Too much speed?

[1978]

Having watched too much football over the past month, I was struck by the importance of powerful, yardage wingers who play like an extra prop in a team's 25. Think Daniel Tupou at the Roosters, the best winger in the game IMO. He takes the tough second carry in their 25, consistently bends the line like a prop (more so than some of our middles!), and then plays like an elite winger in other parts of the field. He's almost two players in one. Xavier Coates is another.

In contrast, we have Saab, who is a fast but a terrible yardage winger. And Hopoate, a star in the making, but not yet powerful enough to bend the line consistently (he does well, though, for his size). I remember when his father was essentially a third prop for us coming out our 25 and a very handy winger in attack.

I love our team's speed, but have we traded off too much power in the backs? I suspect Christian Tuipuloto would add more value to our team currently than Saab, given our need for more power / hard running coming out of our 25.

 

[double hoops]

No such thing as too much speed. Speed and weight equals power. Is your argument really that our wingers are too light?

 

[Brookie1973]

Having watched too much football over the past month, I was struck by the importance of powerful, yardage wingers who play like an extra prop in a team's 25. Think Daniel Tupou at the Roosters, the best winger in the game IMO. He takes the tough second carry in their 25, consistently bends the line like a prop (more so than some of our middles!), and then plays like an elite winger in other parts of the field. He's almost two players in one. Xavier Coates is another.

In contrast, we have Saab, who is a fast but a terrible yardage winger. And Hopoate, a star in the making, but not yet powerful enough to bend the line consistently (he does well, though, for his size). I remember when his father was essentially a third prop for us coming out our 25 and a very handy winger in attack.

I love our team's speed, but have we traded off too much power in the backs? I suspect Christian Tuipuloto would add more value to our team currently than Saab, given our need for more power / hard running coming out of our 25.

Not sure if it’s been deliberate, but we seem to have always preferred fast wingers over hard running bigger bodies, going back over many years. Apart from Hoppa and maybe Jorge Tafua, I can’t think of many in the latter category over the years. Maybe Tom Mooney. But we do like our speed men out wide - wolfman, Robertson, Elsegood, stuey Davis, Ronson, Simon Booth, dale shearer, Saab. In the modern game we do seem to lack hard runners “coming out of yardage “ but I must admit I’ve always liked our speed threat out wide. It gives us a point of difference and fear factor when you have genuine speed.

 

[Waz13]

No such thing as too much speed. Speed and weight equals power. Is your argument really that our wingers are too light?

Bozo response incoming “speed kills”!

 

[1978]

No such thing as too much speed. Speed and weight equals power. Is your argument really that our wingers are too light?

Good point Double Hoops, but Saab is the comp's fastest winger and big at 105kg, yet lacks power. To'o at Penrith is much slower than Saab and 97kgs, yet far more powerful in yardage.

Clearly, power does not always equal speed and weight! Body shape, height and eagerness for collision are other factors.

 

[manlyfan76]

Thought we signed Dougy the pizza boy.

 

[Jimmie]

Talau and Hoppa are good at coming out of yardage for different reasons. Talau runs hard Hoppa has good footwork at the line and almost always pokes his nose through. Saab just needs to aim up mentally and believe in his size and strength. He will get there. If anyone is unsure how to bring the ball out of yardage watch some old footage of Eadie .

 

[Brookie1973]

Bozo response incoming “speed kills”!

He may surprise us and turn it into a meme.

 

[349]

Saab is one of the fastest if not the fastest wingers in the comp, that’s his skill, Too is a yardage winger but not fast. If your defence is good and your halves kick well then your back three don’t have to return from their try line. Tommy not injured is the key to an imposing back 3.

 

[Ohgeez]

All I got to is Daniel Tupou best winger in the comp. Wow, that’s certainly a hot take…

In all seriousness it would be great to have a winger like To’o but this isn’t a big problem in our team I don’t think

 

[Briza]

speaking of speed, how good was our smaller and speedier pack last weekend.

 

[LeonardCohen]

Having watched too much football over the past month, I was struck by the importance of powerful, yardage wingers who play like an extra prop in a team's 25. Think Daniel Tupou at the Roosters, the best winger in the game IMO. He takes the tough second carry in their 25, consistently bends the line like a prop (more so than some of our middles!), and then plays like an elite winger in other parts of the field. He's almost two players in one. Xavier Coates is another.

In contrast, we have Saab, who is a fast but a terrible yardage winger. And Hopoate, a star in the making, but not yet powerful enough to bend the line consistently (he does well, though, for his size). I remember when his father was essentially a third prop for us coming out our 25 and a very handy winger in attack.

I love our team's speed, but have we traded off too much power in the backs? I suspect Christian Tuipuloto would add more value to our team currently than Saab, given our need for more power / hard running coming out of our 25.

I think you’ve made some astute observations and we are definitely not good enough out of yardage. I also agree that Tupou is grossly underrated. He’s probably not the stand out best winger but he’s consistently been up there as exceptional and his work out of the back field is superb.

Where you lost me though, is Christian T. We had him at Manly and although he is powerful when barging over, he’s also very slow and used to struggle turning to chase kicks, was poor under the high ball and incapable of turning half chances into tries when space opened up because he was easily run down by the defence.

I’m no fan of Saab but I wouldn’t swap him for Christian ‘show me the money even though I’m only a fringe first grader who scores tries off the back of my teammates work’ Tuipulotu.

 

[mave]

Not sure if it’s been deliberate, but we seem to have always preferred fast wingers over hard running bigger bodies, going back over many years. Apart from Hoppa and maybe Jorge Tafua, I can’t think of many in the latter category over the years. Maybe Tom Mooney. But we do like our speed men out wide - wolfman, Robertson, Elsegood, stuey Davis, Ronson, Simon Booth, dale shearer, Saab. In the modern game we do seem to lack hard runners “coming out of yardage “ but I must admit I’ve always liked our speed threat out wide. It gives us a point of difference and fear factor when you have genuine speed.

Scott Donald can't get a mention over these slow pokes?

Danny Moore, another champion, that gave me heart attacks every weekend.

 

[mave]

And, when did Chris Hicks fade into obscurity?

 

[Brookie1973]

Scott Donald can't get a mention over these slow pokes?

Danny Moore, another champion, that gave me heart attacks every weekend.

Forgot all about Donald. From memory we didn’t have a great team back then, so I don’t think he ever really got the chances he should have. Still quick though, you’re right. Moore was a centre. I was just talking wingers.

 

[mave]

Forgot all about Donald. From memory we didn’t have a great team back then, so I don’t think he ever really got the chances he should have. Still quick though, you’re right. Moore was a centre. I was just talking wingers.

Are we talking about Premiership winning Winger, Danny Moore?

Sure, played more centre....was always on the wing for mine.

 

[Eagle eye]

Tony Williams was a 120kg wing bulldozer when he first came to Manly.