advise them on the best way forward.
Fact: The new management took the advice of that consultant and chose the path they are now on and paid out IN FULL the contract of the current coach.

These are simple facts when viewed dispassionately. To conclude from these facts that one person or another has been wronged is to cease to be dispassionate.

Could things have been done better, yes, but I have seen this precise process occur many times over when business get a new owner. NRL clubs are now a business whether or not we the fans like it. If an owner is going to invest $$millions then they have a right to set teh strategic direction and move forward with executing that plan.
Fact: In the end Quantum showed us how committed they were to our club when they took their money and Fcked off
 
Fact: After the Gift debacle the Team attitude collapsed and we exited 2014 with a whimper.

Fact: After the Gift debacle (when he signed with Souffs in April 2014) Manly continued to dominate the 2014 premiership and were sitting pretty 4 points clear on the ladder in early August (that's more than 3 months later for those playing at home) before injuries mounted and a loss to the cowboys in the last game meant we again just missed out on the minor premiership. The injury-hit team then lost to both grand finalists, with the bulldogs loss a controversial but gutsy extra time knockout.

Clearly it was the Gift thing though right?
 
Fact: Quantum controlled the Board when the Gift contract debacle occurred.
Fact: The Penn faction wanted to offer Gift a contract.
Fact: After the Gift debacle the Team attitude collapsed and we exited 2014 with a whimper.
Fact: New Management requested change and offered funds to do it.
Fact: After 7 rounds of 2015 we were 1-7.
Fact: The new Management commissioned an external consultant (Bozo) to advise them on the best way forward.
Fact: The new management took the advice of that consultant and chose the path they are now on and paid out IN FULL the contract of the current coach.

These are simple facts when viewed dispassionately. To conclude from these facts that one person or another has been wronged is to cease to be dispassionate.

Could things have been done better, yes, but I have seen this precise process occur many times over when business get a new owner. NRL clubs are now a business whether or not we the fans like it. If an owner is going to invest $$millions then they have a right to set teh strategic direction and move forward with executing that plan.
Fact: Ralphie believes one version of events and calls it ... FACT!
Sorry Ralphie, couldn't resist ;)
 
Which has fark all to do with what has occurred since. That was 2014.

Fact: Quantum controlled the Board when the Gift contract debacle occurred and most of the sht started from there but Quantum did no want to finish what they started so they took their money and fcked off and showed us how passionate they really were for our club
 
We got within a whisker of being 2013 Premiers, all it took was one of the 4 officials to see the forward pass everyone else saw. 2014 wasn't a great result, but look at our 2009 effort after the 2008 success. We then followed that up by limping into the 2010 final 8 to get pumped again. Were you calling for Dessie's head after that ??

We wouldn't have even made the top 8 in 2010 if not for the Drizzle playing for no points after they got caught cheating the cap. They won enough games that would have seen us miss the finals had they been playing for points.
 
Another fluff piece going over old ground-Nothing new there at all.
Fact is, whether Tooves was set up to fail or not HE DID. Forget about the reasons why, change was desired by many.
What is undeniable, is that Whatmough, Foran and Stewart (possibly Matai) spat the dummy and it impacted significantly on the culture and harmony of the team. Unforgiveable!!!
Let's hope the new culture is being built on the successful models of this champion club's great past. It is not like the Penn's had to reinvent the wheel for God's sake.
Looks like Bozo made all the hard calls once he was "plugged in"
 
Another fluff piece going over old ground-Nothing new there at all.
Fact is, whether Tooves was set up to fail or not HE DID. Forget about the reasons why, change was desired by many.
What is undeniable, is that Whatmough, Foran and Stewart (possibly Matai) spat the dummy and it impacted significantly on the culture and harmony of the team. Unforgiveable!!!
Let's hope the new culture is being built on the successful models of this champion club's great past. It is not like the Penn's had to reinvent the wheel for God's sake.
Looks like Bozo made all the hard calls once he was "plugged in"
 
This article is not meant for anyone on here but intended for the less informed fan to help reduce the tooves anger

Correct.
People on here need to realise that we're a few hundred people that choose to inform ourselves of the goings on with and around the club.
That's a few hundred out of ten thousandish members and eighty thousandish (? who knows?) supporters. Just because we can see through the BS and can call people on contradicting themselves, that doesn't mean that the majority of people are in a position to do so. They lap up everything they're told.

I'd say the truth would lie on both sides of the argument. As outlined many times here, the Penns don't mind contradicting themselves or even lying outright about things.
But they probably did tell Tooves to make changes. That probably did come from playing group feedback. And Tooves probably wasn't particularly open to accommodating this plan. You can see from some of the interviews that Geoff did that he probably isn't the most progressive person in the world. If that's the case, unfortunately he did have to move on.

Personally I don't trust the Penns all that much. I don't think private enterprise is a particularly trustworthy beast.
I'm yet to be convinced that they're prepared to fight the hard yards for Brookvale Oval.
But you can't make this a matter of taking sides and blindly following everything that one side projects whilst automatically rubbishing anyone who disagrees with them. The truth has to lie on both sides of the argument. The challenge is trying to figure out which side to believe at which time.
 
@Ralphie , I have tried to add a bit of balance to your assessment below. Much of what you say is true, but you did leave a lot out. I think this is a fair summary of events now.

Fact: Toovey's short coaching career was relatively successful. In 2012 we were 1 game short of the GF. In 2013 we made the GF and almost won it. In 2014 we finished equal first in the regular season, but (as you say) went out with a whimper in the finals. In 2015 we missed the finals for the first time, with Toovey sacked well before that result was known. Overall, Toovey has a winning percentage of 58.1%. To put that in context, Hasler is at 59.6%, Bennett at 62.0%, and The Great Brad Arthur is on 42.6%.

Fact: Quantum controlled the Board when the Gift contract debacle occurred.

Fact: The Penn faction wanted to offer Gift a contract. [One that was, by Scott's own admission "not a great offer". An offer so low that, if I recall correctly, it was the NRL that stopped us putting it to him. It was a difficult situation and I agree it was handled very poorly by those in charge at the time. Ultimately Gift probably would have still left even if the Penn offer was put to him, and the unrest may still have occurred anyway.]

Fact: After the Gift debacle the Team attitude collapsed and we exited 2014 with a whimper. [Agreed. The Foran and DCE debacles were also starting to bubble away at this point and also had a negative impact, and we were unlucky on the injury front with the loss of Buhrer and Ballin in particular hurting us. Despite all that, the Bulldogs still needed golden point and a poor refereeing decision to knock us out.]

Fact: Gift failed to find any form in 2016 and spent a lot of time out injured. If viewed dispassionately, purely based on football ability at his stage of career, letting him go was clearly the right call.


Fact: New Management requested change and offered funds to do it. [I'm not clear what they expected Toovey to do here - somehow overhaul the team mid-season?]

Fact: Toovey had to deal with Des' back ended contract fiasco throughout his tenure, which probably prevented him from any major overhaul. As this is the first year we have really been on the recruitment circuit in a long time, it would suggest that it has taken until now to wash through the system. Both Gift and Choc were on huge contracts during Toovey's time, as has been well documented. It would not have been possible to bring in a Myles or Taupau while Gift, Choc and others were taking up so much cap space.]

Fact: After 7 rounds of 2015 we were 1-7. [We were never 1-7. After 7 rounds we were 1-6 and after 8 rounds we were 2-6. We also had the worst injury toll in living memory. We had a similarly poor start in 2009 under Hasler.]

Fact: The Penn controlled board botched the DCE negotiation. He had agreed terms with the old Board that Penn failed to honour and in the end we had to come up with more to retain him after putting up the DCE contract sideshow for a large part of the season, which was a fair contributor to our poor year in my view.


Fact: The new Management commissioned an external consultant (Bozo) to advise them on the best way forward. [Agreed - a very smart move, and unquestionably the reason why we have been able to form a strong team for 2016. We are very fortunate to have Bozo at our disposal.]

Fact: The Penn controlled board's treatment of Ballin was poor, and is arguably worse than the previous Board's treatment of Gift. Ballin had a contract, signed only months earlier, and they forced him out.


Fact: The new management took the advice of that consultant and chose the path they are now on and paid out IN FULL the contract of the current coach. [If they had not paid him out in full he no doubt could have commenced legal proceedings, which would have cost them more and generated bad publicity. It made good business sense to pay him out in full, and I assume that's why they did it. As you say, rugby league is a business after all.]

These are simple facts when viewed dispassionately. To conclude from these facts that one person or another has been wronged is to cease to be dispassionate. [Equally, it must be said that the facts, as a whole, do not support a proposition that Toovey was a poor coach, that previous management was responsible for all our problems, or that we would not have had any problems if the Penns were in charge all along.]

Could things have been done better, yes [agreed], but I have seen this precise process occur many times over when business get a new owner [I imagine most people here have. The new owner traditionally lays the boot into the old owner about all the mistakes they made as well, to make the new owner look good and enables the new owner to take all the credit for turning the business around (which was my original point). That is clearly part of what Penn is doing here.]. NRL clubs are now a business whether or not we the fans like it. If an owner is going to invest $$millions then they have a right to set teh strategic direction and move forward with executing that plan. [I agree 100% and despite extremely poor execution in some places and a lot of pain and suffering along the way, the plan ultimately looks good to me in terms of future success. We are fielding a very strong team in 2016. Penn would be better served to look to that future rather than dredge up the past.]
 
I definitely thought it was time for Tooves to go - he had done a good job but the tide had turned and I don't disagree at all with the decision to move him on ( Sadly ). Hard but necessary (in my opinion anyway ).

But the air brushing of history is fooling nobody.

Enough. Silence is golden. Less is more Scott.
 
Team P W L PD Pts
3 3 0 48 6
3 2 1 45 4
3 2 1 28 4
3 2 1 22 4
3 2 1 15 4
3 2 1 14 4
2 1 1 13 4
3 2 1 10 4
2 1 1 6 4
3 2 1 -3 4
3 1 2 0 2
3 1 2 -5 2
3 1 2 -15 2
3 1 2 -22 2
3 1 2 -36 2
2 0 2 -56 2
3 0 3 -64 0
Back
Top Bottom