Cross-Forum-Discussion Round 8 2023 cross forums chat

[BroncosHQ.com]

	Cult - broncoshq.com
	JOINED: .October 17, 2013 MESSAGES: 12,285 Reaction Score: 13,298

---

People claiming Mam's tackle was intentional have never played a game of league against a player bigger than them running at speed. When you make a tackle like that you're always going to swing around the player and land behind them.

---

​

 

[BroncosHQ.com]

	Midean - broncoshq.com
	JOINED: .June 5, 2019 MESSAGES: 5,786 Reaction Score: 9,030

---

Maam gets dragged by a bigger stronger bloke and momentum does the rest.
Initially i thought Maams was the worst of the three, but after rewatching it and listening to Brandy break it down, i tend to agree with him.

You can see Maam attempt to dig his feet in the ground to pull the guy up, but didnt have the strength and got dragged into a rear position over his legs.

Absolutely not intentionally dropping his weight on his legs, he is just getting dragged along and physics is doing the rest.

---

 

[BroncosHQ.com]

	BroncosFever - broncoshq.com
	JOINED: .June 6, 2014 MESSAGES: 3,942 Reaction Score: 7,310

---

It gets to a point where the momentum and strength of the bigger man makes it so the smaller guy just can't bring him down and that's when Mam loses his feet, in that situation he's only going to end up in one place and that's on the back of the bigger guys legs.

You can see in the replay Mam was trying desperately to stay on his feet but it just got to a point where he couldn't anymore.

---

 

[NZWarriors.com]

	Since95 - nzwarriors.com
	JOINED: .May 5, 2022 MESSAGES: 396 REACTIONS: 855

---

	Cult - broncoshq.com
	JOINED: .October 17, 2013 MESSAGES: 12,285 Reaction Score: 13,298

---

People claiming Mam's tackle was intentional have never played a game of league against a player bigger than them running at speed. When you make a tackle like that you're always going to swing around the player and land behind them.

---

​

As a smaller person who has played league.for the majority of my life. I can say you can tackle a bigger player and keep your feet behind you when tackling it's entirely possible.

What differs here is Mam isn't trying to stop him by wrapping the legs at all. He's attempting to stop him using his body weight. While continuing to hold on to his waist.

I m also not saying that there won't be cases when a smaller player gets dragged like that but in this case he stuck the contact then remained with the waist and made not attempt to slide down.

Granted it was at speed but you can make legs tackles at speed too.

What it comes down to is the wrestle and the tackler being in a dominant position when the tackle is made and text book bears no advantage. So they don't do it anymore. Coding you do there's an offload or a quick play of the ball coming and you're down a man at the marker. So no incentive to tackle properly.

---

A bit left of field

 

[BroncosHQ.com]

	BroncosFever - broncoshq.com
	JOINED: .June 6, 2014 MESSAGES: 3,947 Reaction Score: 7,310

---

Pretty much every dodgy tackling technique can come back to one thing, if you tackle a guy around the ankles you get no ascendency in the ruck. He gets up and plays it quick, you're not square at marker, away they go.

---

 

[BroncosHQ.com]

	Morkel - broncoshq.com
	JOINED: .January 25, 2013 MESSAGES: 24,269 Reaction Score: 25,523

---

Maam gets dragged by a bigger stronger bloke and momentum does the rest.
Initially i thought Maams was the worst of the three, but after rewatching it and listening to Brandy break it down, i tend to agree with him.

You can see Maam attempt to dig his feet in the ground to pull the guy up, but didnt have the strength and got dragged into a rear position over his legs.

Absolutely not intentionally dropping his weight on his legs, he is just getting dragged along and physics is doing the rest.

If you watch it again you'll see that Mam's actions aren't what brings the Eels player to the ground. He feels the tackler behind him and deliberately drops, he's just milking the ****ing tackle, and doesn't get caught or twisted at all. But he goes down all "Oh no I'm being injured" and when nothing comes of it he's all sweet. It's only after the rest of the entire set that the video ref goes back to it.

And that's why you can't use "injury" to assess danger, because gutless flogs will feign it to get an advantage.

---

 

[NZWarriors.com]

	Since95 - nzwarriors.com
	JOINED: .May 5, 2022 MESSAGES: 397 REACTIONS: 855

---

	BroncosFever - broncoshq.com
	JOINED: .June 6, 2014 MESSAGES: 3,947 Reaction Score: 7,310

---

Pretty much every dodgy tackling technique can come back to one thing, if you tackle a guy around the ankles you get no ascendency in the ruck. He gets up and plays it quick, you're not square at marker, away they go.

---

Basically so unless there is incentive we won't see it back in the game as a fix to the hip drop etc.

The only other fix I see is the tackler hold and then allow themselves to be dragged. Meaning feet stay behind them.

They fixed the cannonball and chicken wing to and extent in a way.

Crusher is a bit different because attacking players turn. If you really wanted to fix that you'd penalize players to turning their backs to the try line or after the spin and are "tied" up they surrender because they have up their right to fight for a meter when they put themselves into that position.

Or the Ref could call held as soon as they turn and multiple players are hold the attacking player.. Could speed the game up though.

---

A bit left of field

 

[BroncosHQ.com]

	Big Pete - broncoshq.com
	JOINED: .March 11, 2008 MESSAGES: 30,278 Reaction Score: 20,720

---

Its a try before the tech to slow it down was around.

Thats how i see it in any case, but i also see the alternative.
There is a reason Joey said what he said.

I just wonder where it ends, as i said earlier, you slow down any play enough you will find an error.

I thought it was a try, and only in super slow motion did it look like he rolled it forward vs simultaneous downward pressure.

I also think the Yow Yeh one was a try though haha.

edit: if you plant a try but at the same time roll the hand over the ball and propel it forward, while simultaneously forcing it with downward pressure, which move is counted first? The downward pressure or the roll forward?

This stuff is all happening in fractions of a second.

The downward pressure.

You couldn't ground the ball like some players do in the field of play without it being a knock on. It's only in the in-goal where you can get away with it.

---

 

[BroncosHQ.com]

	BroncsFan - broncoshq.com
	JOINED: .July 28, 2016 MESSAGES: 14,521 Reaction Score: 21,457

---

If you watch it again you'll see that Mam's actions aren't what brings the Eels player to the ground. He feels the tackler behind him and deliberately drops, he's just milking the ****ing tackle, and doesn't get caught or twisted at all. But he goes down all "Oh no I'm being injured" and when nothing comes of it he's all sweet. It's only after the rest of the entire set that the video ref goes back to it.

And that's why you can't use "injury" to assess danger, because gutless flogs will feign it to get an advantage.

He also faked a head high shot and should've been dragged for a HIA, but apparently that deterrent isn't really a thing... it's just something the pundits like to talk about, even though it barely happens

---

 

[NZWarriors.com]

	jonesy101 - nzwarriors.com
	JOINED: .August 28, 2016 MESSAGES: 1,642 REACTIONS: 6,243

---

The player who gets hip dropped screams in pain, Is that real or acting?

Its always so hard to tell when there is pressure on the leg. Sometimes with those crusher ones you see a miraculous recovery as soon as the whistle is blown which can be frustrating.

One thing we can be sure of is that Regan's pain was 100% legit last night. The sideline commentator said it took him ages to get up some stairs.

---

 

[BroncosHQ.com]

	1910 - broncoshq.com
	JOINED: .April 14, 2013 MESSAGES: 12,825 Reaction Score: 14,670

---

Maybe they have a different five-eighth in mind and didn't want all the media attention to be on them?

Not going to happen this week.

---

 

[NZWarriors.com]

	Dixpat - nzwarriors.com
	JOINED: .February 3, 2014 MESSAGES: 2,791 REACTIONS: 6,268

---

Mam & Haas both charged and will miss 1 game with guilty plea

---

 

[BroncosHQ.com]

	Harry Sack - broncoshq.com
	JOINED: .June 12, 2013 MESSAGES: 11,631 Reaction Score: 12,621

---

	Dixpat - nzwarriors.com
	JOINED: .February 3, 2014 MESSAGES: 2,791 REACTIONS: 6,268

---

Mam & Haas both charged and will miss 1 game with guilty plea

---

Meanwhile Hopgood, cops a fine. Was his second charge too. His was also arguably the most hip drop of the lot. This **** is bonkers.

---

 

[NZWarriors.com]

	mrblonde - nzwarriors.com
	JOINED: .April 13, 2012 MESSAGES: 4,509 REACTIONS: 6,252

---

Basically so unless there is incentive we won't see it back in the game as a fix to the hip drop etc.

The only other fix I see is the tackler hold and then allow themselves to be dragged. Meaning feet stay behind them.

They fixed the cannonball and chicken wing to and extent in a way.

Crusher is a bit different because attacking players turn. If you really wanted to fix that you'd penalize players to turning their backs to the try line or after the spin and are "tied" up they surrender because they gave up their right to fight for a meter when they put themselves into that position.

Or the Ref could call held as soon as they turn and multiple players are hold the attacking player.. Could speed the game up though.

The decision for a referee to call "TACKLE" is based too much on whether momentum has been halted and as players are "Bigger! Stronger! Faster!" (c) 1999 or 2000 Warriors NRL Campaign I Forget Exactly Which, these days, stopping a player's momentum often requires more than one tackler - well, that and the fact that the Storm began the multiple-tackle craze and the NRL never thought to put a stop to it/allow it only in certain situations.
The only reason for one-on-one tackles now - and of course there's players peeling off to allow this to occur so technically it's a one-on-one tackle because there's only one player when the ref yells "TACKLE" but it's not - is the stripping rule.
Maybe something as drastic as a "No off-load in a one-on-one tackle situation" rule or "the attacking player gets to take an extra step in a multiple-tackler situation" rules is required?
Off course, the ultimate rule change would be to ban multiple-player tackles or rule that those don't count as part of the attacking team's Set of Six...

---

The NRL Video Referee Says "WOOF! WOOF!" As It Taps It's White Cane...

 

[BroncosHQ.com]

	Mustafur - broncoshq.com
	JOINED: .June 13, 2019 MESSAGES: 5,379 Reaction Score: 7,758

---

Can anyone at NRL explain how Haas did a hip drop?

Both his feet stayed on the ground, does every ****en injury require a player to blame?

It's stupid, this hip drop **** is ruining the game, because they want to go straight to sin bins for it.

---

 

[BroncosHQ.com]

	I bleed Maroon - broncoshq.com
	JOINED: .April 17, 2013 MESSAGES: 14,129 Reaction Score: 16,518

---

I'm convinced it isn't even really about hip drops specifically at this point. It's exactly like every other "crackdown" we've seen in the last few years: it's the NRL and the coaches playing chicken over who really controls the way the game is played.

---

 

[NZWarriors.com]

	Dixpat - nzwarriors.com
	JOINED: .February 3, 2014 MESSAGES: 2,792 REACTIONS: 6,268

---

	Mustafur - broncoshq.com
	JOINED: .June 13, 2019 MESSAGES: 5,379 Reaction Score: 7,758

---

Can anyone at NRL explain how Haas did a hip drop?

Both his feet stayed on the ground, does every ****en injury require a player to blame?

It's stupid, this hip drop **** is ruining the game, because they want to go straight to sin bins for it.

---

Whether or not it was a hip drop is immaterial there being no specific charge wording for hip-drop but it is a "tackle" that the NRL has previously decreed that wish to stamp out so as to avoid player injury

The charge for Haas is one of Dangerous Contact which is defined in the NRL Judiciary code as

Dangerous Contact
A Player is guilty of misconduct if he carelessly, recklessly or intentionally makes dangerous contact with an opposing player

Accepting that Haas had no intention to injure I'm not sure that any impartial observer would argue that his contact with RCG was not dangerous.

---

 

[NZWarriors.com]

	Since95 - nzwarriors.com
	JOINED: .May 5, 2022 MESSAGES: 399 REACTIONS: 862

---

The decision for a referee to call "TACKLE" is based too much on whether momentum has been halted and as players are "Bigger! Stronger! Faster!" (c) 1999 or 2000 Warriors NRL Campaign I Forget Exactly Which, these days, stopping a player's momentum often requires more than one tackler - well, that but probably more the fact that the Storm started the multiple-tackler craze and the NRL never thought to put a stop to it/allow it only in certain situations.
The only reason for one-on-one tackles now - and of course there's players peeling off to allow this to occur so technically it's a one-on-one tackle because there's only one player when the ref yells "TACKLE" but it's not - is the stripping rule.
Maybe something as drastic as a "No off-load in a one-on-one tackle situation" rule or "the attacking player gets to take an extra step in a multiple-tackler situation" rule is required?
Of course, the ultimate rule change would be to ban multiple-player tackles or rule that those don't count as part of the attacking team's Set of Six...

I agree it leaves it to interpretation.

And it is a cat and mouse the game evolves and new techniques developed to gain the upper hand.

It can be done but on the fly is a bit silly. Like Brandy and Ennis pointed out they don't know what it is. Both coaches were uncertain what it is. So it appears the only people who know sit in the bunker.

---

A bit left of field

 

[BroncosHQ.com]

	BroncsFan - broncoshq.com
	JOINED: .July 28, 2016 MESSAGES: 14,535 Reaction Score: 21,511

---

Raining in Sydney again... has there been a weekend in that it hasn't rained down there yet?

---

 

[NZWarriors.com]

	wizards rage - nzwarriors.com
	JOINED: .April 18, 2016 MESSAGES: 8,667 REACTIONS: 22,421

---

Are those fair dinkum Aussies on the Sharks tops?

---

Smash em bro