Bah bah sacked and De Belin charged

[The Who]

Agree re the snake precedent. But I wonder if most people facing charges like de bellend get bail, or are kept on remand?

DeBellin is so well known that the judge ruled he was not a flight risk.
I'd suggest most people facing such charges would also get bail, with strict reporting conditions. Remember, no evidence has been tested in court yet. All we are hearing is what the Crown will allege.

 

[Cliffymagic]

De belin should be stood down imo until he is proven innocent. These charges are bloody serious bussiness.

 

[Ron E. Gibbs]

Anything Peter FitzSimons says or writes is a) probably bull****, b) has probably been written or said by somebody else first, and c) is almost certainly aimed at promoting rugby union at the expense of rugby league. He is an agenda-driven wanker of the highest order, and no matter how many times he uses the word "dinkum" in an attempt to sound like a good, old-fashioned Aussie bloke, he is, in fact, an elitist twat. But gee, he looks great in that bandana, doesn't he?
He's just one of the many who still owe Brett Stewart an apology.

 

[wombatgc]

If only Walker had Cleever Green representing him. He’d be off scott-free, racking up and raring to go.

 

[SeaEagleRock8]

Yes it's a tricky one. Maybe they can rewrite the code of conduct, or the standard NRL contract, with a clause that says if you are charged with an offence and are subsequently found guilty than you forfeit any wages accumulated between the date of the offence and the date of the guilty verdict if you choose to continue to play on during that period.

That's a tad harsh, everyone is entitled to the presumption of innocence and to take their case to trial when accused.
And you should be entitled to earn a living while ever you are innocent.
edit - to clarify, 'innocent until proven guilty'.

 

[Chip and Chase]

That's a tad harsh, everyone is entitled to the presumption of innocence and to take their case to trial when accused.
And you should be entitled to earn a living while ever you are innocent.

Well it's semantics I suppose. Are you really "innocent" of a crime in the period between committing the crime and being found guilty ?? They can keep their right to presumption of innocence and work as much as they like, but if they are found guilty then the presumption of innocence is gone, as should their right to have earned a living.

 

[MadMarcus]

Back on topic . . .
The calls are growing for the NRL to suspend Debellin until the outcome of his court case is known. While I can understand the outrage I can't agree with the suspension call.
Yes, he is facing an extremely serious charge, but he has pleaded not guilty and is therefore innocent until/if he is proven to be otherwise.
If the NRL did impose such a suspension for all those facing a court charge imagine the consequences. We'd have players on 'minor' traffic violations/unpaid taxes/affray/theft, public urination etc. suspended until they had their day in court.
IMO we must let the court system do its job and not expect the NRL to interfere until the player has his chance to put his side of the story - and be tested and judged in a legal manner.

You would also be encouraging bogus claims against players.

Imagine Parra were about to face [insert random team] in the GF and a few weeks earlier a female Parra fan had a consensual dalliance with [insert random team’s star player(s)]. It’s ****ed up I know, but that’s enough motivation for some to cry rape, and they could easily have enough evidence to have charges laid.

 

[MadMarcus]

Well it's semantics I suppose. Are you really "innocent" of a crime in the period between committing the crime and being found guilty ?? They can keep their right to presumption of innocence and work as much as they like, but if they are found guilty then the presumption of innocence is gone, as should their right to have earned a living.

You could express it as a fine equal to the amount of pay the player earned during the period after they were charged. I think the concept is a good one.

 

[yokahontas]

That's a tad harsh, everyone is entitled to the presumption of innocence and to take their case to trial when accused.
And you should be entitled to earn a living while ever you are innocent.
edit - to clarify, 'innocent until proven guilty'.

Totally agree that everyone is entitled to the presumption of innocence etc. However, we had a discussion at work the other day about being stood down in the interim, and how many other professions would basically suspend you (generally with pay) if you were facing serious charges like de Belin’s.

I’m an ambo, so of course the first job mentioned was paramedic - no way you’d be working on road with those charges pending. Teachers, cops, ADF personnel...there are plenty of occupations where you would be given an impromptu holiday, either due to the nature/reputation of the organisation, or because your job involves contact with the general public/kids/ other vulnerable populations.

I don’t think you can rightly suspend someone without pay, given the right to the presumption of innocence. But I do think that de Belin and co. should be stood down, and the idea of then fining them the amounts paid while suspended (if found guilty) certainly has merit. If you’re not guilty, sweet - you keep the money, and your employer did the right thing for your welfare by giving you the time off to properly prepare your defence away from the public eye.

 

[sheridanstand78]

Under firstly Gallop and Greenturd, our game has gone backwards, both should be tried for crimes against rugby league!!! lol

 

[SeaEagleRock8]

Well it's semantics I suppose. Are you really "innocent" of a crime in the period between committing the crime and being found guilty ?? They can keep their right to presumption of innocence and work as much as they like, but if they are found guilty then the presumption of innocence is gone, as should their right to have earned a living.

No, if you haven't been proven guilty and you are still carrying out work (or available to) then it is not fair to end up retrospectively having worked for a year or more for nothing. If you are later convicted of an offence then the law imposes a penalty and your boss will probably sack you, but I can't think of any other scenario where convicts have to repay wages earned while on trial. Too harsh C&C!!

 

[MissKate]

However horrifying I find these allegations against JDB, I still can’t forget just how terrible it was for Snake and how in some idiot’s eyes he is still guilty. It all but ruined his career and life, he has been slightly broken ever since and that breaks my heart. I would hate to see someone else go through that if innocent. However hard it is to see him be allowed to play. In saying all that however JDB also put himself into this situation and in doing so has brought the game into disrepute so there is some validity in a suspension

 

[EOL now nesting on the GC]

So apparently he can play until he's either cleared or found guilty.

What's this mean for D Walker? Has he pleaded yet or is that to come?

 

[Frogz]

Means nothing for Mr Walker. All relies on the outcome of the court case now. (I am led to believe).

Don't think Walker is suspended by the NRL is he???.

 

[manlyfan76]

We should have suspened Walker from when it happened untill the second trial.

 

[HappilyManly]

Walker also pleaded not guilty, but we will know more after Feb 26 court date

 

[manlyfan76]

If De Belin IS found guilty how big a fine should St merge get?
Also what fine have the cowboys got over the barba incedent?

 

[Chip and Chase]

No, if you haven't been proven guilty and you are still carrying out work (or available to) then it is not fair to end up retrospectively having worked for a year or more for nothing. If you are later convicted of an offence then the law imposes a penalty and your boss will probably sack you, but I can't think of any other scenario where convicts have to repay wages earned while on trial. Too harsh C&C!!

Well I'd imagine that in most instances a person would know whether they are guilty or not - they choose to take the odds on fighting the charge in the hope that the money they spend on some lawyer will get them off. Might be some incentive there for them to plead guilty if they know that they will forfeit wages earned in that same period ?? might also help stop the court system being clogged with cases.

Anyway that's all a discussion for another day - my suggestion wasn't for the general public it was for the specific cases of NRL players being charged with serious crimes and dealing with the how you can balance their rights to a fair trial and the rights of the game not to be brought into disrepute.

 

[Woodsie]

The only thing I haven't yet read in this Deja Vu fest and political-correct-virtue-signalling reach-around is .... who is concerned and looking after DeBellin's welfare ..... the important thing is Jack and his young family ......

FMD .... we have had 3 of these incidents evey year for the past 10 years and we are still wringinging hands and talking the same dribble ......

 

[yokahontas]

The only thing I haven't yet read in this Deja Vu fest and political-correct-virtue-signalling reach-around is .... who is concerned and looking after DeBellin's welfare ..... the important thing is Jack and his young family ......

FMD .... we have had 3 of these incidents evey year for the past 10 years and we are still wringinging hands and talking the same dribble ......

If there’s any truth to these allegations, then screw Jack de Belin’s welfare. His fiancé and unborn child, sure - on second thoughts, maybe the NRL should be suspending him without pay, and putting those $$$ aside to support them while he does time (if convicted, of course)? But if he’s done any part of what’s alleged then he’s the lowest of scum and will get what’s coming to him, and zero sympathy from me. Ditto Barba, Hayne, Walker, Musgrove, Coleman, and any others I’ve missed in that list.

Who’s bending over backwards to support de Belin’s park footballer co-accused, BTW? Or does his lower profile also mean his welfare doesn’t matter as much?