Pope Benedict admits evidence for evolution

[Dan]

Well guys, when you are personally contacted please make sure you have some evidence to give me

I like!

 

[Dan]

Dan thinks something so it must be right!!! :lol: :lol: :lol:

What is hilarious is that he argues if was the first one that thought of these things and they haven't been talked about in much more intellectual circles than Silvertails.

Really?
And where do you think I glean my ideas and information on the subject? Thin air?

ID is a ridiculous concept that time and time has been disproven as creationism in a tuxedo. You all sit there believing you know, but not one of you has sat there and read a study, a book or an unbiased discussion on the topic.

The difference here is that I am educated on the matter. You and matas woft indoctrinations, theory and opinion. Until you choose to take the next step to investigate rather than say "Hey I like that idea, therefore I believe in it" then the only true thing that can be said is that I am arguing from known sources, discussed ideas and agreed upon principles.

Just because you like an idea or theory, just because it fits in with other things you believe doesn't mean that it is correct.

My objection to this kind of thinking, ID and Creationism is that it is ****ing lazy, it is limiting to the advancement of technology, science and the human race. It basically says "We dont know the answer, so lets just say this is the answer" how about saying "**** I dont know the answer, but here is an idea that I will test and see what i find along the way"

****ing lazy, stupid and stifling. Grow some balls and admit you may not be right and putting a default in place is lazy and dangerous.

**** I may be wrong, evolution may be wrong, but I am willing to keep testing things until I do know not just accept an answer because there is no other

 

[Narcissus]

You all sit there believing you know

The difference here is that I am educated on the matter.
[/quote]
but I am willing to keep testing things until I do know not just accept an answer because there is no other
[/quote]
How much testing have you, personally, done? I can pretty confidently say that you are have a lot of reading, but do you really understand the concepts that back up what you believe? Or do you at some point say "well, he should know what he's talking about, and others of his ilk agree, so I'm happy to take that". You don't understand the maths behind it all, otherwise you'd be at CERN. Instead, you at some point accept the interpretation of the results (or lackthereof) as 'given'. Just as many believers do: they don't kid themselves into thinking they understand it all but instead turn to someone they trust for the interpretation. It's just that they turn to one person and you turn to another.

Unless of course I'm wrong and you have, in fact, run all of the tests and understood all of the mathematics yourself and come to the same conclusion as the scientists have...

Bah, I can't believe I logged in to jump into this claptrap

 

[Dan]

lol

Narc that is why I value your opinion you at least know some of the ideas posted.

Granted I cant actually test it and can only go on the knowledge of those that can. But I do understand evolution more now than i did say 6 months ago. I understand it on a much higher level and can see exactly why it does not point to a creator or designer.

What now seems impossible through reading the information around me, I now understand how in small stages it can change and come to be. The eye for example is a great example, it seems irreducibly complex, but when you look at it and other creatures around and look at the tiny changes that needed to occur across millions of years, it starts to make sense.

I still have problems understanding say a flagellar motor and it does in fact appear Irreducibly complex but as you look at it in pieces and look at its evolutionary tale and how bacteria infact change and adapt it becomes clearer, but that is the hardest creature out there for me to explain, I know enough to offer that up but I also know that matas would look at that as me admitting defeat and he would instantly say "Uh huh...God did it" which to me is lazy!

 

[Narcissus]

Bah. Bacteria are easy. Try and explain how the hell a skunk doesn't kill itself through suffocation when it sprays... that would be impressive

Maybe I'm a little bitter: we had one hunting around our shed the other day and so I had to stop the lawnmower and take the long way around the house... living in fear for days, hoping it didn't set up shop anywhere near us!

 

[Dan]

come on that is simple to explain....

but nice diversion

 

[Narcissus]

Well, I'm not the one that diverted the thread in the first place, so I don't think I've done much harm...

 

[Dan]

the thread was about ID and and the dressed up creationism.

I responded in suit

 

[Narcissus]

I disagree. There was one line that mentioned ID (being separate to creationism, whether you like it or not) and as Gronk pointed out, it was a jump for the reporter to conclude that...

The thread was about the Church's stance on evolution vs. creationism and the fact that the Church is essentially saying "creationism is just a story" (and like I mentioned before, it's not the first time they have said that). The only statement that the Pope makes in regards to God was: "Above all it does not answer the great philosophical question 'where does everything come from?'". 'Where does everything come from?', as far as I'm concerned, is a question pointed more at physics than biology... it's only related to evolution because evolution is obviously built on physics.

Just because you want the Pope's comments to relate to creationism doesn't make it so. I think it's fairly obvious that they were are in regards to physics...

 

[Dan]

nice. will reply after lunch

 

[Dan]

Lincoln, you are a smart guy, read The God Delusion. It is worth it.

The things you have brought up there are answered in the first 4 chapters

 

[Narcissus]

A book published last year addresses the fact that we have differing opinions on what the Pope was referring to the other day?

I find it hard to believe that the book can distinctly specify what he was referring to... that's all that I've brought up, really, as again: the thread is about what the Church is saying about creationism.

Just trying to stay on topic here: the topic being (as far as I can tell) "the Church's stance on creationism", not "... and how their stance on creationism / biology relates to physics".

 

[Dan]

I was referring to the "philosophical" part. The church has often said that the questions of why is not a matter for science and that they should stick to the questions of how. Which is preposterous, why should we stay out of "their" back yard if they wont stay out of "ours"

 

[Matabele]

Dan parrots Dawkins' delusional pre-supposition that theism and evolution are mutually exclusive.

 

[The Gronk]

Knocking down a straw man can be fun.

 

[Dan]

Dan parrots Dawkins' delusional pre-supposition that theism and evolution are mutually exclusive.

If you believe in ID or religion then you do not believe in Evolution.

Sorry matas those excuses wont fly

 

[Narcissus]

Why would you say that Daniel? The Church itself just said that it is RIGHT to believe in Evolution. So, even if we're not thinking by ourselves and letting the Church tell us what to think, then we're still believing in both.

And since when do you get to tell us what we do or do not believe?

 

[Ryan]

Girls have a penis.
Boys have a vagina.

 

[Utility Player]

We know what it takes to support life as we know it.
We know there are a billion billion planets that have the properties to support life
we know life exists on our planet which means 1 in a billion

which if you do the math means through theory at least 1 billion supports life, maybe only half may, but even the biggest improbibilty is scalable to be more and more likely when you put it in perspective.

Sorry mate but how do we know for a fact that there are billion billion planets that have the properties to support life.

From what I have seen in the media scientists get their nickers in a twist when they discover 1 star/planet that may have ice on it which means water which means it could have once supported life as we know it.

 

[Fro]

my cats breath smells like cat food