Patience

[Kalvin]

Let's be honest.. we historically always start the season slow and I was expecting 1/4 at best regardless of the injuries/draw!

Although yes there has been some concerning signs early.. but hopeful we iron them out and make a run by halfway of the season (and maybe jag a few wins in between). As bad as we were last night... we still could have won it at 14-12

 

[Mitch]

Let's be honest.. we historically always start the season slow and I was expecting 1/4 at best regardless of the injuries/draw!

Although yes there has been some concerning signs early.. but hopeful we iron them out and make a run by halfway of the season (and maybe jag a few wins in between). As bad as we were last night... we still could have won it at 14-12

This is spot on. That’s why I’m prepared to have patience until Tom is back and we get out of this first month of footy (playing 3 genuine contenders in Roosters, Rabbit, Panthers.

 

[Simonmyers11]

Well I can say I saw some positives - the attack was terrible - DCE 's form is horrid. Davey's loss is hard to take especially given he had to tidy up a horrible DCE pass and because I honestly think/thought he brings the attitude we desperately need and he looked like he would make a huge difference. We made way too many basic errors - a team out of form must hold onto the ball - just criminal making those stupid errors especially loose carries while getting tackled and in the ruck. But the forwards were good, the effort in the main was there - we didn't just lie down and get run over. I agree with Snake when you train all off season and then there are significant injuries just before round 1 and then after round 1 and during round two - Turbo, Sironen, Davey that is going to significantly impact on the side's attacking play as well as the workings of the defence. If those injuries were after 10 or 15 weeks - well into the season we might be in a better position to handle them because the team would have been used to each other by then and used to Foran and the style of play we now want to play and certainly more used to the slide defence strategy. I am guessing we haven't just changed our defence from up and in - to slide but I gather our attack has changed to accommodate Foran. That all takes time to gel. Only having 1 trial is a problem and has caused the clunkiness along with the injuries. I get the not wanting to get injuries but 1 trial - crazy! I still say Croker is not the man at hooker - still say it was stupid to put Walker at fullback essentially meaning you take our best centre by far and use him to plug a gap which then creates a massive issue at centre. Still say Keppie and Boyle are just plodders. Davey was a shining light - now gooorne. Let's get Walker to Centre - Harper to fill in until Turbo gets back, Cust to Hooker, Guacomle to second row when he returns, Turbo back in hopefully two weeks, Garrick out for Funa/Harper/Tippytoes - anyone, Sironen back. I read that Cust was injured - not sure what happened there. I must say it is disgraceful that we as supporters are having to look for some light in a dark tunnel. We expect more from this club and this team. We are used to quality and excellence and the performances to date are not acceptable. There are reasons but some of the reasons were preventable - ie no trials, right selections but we now need action - action on the field. Now is not the time to want to sack Des, blame the Penns, blame the salaries of high profile players, whinge about Fainu's lack of replacement bla bla bla. Now is about us getting behind this club and Des and the players digging us out of this mess. We still have a bloody decent side albeit needing some changes with the players we do have... not the ones we dont - injures/suspended or not even on our roster. One last thing - Des didn't throw any of those disgraceful passes, Des didn't drop the ball as he got up to play it, Des didn't miss those tackles. Des needs to pick the right players for the job - but those 17 players - well 16 because Davey was blameless - those 16 players need to be the ones taking full responsibility. The players need to get some grit and just go back to playing simple no frills footy until they get the confidence back and that means - smash it into the middle for three - a play to one side for 4, another smash it in or a scoot from dummy half for 5 - then kick and do it over and over - error free and DCE must take the line on directly - not sideways. The Titans on Friday night pretty well did just that - forwards smashing it and I mean smashing it in and it was just a simple game plan. Do you think Terry Randall, Ian Martin, Eadie, Kosef, Toovey etc would be looking for someone/something else to blame?

Sucks big time re Davey. I also love his attitude and is a real goer. Underated. I would put him ahead of siro and Jetski. When is the last time Siro ran a hole, broke the line eyc. Quac cannot come back from injury quick enough. No wonder we are chasing Matterson (thinking siro replacement)

 

[jbb/james]

Patience . I see that as irony. The biggest issue with our team for years has been patience or lack of it, led by DCE.

We also need to be pattient as we have another 3 years of this awful contract and accept mediocrity because unless we can find another couple of million for our cap his contract will ensure we do t have the cattle to ever do anything but compete ad hoc

In the mean time we are going to continually lose the players that you can build a decent squad with

Blaming our bit players as opposed to the main men is not the answer

How are we going to replace a 6 on forans money, upgrade the shcusters of the world and still add the other elements

patience is hearing every excuse known to man or woman about why DCE didint play well AGAIN. FFS this year its supposedly the hooker

Be patient by all means but lets not live in denial.

I believe in DES. I believe we have some talent , I also believe the DCE Is a dead weight on and off the field as a halfback and a leader of men. He can play well if everyone else provides the platform , but as the halfback it is his job to be a major part of providing that platform.

Why do so many just flat out ignore the job he is hired to do

 

[Brisbane Tragic]

Sucks big time re Davey. I also love his attitude and is a real goer. Underated. I would put him ahead of siro and Jetski. When is the last time Siro ran a hole, broke the line eyc. Quac cannot come back from injury quick enough. No wonder we are chasing Matterson (thinking siro replacement)

yes agreed - Sirro was a great hole runner - just not sure what has happened there

 

[Spartan Eagle]

Well I can say I saw some positives - the attack was terrible - DCE 's form is horrid. Davey's loss is hard to take especially given he had to tidy up a horrible DCE pass and because I honestly think/thought he brings the attitude we desperately need and he looked like he would make a huge difference. We made way too many basic errors - a team out of form must hold onto the ball - just criminal making those stupid errors especially loose carries while getting tackled and in the ruck. But the forwards were good, the effort in the main was there - we didn't just lie down and get run over. I agree with Snake when you train all off season and then there are significant injuries just before round 1 and then after round 1 and during round two - Turbo, Sironen, Davey that is going to significantly impact on the side's attacking play as well as the workings of the defence. If those injuries were after 10 or 15 weeks - well into the season we might be in a better position to handle them because the team would have been used to each other by then and used to Foran and the style of play we now want to play and certainly more used to the slide defence strategy. I am guessing we haven't just changed our defence from up and in - to slide but I gather our attack has changed to accommodate Foran. That all takes time to gel. Only having 1 trial is a problem and has caused the clunkiness along with the injuries. I get the not wanting to get injuries but 1 trial - crazy! I still say Croker is not the man at hooker - still say it was stupid to put Walker at fullback essentially meaning you take our best centre by far and use him to plug a gap which then creates a massive issue at centre. Still say Keppie and Boyle are just plodders. Davey was a shining light - now gooorne. Let's get Walker to Centre - Harper to fill in until Turbo gets back, Cust to Hooker, Guacomle to second row when he returns, Turbo back in hopefully two weeks, Garrick out for Funa/Harper/Tippytoes - anyone, Sironen back. I read that Cust was injured - not sure what happened there. I must say it is disgraceful that we as supporters are having to look for some light in a dark tunnel. We expect more from this club and this team. We are used to quality and excellence and the performances to date are not acceptable. There are reasons but some of the reasons were preventable - ie no trials, right selections but we now need action - action on the field. Now is not the time to want to sack Des, blame the Penns, blame the salaries of high profile players, whinge about Fainu's lack of replacement bla bla bla. Now is about us getting behind this club and Des and the players digging us out of this mess. We still have a bloody decent side albeit needing some changes with the players we do have... not the ones we dont - injures/suspended or not even on our roster. One last thing - Des didn't throw any of those disgraceful passes, Des didn't drop the ball as he got up to play it, Des didn't miss those tackles. Des needs to pick the right players for the job - but those 17 players - well 16 because Davey was blameless - those 16 players need to be the ones taking full responsibility. The players need to get some grit and just go back to playing simple no frills footy until they get the confidence back and that means - smash it into the middle for three - a play to one side for 4, another smash it in or a scoot from dummy half for 5 - then kick and do it over and over - error free and DCE must take the line on directly - not sideways. The Titans on Friday night pretty well did just that - forwards smashing it and I mean smashing it in and it was just a simple game plan. Do you think Terry Randall, Ian Martin, Eadie, Kosef, Toovey etc would be looking for someone/something else to blame?

Great post! But you're missing footnotes and a bibliography.

 

[Tomay]

Things open up for us after round 4 in terms of the draw. I always thought we would be 1 from 4 but was expecting a bit better especially in defence. We are lucky that we are using the tough part of the draw to find our combinations and form. It always takes a while, especially on the edges with Foran, Davey, GoJetski, Saab all rotating in (and out). We are also settling into a new defensive philosophy of utilising the slide.When I tip at the start of the season I always look for the most settled sides rather than the hyped ones.

The hope is that we can sort things out during these 4 weeks and set the season up. We can't afford any more injuries and we need Cust or Croker to really turn into a viable starting calibre hooker. I have faith that DCE will find some form over this period and that our defence will improve. I have no idea what Turbo is going to be able to produce after the injury run he has had, I'm not expecting him to slot in and save the day and he shouldn't be expected to.

On the bright side the left edge attack looks dangerous with Foran taking the line on, when the combination settles down I expect this side to be pretty lethal in attack. Hopefully on the right they can work out how to get Suli early ball and DCE can calm down. We have some great young middle forwards coming through in Paseka and Keppie while Aloia looks like a solid enough signing.

 

[Red Pill]

Remember
No Turbo
No Fainu
No Lawton
No Siro
No Olakau-atu
Davey and Cust played 5 minutes each.
Thats a pretty considerable injury toll to come up against a heavy weight in the competition. We aren't as far off as people think! It simply comes down to we have NO starting 9 and NO back up fullback... add to that a significant injury toll only 2 rounds in!

I agree with snakes post however we should have been able to beat south’s when Reynolds was taken off the field. DCE is badly out of form and this most likely lost us the game yesterday.

 

[mickqld]

Heartbreaking for Davey mate. Really great story him making his debut at 28. RL can be Really cruel at times. Hes got a bit of mongrel in him. He will be missed, no doubt he will be back though.

You know why he got injured. He was trying to straighten the attack from another piss poor confused DCE pass and therefore had to run at an unbalanced awkward angle which led to that sort of tackle.

 

[anthonyb1965]

You know why he got injured. He was trying to straighten the attack from another piss poor confused DCE pass and therefore had to run at an unbalanced awkward angle which led to that sort of tackle.

 

[susan]

Hi Sue,

Not in the same league atm but I honestly think a few key players returning will balance the side and we will play a lot better.

This is how I see it. ALL our attack and structure is still based on either Foran or DCE creating something standing flat footed, its predictable and easy to read, slow and both are not in good form, especially DCE but they can turn it around.

Unlike the other top sides, currently we have no strike or ball playing options from the edge back row. Look at Penrith, Rooster, Parra, Melbourne, Raiders etc A perfect example is Broomich from Melbourne. Constantly a threat on the edges and engages the defence and plays a link for his outside backs. We need more of this.

We have no strike from our full back. Tom back is like another 5/8 as well. He plays on both sides, gets into dummy half. So much attack revolves around him.

No hooker. These are game managers in their own right. Cook, Grant, Api. Api controls a lot of the play at panthers. Engages the defence, keeps them guessing. Is a constant threat. We are desperately missing this. Currently crocker just passes to Foran or DCE and expect them to do something, but its so easy to read. There is no depth in the attack. No running game either.

Walker needs to return to centre. Suli needs to get involved like Matai did. Come looking for the ball. Wind up and take a hit up first off the ruck.

We lack go forward from the back 3 to get us on the front foot.

This can all be fixed, we have the squad. Just about getting the side onto the park and building. We don't have depth to be competitive if players are out. DCE needs to lift big time.

I think our young kids coming up and success of junior rep sides augers well. My issue is we are playing football and making selections circa 2019.
The game is about playmakers playing fast and flat on the advantage line in the middle third with players around the ball left and right - then using speed on the edges to take advantage.

Our playmakers catch it deep and flat footed and our forwards, despite trying hard , rarely run with support. Our centres ( at least the ones we select )are slow and our edge forwards lack speed and agility as well

.Paseka played like the top sides forwards play yesterday - hard at the advantage line looking both sides but there was rarely anyone on his hip except when Marty scored.

We can play whoever we like in our side but if we keep playing this brand of footy and picking slow players it’s pretty irrelevant.

The 9 and 1 issue could end up great or terrible depending on Manase and Tom’s issues - but the planning around it, given it was totally foreseeable, has been awful and that is very dissapointing given how vital the positions are.

Positives - Shuster , Sione Fainu, Tutevakie, Koula , Weekes and quite a few others in the future.

Speed and agility to burn which is tailor made for modern game.Let’s hope when they are ready in the next couple of years our style is different.

btw anyone counting on two points against dragons is getting way ahead of themselves. Hook started the youth and speed outlook at panthers and there is a lot of pace in that dragons side. They played good footy last night and will be clear favourites.
Big test for us for sure.

 

[Simonmyers11]

Patience . I see that as irony. The biggest issue with our team for years has been patience or lack of it, led by DCE.

We also need to be pattient as we have another 3 years of this awful contract and accept mediocrity because unless we can find another couple of million for our cap his contract will ensure we do t have the cattle to ever do anything but compete ad hoc

In the mean time we are going to continually lose the players that you can build a decent squad with

Blaming our bit players as opposed to the main men is not the answer

How are we going to replace a 6 on forans money, upgrade the shcusters of the world and still add the other elements

patience is hearing every excuse known to man or woman about why DCE didint play well AGAIN. FFS this year its supposedly the hooker

Be patient by all means but lets not live in denial.

I believe in DES. I believe we have some talent , I also believe the DCE Is a dead weight on and off the field as a halfback and a leader of men. He can play well if everyone else provides the platform , but as the halfback it is his job to be a major part of providing that platform.

Why do so many just flat out ignore the job he is hired to do

You know Im a big fan of DCE but I was even left very disappointed with his performance yesterday, but as my previous post suggest, its the whole set up starting with the delivery from hooker and standing too flat. Surely Dez needs to address this as well. No excuses for that performance, I honestly think that is the worst I have seen from him. I still hold faith when Tom returns, Walker to centre, Quac to back row, Faniu or Cust to hooker and these guys can actually stay on the field we can and will improve big time. A team can turn things around quickly by snagging a win and gaining some confidence and go on a run. Still only 2 games into Forans return as well.

 

[Simonmyers11]

I think our young kids coming up and success of junior rep sides augers well. My issue is we are playing football and making selections circa 2019.
The game is about playmakers playing fast and flat on the advantage line with players around the ball in the middle third and using pure speed on the edges to take advantage.

Our playmakers catch it deep and flat footed and out forwards rarely run with support. Paseka played like the top sides forwards play yesterday - hard at the advantage line but there was rarely anyone in his hip except where Marty scored.

We can play whoever we like in our side but if we keep playing this brand of footy it’s irrelevant.

I actually think we are playing too flat, and because our edge forwards are nil effective and we dont run up in numbers, or support the ball carrier in numbers DCE and Foran are easy targets. Tom back offers so much in attack, his speed alone gets on the outside of defence and creates something. Also plays on both sides, gets into dummy half etc. A good hooker also engages tired forwards before passing to the halves. Our halves need to stand a little deeper and catch it running onto the ball, and have outside backs or middle/edge forwards running with them so the half back has options. We seem too predictable, too slow, no threat around the ball carrier. All can be fixed still believe we have the squad to be effective. Just need them all fit playing in their preferred positions

 

[susan]

I agree it LOOKS like we are playing flat because our playmakers are flat footed and forwards have zero momentum

By playing flat I mean with the top sides the 6 and 7 are hitting the advantage line at pace and looking to offload deep into the defence to runners with support.The distribution on the money plays is happening in front of the ruck.This can only come from quick play the balls -something we just don’t seem to realize is important.

In other words they are in motion and hunting over the advantage line - not just standing and waiting (like we do ) to receive the pass in what could be called in the old parlance a “flat” position in relation to the dummy half.
One thing I do know - if you have slow players you will lose. That is the essence of the game now, love it or hate it. We are the slowest team in the comp in terms of the players we select. Can we change that ? Yes. Will we ? Who knows.
If we keep picking a slow backline we will get the spoon , I have no doubt.

Cust helped this for his ten minutes. If Des didn’t see that I suggest he was asleep.

 

[Simonmyers11]

I agree it LOOKS like we are playing flat because our playmakers are flat footed and forwards have zero momentum

By playing flat I mean with the top sides the 6 and 7 are hitting the advantage line at pace and looking to offload deep into the defence to runners with support.In other words the distribution is happening in front of the ruck.This comes from quick play the balls -something we just don’t seem to realize is so important.

In other words they are in motion and hunting over the advantage line - not just standing and waiting line we do to receive the pass in what could be called a “flat” position in relation to the dummy half.

Cust helped this for his ten minutes. If Des didn’t see that I suggest he was asleep.

100%. It is so easy to see. Is this coached or just getting it wrong in the field. DCE always looks crap just throwing him a ball with defence up in his face. Yesterday, so often he was thrown the ball and had to dummy to the centre or edge forward because they also were standing flat footed right next to him. Nothing doing at all. Look at Penrith, they all run onto the ball and hit the advantage line with speed. They start deeper though, Api holds the opposition up and then goes out the back to a running forward or running Cleary or Jarome.

I honestly think this is the biggest problem. Put a cook or Grant in at hooker who hold the ball out in front and think run first, or then if that doesn't work fire a nice ball out in front of a running half who has options to go to a running centre or forward. A good hooker and Tom back will transform the attack. Just get DCE deeper and have the forwards and backs running onto it. Cannot do much about Crocker, replace him with Cust until hopefully Faniu returns.

 

[susan]

100%. It is so easy to see. Is this coached or just getting it wrong in the field. DCE always looks crap just throwing him a ball with defence up in his face. Yesterday, so often he was thrown the ball and had to dummy to the centre or edge forward because they also were standing flat footed right next to him. Nothing doing at all. Look at Penrith, they all run onto the ball and hit the advantage line with speed. They start deeper though, Api holds the opposition up and then goes out the back to a running forward or running Cleary or Jarome.

I honestly think this is the biggest problem. Put a cook or Grant in at hooker who hold the ball out in front and think run first, or then if that doesn't work fire a nice ball out in front of a running half who has options to go to a running centre or forward. A good hooker and Tom back will transform the attack. Just get DCE deeper and have the forwards and backs running onto it. Cannot do much about Crocker, replace him with Cust until hopefully Faniu returns.

Have to disagree slightly
DCE and Foran need to be hitting advantage line off quick play the balls with support - we aren’t quick enough in my book to play off deep halves.DCE stands way too deep for kicks also... but that’s a slow play the ball issue too.

Everything else I agree with totally

I think Tom with Manase equals

Friend/ Teddy
Pappy / Cheese
Latrell/ Cook
Hodgson/ hyphenator

They are that good.Throw in Lawton and we start to look ok in the spine, although Foran worries me with his body.

And Cust , unlike Croker , has upside. Possibly dramatic upside. His attitude is fantastic.

 

[frank stokes]

I think Tom with Manase equals

... a fun night out on the Corso that ends in somebody getting stabbed...

 

[Sheikheagle]

I think our young kids coming up and success of junior rep sides augers well. My issue is we are playing football and making selections circa 2019.
The game is about playmakers playing fast and flat on the advantage line in the middle third with players around the ball left and right - then using speed on the edges to take advantage.

Our playmakers catch it deep and flat footed and our forwards, despite trying hard , rarely run with support. Our centres ( at least the ones we select )are slow and our edge forwards lack speed and agility as well

.Paseka played like the top sides forwards play yesterday - hard at the advantage line looking both sides but there was rarely anyone on his hip except when Marty scored.

We can play whoever we like in our side but if we keep playing this brand of footy and picking slow players it’s pretty irrelevant.

The 9 and 1 issue could end up great or terrible depending on Manase and Tom’s issues - but the planning around it, given it was totally foreseeable, has been awful and that is very dissapointing given how vital the positions are.

Positives - Shuster , Sione Fainu, Tutevakie, Koula , Weekes and quite a few others in the future.

Speed and agility to burn which is tailor made for modern game.Let’s hope when they are ready in the next couple of years our style is different.

btw anyone counting on two points against dragons is getting way ahead of themselves. Hook started the youth and speed outlook at panthers and there is a lot of pace in that dragons side. They played good footy last night and will be clear favourites.
Big test for us for sure.

Agree Dragons were very good and played attractive footy. They will be warm favourites..

 

[Mark from Brisbane]

If the club is smart there will be a decent cleanout at the end of this year.

Youth , speed , game management and attitude, desperately needed.

Some of these current players wouldn’t make the cut elsewhere.

I fear we are now absolute favourites for the spoon, in our 75th year.

Maybe our two missing stars ( missing for different reasons ) might make a difference.

 

[sheridanstand78]

You can make a million and one excuses. 11 defeats from our last 12 games is damming. During this period we concede on average 32 points a game.

What is lacking in this team is discipline. With and without the ball we make it so much harder by not completing sets, not getting repeats which is crucial, turning the ball over from a mistake and conceding straight away. It is a pattern that needs to be broken.

When you are in this position it comes to playing a no frills brand to get the basics in place which means we need our halves to finish off sets. We need to show greater resilience in the tougher times. This team wilts far too easily for my liking!

The beauty of our game is there always is next week and a chance to atone. We play the Dragqueens and our record in Wollongong is abysmal! No time like this game to start getting the basics right!