The big Debate - Centres ?

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I accept your comment there Will. Defense is important and I didn't suggest it wasn't. I was merely suggesting that if you are going to win premierships you must have a collection of top attacking players in your side. You'll find that the teams that defeated us in 2021 also had top attacking backs. Look down the list of teams and you'll find those who don't have good backs don't win games. Defense can be learned. Attack, the type I'm referring to, is innate. You're born with it. Parker, for all his efforts will never develop the skills of a Koula, Turbo, Schuster, DCE and maybe Weekes, though that is yet to be fully seen. He will try hard and as I said wont let you down. Defensively he is outstanding and I've often suggested he'd make a good lock. However as we've already seen, Seibs seems to be hopefully addressing the defensive issues in this side ( I always felt the forwards were not sufficiently committed to work as a group under Des and he consistently had his backs congested, leaving gaps out wide). Defense is about every player doing his part. Attack is often the genius of a few outstanding backs.
I agree that attack is more of an innate skill than defence but defence often comes more easily to those with a certain attitude towards the game. The ideal situation is to have players that are good at both but when concessions have to be made defence wins.

Excellent defence and average attack can win you a game in many different ways and you can take a lot of the chance out of the game.

If you have excellent attack and average defence you'll end up in a lot of shootouts where the bounce of the ball decides who wins.

Good defence helps your attack more than good attack helps your defence.
 
Certainly take interest in some diversity of views but really can not see how some of the negative assessments of Saab actually translates into any major on field deficiencies .and stress the point major Doubt if the club would have given him an extension for , was it an additional 3 years , if his overall playing form and input was again in any serious way deficient or even partly . All facets of his general play improved or gradually improved last season before his unfortunate injury . Made a point also previously that he and Garrick would be two of the better wingers fielding attacking kicks successfully in an opposition's in goal . Always some room for improvement in any footy player , including Saab but credit where credit is due , He has picked up his game over time and just hope that he can resume again with the same good standard before his injury last season .
 
Certainly take interest in some diversity of views but really can not see how some of the negative assessments of Saab actually translates into any major on field deficiencies .and stress the point major Doubt if the club would have given him an extension for , was it an additional 3 years , if his overall playing form and input was again in any serious way deficient or even partly . All facets of his general play improved or gradually improved last season before his unfortunate injury . Made a point also previously that he and Garrick would be two of the better wingers fielding attacking kicks successfully in an opposition's in goal . Always some room for improvement in any footy player , including Saab but credit where credit is due , He has picked up his game over time and just hope that he can resume again with the same good standard before his injury last season .
It will be interesting to see if there has been any speed loss with the injury. Given that's his biggest weapon, that would not be good. Not being pessimistic coz players have come back from knee surgery relatively fine, so hopefully all will be good. The other thing is having the confidence to jump for the high kicks. Again, given that's how he sustained the injury. Anyway, still some time to go yet.
 
It’s close between Parker and Koula as to who would be the first Centre picked. Parker’s never really been an issue at Centre for mine. The issue has been that people expect him to be an explosive fast agile attacking type player, when his mo is more a solid defender, strong hole runner and great decoy line runner (arguably the best at that).

There’s a reason why he’s in the left as well as that’s generally where you need your stronger defenders as it’s alway marking up on the opposition 7s side.

Parker has many other great attributes as well for the team: great culture guy, hard trainer, prob not on much coin so relatively cheap and we get great value from that.
 
It’s close between Parker and Koula as to who would be the first Centre picked. Parker’s never really been an issue at Centre for mine. The issue has been that people expect him to be an explosive fast agile attacking type player, when his mo is more a solid defender, strong hole runner and great decoy line runner (arguably the best at that).

There’s a reason why he’s in the left as well as that’s generally where you need your stronger defenders as it’s alway marking up on the opposition 7s side.

Parker has many other great attributes as well for the team: great culture guy, hard trainer, prob not on much coin so relatively cheap and we get great value from that.
I agree with everything that you say on Parker @Waz13 I also feel that it's imperative we give Weekes a clear pathway into an outside back position immediately. Either straight into the centres to replace Parker, or onto the wing with Garrick replacing Parker. Either way its an extremely tough call on Parker, but I believe 100% its the right one.
 
It will be interesting to see if there has been any speed loss with the injury. Given that's his biggest weapon, that would not be good. Not being pessimistic coz players have come back from knee surgery relatively fine, so hopefully all will be good. The other thing is having the confidence to jump for the high kicks. Again, given that's how he sustained the injury. Anyway, still some time to go yet.
Hopefully the chances are good for a complete recovery . Guess that it is easy to overlook the confidence factor as well and probably best to ease back gradually to get the recovery right . Should be able to retain his prior speed level and not familiar with general knee issues but again with the right rehabilitation and strength building measures again hopefully all good .
 
It’s close between Parker and Koula as to who would be the first Centre picked. Parker’s never really been an issue at Centre for mine. The issue has been that people expect him to be an explosive fast agile attacking type player, when his mo is more a solid defender, strong hole runner and great decoy line runner (arguably the best at that).

There’s a reason why he’s in the left as well as that’s generally where you need your stronger defenders as it’s alway marking up on the opposition 7s side.

Parker has many other great attributes as well for the team: great culture guy, hard trainer, prob not on much coin so relatively cheap and we get great value from that.
Isn't the right side harder to defend?

Could be wrong, but I see a lot of sides have a far better left side attack. I get the impression that it may be because right handed player find it easier to pass out to the left, and its' also the zone where running five eights are attacking especially when on the red zone. Although this may be just junior grades. Souths and Panthers are probably the best examples of that lethal left side attack which is opposite to where Parker defends.

Have a look at 'NRL Try Location Analysis 2023 | NRL Stats | https://www.statsinsider.com.au' is has some stats on try scoring locations. Tries on left side are more common with most teams.

Back on point, Parker has really come on in the last year alongside with Croker, but they're both approaching their limits as players, and younger more talented players with far higher ceilings are fast approaching. Both are safe for now but it won't be long.
 
Isn't the right side harder to defend?

Could be wrong, but I see a lot of sides have a far better left side attack. I get the impression that it may be because right handed player find it easier to pass out to the left, and its' also the zone where running five eights are attacking especially when on the red zone. Although this may be just junior grades. Souths and Panthers are probably the best examples of that lethal left side attack which is opposite to where Parker defends.

Have a look at 'NRL Try Location Analysis 2023 | NRL Stats | https://www.statsinsider.com.au' is has some stats on try scoring locations. Tries on left side are more common with most teams.

Back on point, Parker has really come on in the last year alongside with Croker, but they're both approaching their limits as players, and younger more talented players with far higher ceilings are fast approaching. Both are safe for now but it won't be long.
How do you know that they’ve reached their ceiling? Under a new coaching regime, they might have a few more gears in their respective repertoires.

Either way, interesting times ahead.:)
 
Isn't the right side harder to defend?

Could be wrong, but I see a lot of sides have a far better left side attack. I get the impression that it may be because right handed player find it easier to pass out to the left, and its' also the zone where running five eights are attacking especially when on the red zone. Although this may be just junior grades. Souths and Panthers are probably the best examples of that lethal left side attack which is opposite to where Parker defends.

Have a look at 'NRL Try Location Analysis 2023 | NRL Stats | https://www.statsinsider.com.au' is has some stats on try scoring locations. Tries on left side are more common with most teams.

Back on point, Parker has really come on in the last year alongside with Croker, but they're both approaching their limits as players, and younger more talented players with far higher ceilings are fast approaching. Both are safe for now but it won't be long.
This is 100% accurate regarding tries scored left as over 80% of ppl are right handed, therefore will pass better right to left and this is obvious from a young age....when coaching junior sides I "try beef up" the right edge defensively with the better tacklers for the exact reason the slicker passing raids will come down that edge and generally, that power edge runner and quick centre will attack that side.
Not much changes at senior level, as the right handed ratio stays the same, though much practice helps the left to right passes, will never be as crisp, accurate and fast as the players favoured right to left (unless a left handed player) or a freak like Andrew Johns, who seemed ambidextrous...

I do also agree Parker in previous seasons hit his ceiling under a stale coaching system, but deserves an opportunity under a new system, as Seibolds structures ect may add to his ability to lift again and I felt friday's game was Top shelf and already a higher ceiling than Ive seen from Parker in 1 game under Seib and Flannery.
Those who love a speedy centre have my full support, but keep in mind at full strength with Tom, Saab, Koula, Garrick and DCE we have more than enough speed to match any other side in the NRL, so maybe that physical presence Parker provides out wide, is a good balance for us as a team ?
I certainly would not look to change anything based on what we all seen against the Dogs and pretty sure Seilbold will be faithful to that side who played some of the better overall footy seen by Manly for a while, however it's fair to have these options, as we want the Top 17 fighting for their spots, not guaranteed !
 
I've read somewhere that Koula is being chased by wallabies, they've offered him 800k. We won't be able to match that.
 

Wallabies hit table with big offer for Koula as Sea Eagles dig heels in​

A bidding war will break out for the young gun.​


SCOTT PRYDE
EDITOR | MARCH 3, 2023 - 5:41PM
6517
https://www.facebook.com/sharer.php...-for-koula-as-sea-eagles-dig-heels-in-141210/
https://twitter.com/intent/tweet?te...ea-eagles-dig-heels-in-141210/&via=zerotackle
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https://www.zerotackle.com/wallabie...for-koula-as-sea-eagles-dig-heels-in-141210/#


As if fending off rival NRL clubs wasn't enough of an issue for the Manly Sea Eagles, it's now clear they will have to also fend off the Wallabies for the signature of Tolutau Koula.
The breakout youngster was one of the revelations of the NRL last year, making his debut in Round 1 before scoring 6 tries in 20 games.
It wasn't his try-scoring ability which he stood out for though, with his silky smooth skills on the ball often putting Manly on the front foot. The centre, who can also play fullback, averaged 121 metres per game and had a strong rookie season defensively as well.
In any season without Jeremiah Nanai in it, he may well have won rookie of the year.

But the Sea Eagles now have a problem.
Koula isn't off-contract until the end of the season, but it's reported the Wallabies are about to up the ante for his signature, with Fox Sports suggesting a figure of around $800,000 per year will be offered as the 15-man national team attempt to built towards the 2027 Rugby World Cup.

It's believed coach Eddie Jones and his recruitment team have plenty of names on the hitlist from the NRL, with previous reports suggesting Cameron Murray could be another one, alongside Wellington-born star forward Nelson Asofa-Solomona.
Joseph Suaalii is also a chance of moving to the 15-man game, while Will Penisini, who scored the opening try of the 2023 NRL season for the Eels on Thursday evening, is another on the hitlist.
But Koula, given his youthful age and the chance of playing in one of sport's biggest tournaments on home soil, could be the NRL's biggest danger of a code swap right now.
$800,000 could see the Wallabies right in the ballpark to steal Koula away from the Northern Beaches, where he will again line up in the centres this year as he attempts to take his game to the next level.
Koula, who played for the Australian Schoolboys in rugby union before switching to the NRL, will be a key target of the Sea Eagles though, with News Corp suggesting they are willing to increase their current offer in an effort to retain him.
That should hardly come as a surprise given his talent, but it's anything but a foregone conclusion, with plenty of other NRL clubs also likely to come to the table from November 1 this year in an attempt to keep Koula in the NRL - just not with the Sea Eagles.
Manly's salary cap position may not allow them a great deal of flexibility on Koula either given Daly Cherry-Evans has re-signed on big money, and both Tom Trbojevic and Jake Trbojevic will be at the club.
While they won't have to shell out a great deal of extra cash heading into 2024 given their off-contract list is skinny, all of Lachlan Croker, Karl Lawton, Taniela Paseka, Josh Schuster and Christian Tuipulotu are off-contract alongside Koula at the end of next year, while the club will also be aiming to bring in a high-profile recruit under new coach Anthony Seibold after a disastrous end to the 2022 season which saw seven straight losses as the Sea Eagles were bundled out of the top eight.
The 2023 NRL Season is here and the Zero Tackle Season Guide is back! Get everything you need, from team lists, fixtures, statistics and a profile on every single player in the competition in our 2023 NRL Season Guide. Available now!

 

Wallabies hit table with big offer for Koula as Sea Eagles dig heels in​

A bidding war will break out for the young gun.​


SCOTT PRYDE
EDITOR | MARCH 3, 2023 - 5:41PM
6517
https://www.facebook.com/sharer.php...-for-koula-as-sea-eagles-dig-heels-in-141210/
https://twitter.com/intent/tweet?te...ea-eagles-dig-heels-in-141210/&via=zerotackle
https://api.whatsapp.com/send?text=...-for-koula-as-sea-eagles-dig-heels-in-141210/
https://www.zerotackle.com/wallabie...for-koula-as-sea-eagles-dig-heels-in-141210/#


As if fending off rival NRL clubs wasn't enough of an issue for the Manly Sea Eagles, it's now clear they will have to also fend off the Wallabies for the signature of Tolutau Koula.
The breakout youngster was one of the revelations of the NRL last year, making his debut in Round 1 before scoring 6 tries in 20 games.
It wasn't his try-scoring ability which he stood out for though, with his silky smooth skills on the ball often putting Manly on the front foot. The centre, who can also play fullback, averaged 121 metres per game and had a strong rookie season defensively as well.
In any season without Jeremiah Nanai in it, he may well have won rookie of the year.

But the Sea Eagles now have a problem.
Koula isn't off-contract until the end of the season, but it's reported the Wallabies are about to up the ante for his signature, with Fox Sports suggesting a figure of around $800,000 per year will be offered as the 15-man national team attempt to built towards the 2027 Rugby World Cup.

It's believed coach Eddie Jones and his recruitment team have plenty of names on the hitlist from the NRL, with previous reports suggesting Cameron Murray could be another one, alongside Wellington-born star forward Nelson Asofa-Solomona.
Joseph Suaalii is also a chance of moving to the 15-man game, while Will Penisini, who scored the opening try of the 2023 NRL season for the Eels on Thursday evening, is another on the hitlist.
But Koula, given his youthful age and the chance of playing in one of sport's biggest tournaments on home soil, could be the NRL's biggest danger of a code swap right now.
$800,000 could see the Wallabies right in the ballpark to steal Koula away from the Northern Beaches, where he will again line up in the centres this year as he attempts to take his game to the next level.
Koula, who played for the Australian Schoolboys in rugby union before switching to the NRL, will be a key target of the Sea Eagles though, with News Corp suggesting they are willing to increase their current offer in an effort to retain him.
That should hardly come as a surprise given his talent, but it's anything but a foregone conclusion, with plenty of other NRL clubs also likely to come to the table from November 1 this year in an attempt to keep Koula in the NRL - just not with the Sea Eagles.
Manly's salary cap position may not allow them a great deal of flexibility on Koula either given Daly Cherry-Evans has re-signed on big money, and both Tom Trbojevic and Jake Trbojevic will be at the club.
While they won't have to shell out a great deal of extra cash heading into 2024 given their off-contract list is skinny, all of Lachlan Croker, Karl Lawton, Taniela Paseka, Josh Schuster and Christian Tuipulotu are off-contract alongside Koula at the end of next year, while the club will also be aiming to bring in a high-profile recruit under new coach Anthony Seibold after a disastrous end to the 2022 season which saw seven straight losses as the Sea Eagles were bundled out of the top eight.
The 2023 NRL Season is here and the Zero Tackle Season Guide is back! Get everything you need, from team lists, fixtures, statistics and a profile on every single player in the competition in our 2023 NRL Season Guide. Available now!

The article is not totally accurate as Koula is signed till the end of 2024, not 2023. Also, there is rumour that Manly are in the process of extending his contract.
 
The article is not totally accurate as Koula is signed till the end of 2024, not 2023. Also, there is rumour that Manly are in the process of extending his contract.
Nrl contracts offer strong protection from players joining other Nrl clubs but even that can be worked around if the player really wants to leave. If a player wants to turn their back on the Nrl then contracts mean very little, a clubs only recourse is to actually take a player to court over breach of contract, a costly exercise, that will at best result in retaining a player who resents the club. Can't remember this ever happening.
 

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