The Shoo

[frank stokes]

He is either the best 2nd rower we have .. or he isn't
He is either the best 5/8th we have .. or he isn't
He is either the best centre we have or he isn't

Love him and his potential .. (and before the hissy fitters start I know he is young, 1st season yadayadayada ) .. but why are people guaranteeing him a spot in the starting side ... if he is as good as we think he is .. it wouldn't be a discussion..

And just because Foran has signed next year also doesn't lock him in as the starting 5/8th ... again. if the shoo is good enough he should be able to dispose off a broken down geriatric with ease ..

I agree with your sentiment but I also think he is one of very few contenders (besides Guac obviously) for the role he is currently playing... Who are our other ball-playing forwards on an edge?
Burbo? Maybe...
Bullimore? He is a middle isn't he?
Jake? Too slow
Froggy? Not sure he has the ball skills
Walker? Potentially but he lacks size...

Even if he is better at 6 than Foz it may not as easy to fill his current role as it is to play them the way Des has...

 

[Highflier]

I don’t think schu can simply “lose 10kg”. He is a big guy, and possibly still growing.

I said combined weight loss of Schu and Walker of 10kgs not just Schu If Schu did lose 10kgs it would only be because he has a dream to change sports and compete in the 2024 Olympics in the 10,000 meters or possibly the Marathon.
Anyway I still think we have enough forward stocks to put him in the centers and unleash his attack ,before he moves in to Foz's spot

 

[manlyfan76]

Cody Walker won the game for Souths on Friday night

What did Foran do?
What is Foran going to do differently next year? He hit his ceiling high imo this year and it wasn't good enough against the top teams.

Des needs to put Schuster at 5/8th next year with Foran as backup. Schuster has amazing hands and talent, how about he is given a chance to show it.

Agree, Foran was good this year without being great, look at the top teams, the 5/8's all have a good round game AND X factor

 

[manlyfan76]

I agree with your sentiment but I also think he is one of very few contenders (besides Guac obviously) for the role he is currently playing... Who are our other ball-playing forwards on an edge?
Burbo? Maybe...
Bullimore? He is a middle isn't he?
Jake? Too slow
Froggy? Not sure he has the ball skills
Walker? Potentially but he lacks size...

Even if he is better at 6 than Foz it may not as easy to fill his current role as it is to play them the way Des has...

Lawton?

 

[frank stokes]

Lawton?

Yes he probably could... personally I think he is our 9 if Fainu is still out tho...

 

[Woodsie]

I agree with your sentiment but I also think he is one of very few contenders (besides Guac obviously) for the role he is currently playing... Who are our other ball-playing forwards on an edge?
Burbo? Maybe...
Bullimore? He is a middle isn't he?
Jake? Too slow
Froggy? Not sure he has the ball skills
Walker? Potentially but he lacks size...

Even if he is better at 6 than Foz it may not as easy to fill his current role as it is to play them the way Des has...

I personally don't have a preference for what position he plays .. my gut feel is that talk of him dropping weight is optimistic and will only get more difficult as he gets older .. I think that is just his body style .. I like him as a ball playing back rower and as he becomes more "seasoned" will be a huge asset .. but to be given the space and be successful he needs the middle forwards to have more grunt than they have this year with the interchange strategy we employed ...

Anyway ... he is a good problem to have ..

 

[frank stokes]

I personally don't have a preference for what position he plays .. my gut feel is that talk of him dropping weight is optimistic and will only get more difficult as he gets older .. I think that is just his body style .. I like him as a ball playing back rower and as he becomes more "seasoned" will be a huge asset .. but to be given the space and be successful he needs the middle forwards to have more grunt than they have this year with the interchange strategy we employed ...

Anyway ... he is a good problem to have ..

Yeah we are singing from the same song sheet on this one @Woodsie

 

[court83]

Just remember that Parker and harper are just 24yo

I get that... Burton is 21 and has been consistently tops all year long..

I'm not saying Parker and Harper are crap.. they aren't..they are solid footy players.. but I think we need more than just good solid footy players.
Jamie Lyon was 19 when he dominated the comp as a centre.. we need someone like that, with X factor and not just solid basic footy skills..
Easier said than done I know, but Walker is better than both by a huge margine imo

 

[Rocky]

Ide be willing to give Shuster a shot at centre if he drops a few kgs.. look at Burton for penny, another half playing centre and killing it..

I think we need 2 new centres and a hooker next season if we want to go one better...

Parker Harper and Croker are tradesman... Not bad, but have 0 X factor .. there's nothing there that makes teams watch out for them specifically.

You need spark in atleast 1 of those positions... Storm have grant/cheese/Olam all killing it, all dangerous .
Penrith have API and Burton killing it
Damien cook rips teams to shreds, and even as an old man gagai is still dangerous..

Parker and Harper have 0 impact unless everything's going their way, Croker did a solid trademan job but had zero impact..
We can't sit on our hands and hope the NRL let's fainu play while waiting for his trial (newsflash... THEY WONT)
We have the talent in the props
The backrow is great with Ben turbo and de Louis in the mix too..
DCE is good, Foran does his job and our wingers and fullback are deadly...

Ide like to see Walker and Schuster get first shot at centres, train Lawton at 9 all offseason and look for a decent 9 (even a rookie, I don't care, as long as it's not a f@$king makeshift halfback -5/8 doing the role

Agree that we need to think closely and examine the centres. We can probably have one in but not both of Harper and Parker
I think Harper has the potential to get better while Parker has probably reached his ceiling.

6 weeks ago Harper was seen to be a good defensive centre and was scoring his fair share of tries. Perhaps his first full season in first grade wore him down late in the campaign like some of our other youngsters.
I'm keen to see how he goes next year.

 

[The Who]

Sign Foran to sit on the sidelines - dear oh dear. That might happen at some point between now and never, inside a stadium filled with flying pigs.

He is already signed. Get your facts straight.
What I'm saying is that Manly needs to improve 10% or more in order to be true premiership hopefuls next season. Foran is one player who won't improve. Kapow is another, and probably Parker and Froggy.
Where do we get that improvement from? Certainly from younger players such as Guaca, Tent, Keppie and Wasabi. But the biggest potential improver is The Shoe, who is an attacking genius when unshackled by the role of having to make 30 tackles a match. That is my point: Foran won't improve the team but The Shoe could by a change in positions. I presume you do want Manly to win the comp next season, not just finish fourth?
... and as for paying players to sit on the sidelines, that happens every year. I give you Davey, Lance, SirLoin, Tenterfield, Con, Tippytoes... the list goes on. All were signed with the best of intentions but injuries and other circumstances intervened.
We have Foran for next season but that doesn't mean he should automatically play every match, especially when it means blocking the obvious talent of The Shoe. Play Foran when injuries strike, but use his knowledge to help the coaching staff and his experience to mentor young players. The money would not be wasted.

 

[Kevinward777]

He is already signed. Get your facts straight.
What I'm saying is that Manly needs to improve 10% or more in order to be true premiership hopefuls next season. Foran is one player who won't improve. Kapow is another, and probably Parker and Froggy.
Where do we get that improvement from? Certainly from younger players such as Guaca, Tent, Keppie and Wasabi. But the biggest potential improver is The Shoe, who is an attacking genius when unshackled by the role of having to make 30 tackles a match. That is my point: Foran won't improve the team but The Shoe could by a change in positions. I presume you do want Manly to win the comp next season, not just finish fourth?
... and as for paying players to sit on the sidelines, that happens every year. I give you Davey, Lance, SirLoin, Tenterfield, Con, Tippytoes... the list goes on. All were signed with the best of intentions but injuries and other circumstances intervened.
We have Foran for next season but that doesn't mean he should automatically play every match, especially when it means blocking the obvious talent of The Shoe. Play Foran when injuries strike, but use his knowledge to help the coaching staff and his experience to mentor young players. The money would not be wasted.

Foran was certainly not our problem this year. If you think he was, then I don't know what to say. Last season all the know it all's were crying out for a steady foil to take the pressure off DCE, and Foz has done that and more.

Now, after coming fourth with a very young side - the ironstines want to punt Foran. An experienced player with a calming influence. I'm sure he will be thrilled with a talking role on the sidelines. Bloody genius! We have more obvious areas that need strengthening. Thankfully, Des has started to fix them.

A lot can and will play out during the offseason. If Foz can give us another year like this one - he'll be playing 5/8 again, and rightly so.

 

[Rocky]

Foran was certainly not our problem this year. If you think he was, then I don't know what to say. Last season all the know it all's were crying out for a steady foil to take the pressure off DCE, and Foz has done that and more.

Now, after coming fourth with a very young side - the ironstines want to punt Foran. An experienced player with a calming influence. I'm sure he will be thrilled with a talking role on the sidelines. Bloody genius! We have more obvious areas that need strengthening. Thankfully, Des has started to fix them.

A lot can and will play out during the offseason. If Foz can give us another year like this one - he'll be playing 5/8 again, and rightly so.

Yeah I don't get why the knives are out for Foran. He was everything you have outlined above. Spoiler alert...he also wasn't the one making a heap of errors and not the one playing a part in the forwards not getting on top in the middle.

Sure he has an expiry date which isn't too far away but he's probably got another good year in him.

Of course the Schu is the future at 6...but as it stands for 2022 I much prefer the Scenario where the Schu goes to centre, Foran stays at 6 and we get some more grunt in the forwards in the Schu's second row spot.

 

[manlyfan76]

Yeah I don't get why the knives are out for Foran. He was everything you have outlined above. Spoiler alert...he also wasn't the one making a heap of errors and not the one playing a part in the forwards not getting on top in the middle.

Sure he has an expiry date which isn't too far away but he's probably got another good year in him.

Of course the Schu is the future at 6...but as it stands for 2022 I much prefer the Scenario where the Schu goes to centre, Foran stays at 6 and we get some more grunt in the forwards in the Schu's second row spot.

I think Foran was good, but also when we were struggling I wanted more and better tactical kicking from him. When one half is struggling the other steps up.
Also the games when DCE was out I thought he was steady when we needed great.
Other than those two points he done good.

 

[Heckenberg]

I don’t think schu can simply “lose 10kg”. He is a big guy, and possibly still growing.

I also think this is why he’s so dangerous. If he learns to dig deep into the line like Foran but also has those soft hands to send it out the back last minute he’s gonna be unstoppable.

 

[court83]

Agree that we need to think closely and examine the centres. We can probably have one in but not both of Harper and Parker
I think Harper has the potential to get better while Parker has probably reached his ceiling.

6 weeks ago Harper was seen to be a good defensive centre and was scoring his fair share of tries. Perhaps his first full season in first grade wore him down late in the campaign like some of our other youngsters.
I'm keen to see how he goes next year.

Ide accept that . I agree Parker's had about 4 seasons now to prove himself and while he had a solid season this year, I find he adds absolutely zero threats to opponents.. ok, hes good at getting Garrick away on the mid field sweep plays, but apart from that does sweet fa.. maybe Harper and Walker can be nxt year's centres.. but Harper needs to improve to keep his spot long term..

 

[skull61]

Whilst I agree about his undoubted talent I think he tended to crab across field a little too much towards the end of the season maybe fatigue or carrying injuries I don’t know but needs to straighten up a bit more next year

 

[The Who]

Yeah I don't get why the knives are out for Foran. He was everything you have outlined above. Spoiler alert...he also wasn't the one making a heap of errors and not the one playing a part in the forwards not getting on top in the middle.

Sure he has an expiry date which isn't too far away but he's probably got another good year in him.

Of course the Schu is the future at 6...but as it stands for 2022 I much prefer the Scenario where the Schu goes to centre, Foran stays at 6 and we get some more grunt in the forwards in the Schu's second row spot.

My knife is not out for Foran. But common sense should tell you that he is not going to improve next season, and we need to improve to win the comp. If we didn't have an alternative then Foran's tenue wouldn't be mentioned. But we have a potential game-changer in The Shoe. Why wouldn't you give him a try at 5/8?

 

[Snake]

I’d rather keep him down an edge and put Ben T in the centres if we are unhappy with Harper. I doubt much will change though unless injuries force Hasler’s hand.

Schuster’s development as a ball playing option would be significantly hampered if he was one in from the wing. He’d have one guy to pass the ball to and that’s it. At back row he can be used to link with Tom, his centre or hit the winger long. Way better for his potential move into the 6 jumper.

 

[Remy]

I love Foran and he's had an impressive season and I do hope he gets his fairytale with us. But Schuster needs to move in and lock into the 6 position sooner rather than later. Keeping a youngster locked onto one side that's played most of their juniors as a half, can hinder his growth. The dude is our future 6, he's our star, he's had this year to take in what it's like to play FG and finals footy, with Foz alongside him as his mentor. It's time for Schu to move into his natural position so he's ready to lead the club into the future.

 

[XV-1]

I’d rather keep him down an edge and put Ben T in the centres if we are unhappy with Harper. I doubt much will change though unless injuries force Hasler’s hand.

Schuster’s development as a ball playing option would be significantly hampered if he was one in from the wing. He’d have one guy to pass the ball to and that’s it. At back row he can be used to link with Tom, his centre or hit the winger long. Way better for his potential move into the 6 jumper.

That selector called injuries was pretty good for us in 2021.
I hope we don't need to use him in 2022.

Des has some large decisions to be made on how best to improve Schuster and Ben T and really don't want injuries to Foran and/or our centres to drive that point.

A whole pre-season of Josh at either 5/8th or 2nd row will greatly improve his chances for a superb 2022.