Fainu and Suli

[Mark from Brisbane]

I love a good old fashioned spat, bring it on boys and girls!!

 

[susan]

Wasn’t my question

That’s your opinion, That’s fine. What I’m asking is what are your credentials that allow you to claim such supremacy as a judge and dismiss others like they have no knowledge.

You talk of intricate player assessment tools etc that aid in your analysis. I am genuinely interested in where you ply your trade and deep interest in player assessment Surely it is not a hobby and if it is don’t you think it might be an idea to join the rest of us as mere mortals and quit the elitist rhetoric.

 

[KOMORI]

Has decent rolling long stride turn of speed but i don't see Fainu as a sharp darty player off a standing start from hooker---I would say Api has him covered over the first few steps in sharpness.(but i guess that is opinion based and everyone is "entitled" to have one Fainu might just be deceptively quicker than i think with the way he glides effortlessly)

Api may be marginally sharper out of the hole, and his defensive work cannot be discounted.. but I still rate Fainu’s sharper balls out of the the ruck as a bigger plus. Api’s passing isn’t that great, in fact it’s fairly ordinary for a first grade rake...

 

[Snake]

He just played 90 minutes against a team that has lost two games all season, on their own turf and we kept them to 10 points. One try was from a kick in the corner and one a dart from dummy half after we had been stretched the play before....pretty sure he can keep the middle tight.

How that might equate to Fainu staying a "40 minute" hooker is beyond me?!

I know the people in our club personally and not one of them thinks he won't be a star and/or may end up a bench player...we aren't shopping Koroisau for no reason. Fainu has been earmarked.

 

[Technical Coach]

Api may be marginally sharper out of the hole, and his defensive work cannot be discounted.. but I still rate Fainu’s sharper balls out of the the ruck as a bigger plus. Api’s passing isn’t that great, in fact it’s fairly ordinary for a first grade rake...

I don't think either players ruck passing is all that great or of note----i will say both have improved this year.

I didn't rate Fainu's ruck passing yesterday one bit, was partly the reason why (along with overall tiredness in the squad in the second half but also at times in the first half during the fresh exchanges) that Melbs pack were able to dominate tackles and field position.

 

[Snake]

I don't think either players ruck passing is all that great or of note----i will say both have improved this year.

I didn't rate Fainu's ruck passing yesterday one bit, was partly the reason why (along with overall tiredness in the squad in the second half but also at times in the first half during the fresh exchanges) that Melbs pack were able to dominate tackles and field position.

I've worked out who you are...

PETER SHARP!

 

[Technical Coach]

He just played 90 minutes against a team that has lost two games all season, on their own turf and we kept them to 10 points. One try was from a kick in the corner and one a dart from dummy half after we had been stretched the play before....pretty sure he can keep the middle tight.

How that might equate to Fainu staying a "40 minute" hooker is beyond me?!

I know the people in our club personally and not one of them thinks he won't be a star and/or may end up a bench player...we aren't shopping Koroisau for no reason. Fainu has been earmarked.

Form an opinion based off your own judgments that don't need validating off "knowing people in the club personally"

Playing 80mins and being "highly effective" for 80mins are two different things.

 

[Snake]

Form an opinion based off your own judgments that don't need validating off "knowing people in the club personally"

Playing 80mins and being "highly effective" for 80mins are two different things.

I trust Des but fair enough...this is my opinion for you:

Fainu will get better but he is already doing amazing things for his age. He is terribly dangerous from dummy half, last week he ran for 184 metres, which even for a running hooker is amazing. He is not quite at Api's level in terms of defence but he has a great engine and is getting better each week. Compared to his defence last year, he has come on in leaps and bounds. To beat the elite teams you need to pose a threat around the ruck and we do when Fainu is on the field. At 20 years of age to be doing what he is already doing tells me he is going places. If all the problems you believe exist with Fainu's game, they would have been exposed last night because Melbourne are the benchmark. He came up trumps; he is a hell of a young player!

A lot of astute judges thought Damien Cook was nothing more than a runner and he proved himself to be an international quality 9.

 

[Technical Coach]

I've worked out who you are...

PETER SHARP!

That comeback line has been used before, you have never been known to offer ground breaking new opinions so i guess this is to be expected.

But hey if that comeback line has been used before maybe there is some valid weight behind it and i should stop and reflect on my obvious flaws......

Don't think so.

 

[KOMORI]

I don't think either players ruck passing is all that great or of note----i will say both have improved this year.

I didn't rate Fainu's ruck passing yesterday one bit, was partly the reason why (along with overall tiredness in the squad in the second half but also at times in the first half during the fresh exchanges) that Melbs pack were able to dominate tackles and field position.

It was a factor, but not nearly as decisive a factor as the Storm’s work, and the leniency they seem to be allowed in controlling ruck speed. They’ve always been at the forefront of specific methodology designed to slow down and control the ruck via wrestling tactics and the now preferred 2+1 technique.

Personally I’m not a fan of the way they do this, but the game has allowed it to progress to a point where it’s a necessary tactic if you want to compete.

 

[torana355]

Its very easy to sit back and point out every small flaw in a player, but at the end of the day I trust Des over any armchair expert on this or any other footy forum. Fainu is developing nicely and is highly regarded by most. Back to enjoying an amazing win against the benchmark side of the comp.

 

[Jabuh]

Oh i'm sure i will get the odd one wrong but not enough to lose sleep over.

Many times Sue i go against the grain here on players be it their worth or position they play or "technical errors in their style" and it all usually pans out, or not rating the Manly pack when near leading the comp in 2014 and got laughed at.

Like yesterday two of Tom's major flaws to his game that he has to address if he wants to be considered up with the greats is the stifled backline play that lead to an outside back not timing his run (not all Tom's fault but he looked awkward and uncomfortable in that role) and his low down defence on the try line----i have mentioned that several times now and it still keeps happening.

I praise players and knock players, my nick says it all, take it or leave it.

To me i just want to see players perform better that is my true love, if Fainu picks up in these areas i will love to see that happen as it will make for more Manly wins.

Can't tell if you're trolling with your comments or maybe you're just lonely and need some attention? Fainu is very impressive and is a massive reason why we are 5th. It's his first full year and he's already being sounded out to play origin. This dribble about not being fast doesn't mean **** when he's breaking every other tackle and creating opportunities for faster players. Also your comments about Tom and whether he wants to be talked about as one of the greats... Where you been man? He's already being talked about as one of the greatest ever, and with good reason. The only thing that would make any sense here is if you are Trent Barrett or Api koroseau

 

[Snake]

That comeback line has been used before, you have never been known to offer ground breaking new opinions so i guess this is to be expected.

But hey if that comeback line has been used before maybe there is some valid weight behind it and i should stop and reflect on my obvious flaws......

Don't think so.

I've never seen it used before but I can believe that it has already been trotted out because it is pretty transparent...

I share my opinions and observations with heavy hitters in the NRL circle and they seem to think they are quite astute... you are the anomaly so what does that tell you about your knowledge?

 

[Technical Coach]

I trust Des but fair enough...this is my opinion for you:

Fainu will get better but he is already doing amazing things for his age. He is terribly dangerous from dummy half, last week he ran for 184 metres, which even for a running hooker is amazing. He is not quite at Api's level in terms of defence but he has a great engine and is getting better each week. Compared to his defence last year, he has come on in leaps and bounds. To beat the elite teams you need to pose a threat around the ruck and we do when Fainu is on the field. At 20 years of age to be doing what he is already doing tells me he is going places. If all the problems you believe exist with Fainu's game, they would have been exposed last night because Melbourne are the benchmark. He came up trumps; he is a hell of a young player!

A lot of astute judges thought Damien Cook was nothing more than a runner and he proved himself to be an international quality 9.

The issues i have are 80% about his defence that get overlooked because of "some" of the good things he does in attack.

The team as a whole has been defending and covering each other very well which makes it harder to expose a weakness---that doesn't mean there are no weaknesses.

Melb without Cronk and Slater are not going to effectively target weaknesses as good as the past, in saying that you can only judge in the present and Melb are still the benchmark.

No idea why pundits and commentators keep harping on about Melb having an extra gear to go to, Melb don't usually have a higher gear they just rely on consistency of performance to pull them through.(by the end of the year they are so honed you know what Melb at their best have to offer)

Manly under Des on the other hand have been known to find an extra gear at the right time of the year.

 

[G-land Express]

Fainu saved the game last night at the end of golden pt 1st half when he busted his guts to get back and dive on the ball with papenhouzen right behind him. Him and turbos combo last 2 weeks is opening teams right up and are they're playing some of the best footy we've played in ages. Manly has so many combos going now we could win the comp for sure. Hopefully havent peaked too early.

 

[Snake]

Can't tell if you're trolling with your comments or maybe you're just lonely and need some attention? Fainu is very impressive and is a massive reason why we are 5th. It's his first full year and he's already being sounded out to play origin. This dribble about not being fast doesn't mean **** when he's breaking every other tackle and creating opportunities for faster players. Also your comments about Tom and whether he wants to be talked about as one of the greats... Where you been man? He's already being talked about as one of the greatest ever, and with good reason. The only thing that would make any sense here is if you are Trent Barrett or Api koroseau

Fainu chased down Gutherson last week...he is not slow at all...he is just beautifully balanced and plays with so much time so it looks like he is not exerting himself too much...he is fast.

 

[Bring back the.... Biff?]

Time will tell, agree to disagree, i'm rarely wrong though in observations.

He out played scam last night he killed him around the ruck smith couldn't bring him down and tired him nicely. Fainu is like another halfback at hooker any way hes a gun and like old mate said above is the form hooker at the moment. In supercoach he doubled scams score. Walker also out played munster the current origin and probably Australian 6. Top effort last night!

 

[Technical Coach]

I've never seen it used before but I can believe that it has already been trotted out because it is pretty transparent...

I share my opinions and observations with heavy hitters in the NRL circle and they seem to think they are quite astute... you are the anomaly so what does that tell you about your knowledge?

Tells me nothing but obviously it tells you everything because you rely on the validation of others.

I was called a fool here to keep harping on that i think Walker will do well at 5/8 with the same old same old "look he performed shyte at 5/8 already here and at Souths", "look we had to put J.Lyon in to save our season that proves Walker is not up to it" etc etc.

I don't care what others think, i state an opinion so be it, and state my views before it becomes light as day(which makes you look crazy and so way off the mark at times)

 

[KOMORI]

The issues i have are 80% about his defence that get overlooked because of "some" of the good things he does in attack.

The team as a whole has been defending and covering each other very well which makes it harder to expose a weakness---that doesn't mean there are no weaknesses.

Melb without Cronk and Slater are not going to effectively target weaknesses as good as the past, in saying that you can only judge in the present and Melb are still the benchmark.

No idea why pundits and commentators keep harping on about Melb having an extra gear to go to, Melb don't usually have a higher gear they just rely on consistency of performance to pull them through.(by the end of the year they are so honed you know what Melb at their best have to offer)

Manly under Des on the other hand have been known to find an extra gear at the right time of the year.

I see where you’re coming from.. and Fainu may have some defensive shortcomings: compared to Api. However, having him as opposed to Api in the defensive line does_not_leave_us_weak!!

We are still one of the best defensive units in the competition, and aside from some lazy lapses (that can’t be attributed to Fainu alone!) we generally present a hell of a strong line to any attack. More points are scored against us via kicks than through breaking the line. And I’m not sure I’ve seen Fainu left grasping at a jersey having failed on our line... have you?

 

[Snake]

Tells me nothing but obviously it tells you everything because you rely on the validation of others.

I was called a fool here to keep harping on that i think Walker will do well at 5/8 with the same old same old "look he performed shyte at 5/8 already here and at Souths", "look we had to put J.Lyon in to save our season that proves Walker is not up to it" etc etc.

I don't care what others think, i state an opinion so be it, and state my views before it becomes light as day(which makes you look crazy and so way off the mark at times)

If Des thinks what I think, I'll take that as a pretty safe indication that I know what I am watching.

In saying that, I like that you are willing to back your judgement and many of your observations are quite insightful.