Modern day “professionalism”

[Sue]

With the current issues at our club over staff / facilities / professionalism I thought it might be an idea to look at it in a sportswide sense.

The modern trend is to have bag carriers for the bag carriers, shiny new facilities with the latest communications and spin doctors to cover every facet.

Cases in point. The Australian cricket team and the Wallabies. When these teams tour there are twice as many staff as players. Our cricket side, in a climate where former strong sides like The Windies, Pakistan and Sri Lanka are in major decline, cannot win a game away from our shores. Players break down every few weeks with teams being unrecognizeable from week to week.The Wallabies not only struggle but the football they play is simply boring despite all these supposed assets at their disposal.

And what about the product itself. Sure the tv coverage is better and the players are fitter, but do we really enjoy the 12 over an hour sledgefests and endless replays like we used to enjoy cricket.

And does the entitlement culture that all these support mechanisms create make the game better. Do they make better men.Players get everything they want , struggle isn’t on the agenda and you can see it in performances when the going gets tough. As soon as the siren goes it’s higs and kisses as the fans skulk out of the ground.

What about our game. Can someone tell me the daily routine of full time salary cap manager given the roster is set and balanced yearly.Do coaches in our game, paid anywhere between 500k and 1.5 million, really need a full time guy to manage something that is vital to him keeping his job the next year. Are they wiorked that hard that they can’t sit down with their assistants regularly and mull over a spreadsheet, come up with recommendations and send it to the board for approval .It’s ludicrous.

Recruitment I can buy as it’s been a big part of sporting success for decades but a lot of this other stuff is just to create a facade of professionalism when the actual results don’t back it up. Ask the Broncos , Parra and Canterbury. The broncos won comps because they had great players and a good coach not because of shiny offices.
I welcome the new football operations cap. It’s one of the few good things to come from the Turd.

Our players are fitter and faster, but our game is predictable and is now played in such a way that a lot of footballers, as opposed to athletes, couldn’t be bothered with it after leaving school.

I lived in the US for a while and was smothered with NFL every winter.Thats the future ladies and gentleman. One hour games that take four hours with more hangers on than an LA rap party.

Maybe our kids will like it. I hope so.

 

[Brooke]

Couldn’t agree more. Tooves was saying similar on Controversy corner the other night. Look at the Great Roster we have. All the lack of resources talk, It looks to me to just be an excuse for Barrett‘s poor results.

 

[manly al]

With the advent of the 24 hour news cycle and almost saturation coverage resulting from the modern computer age and the emphasis on supposed peak performance, i guess some trends are inevitable and especially in the sporting arena but no reason why some excesses or undesirable facets can not be tempered a bit in the name of common sense . I suppose we all contribute to this modern trend in some ways , so there should be some acceptance to some degree as well but again in regard to sporting matters in particular ,individuals are not compelled to allow any less appealing sides affect their overall appreciation or comfort level interest in their chosen sports . Just hope that the present and unsettling issues at Manly can be addressed fairly promptly , it has not been caused by the players or fans or general support base for Manly , [ i am sure that the players are correctly trying to stay in the professional mode and Barrett "s excuses just seem like a furphy ] just need Barrett and some of the club hierarchy to get their act together A.S A P.

 

[Chip and Chase]

I think you just have to accept the world is a different place these days. Kids aren't allowed to "lose" or "fail", well not in an overt manner that may have some alleged lasting psychological effect on them - losers and failures are simply "potential winners" in modern speak. My boys play soccer and they aren't allowed to keep competition ladders or have finals until U13's.

 

[Sue]

Whether Trent is using the facilities argument is up for debate I suppose.

He HAS said repeatedly he wants a salary cap manager and recruitment manager. The first one is a joke given he earns the money he does and the fact that a coach should want to handle those things and it simply would not require too much time.

I agree with him re the recruitment issue. Big part of any club and always has been.

All this stuff is a separate issue, and although it needs to be addressed, does not hide two basic undeniable facts.

1.We have no reliable defensive structure and leak points like a sieve

2 We have no idea in the attacking red zone

I cannot see how anyone can argue with that.

After 3 years these should at least be at a reasonable level regardless of the personal on the field.Salary cap managers and recruitment managers won’t fix that.

 

[StuBoot]

Whether Trent is using the facilities argument is up for debate I suppose.

He HAS said repeatedly he wants a salary cap manager and recruitment manager. The first one is a joke given he earns the money he does and the fact that a coach should want to handle those things and it simply would not require too much time.

.

There is obviously more to "managing the salary cap" than it appears.
I assume it's not just A + B + C x 30 = $9.4 mil

Des "managed" the salary cap in his own special way.
The Eels and the Storm "managed" it in other ways.
How the Chooks do it is another way.

The TPA saga is showing us that it's more of a legal interpretation minefield than a mathematical equation.
Seems they need to be an accountant, actuary and solicitor plus whatever else all rolled into one.
Not a job for the coach.

 

[Sue]

There is obviously more to "managing the salary cap" than it appears.
I assume it's not just A + B + C x 30 = $9.4 mil

Des "managed" the salary cap in his own special way.
The Eels and the Storm "managed" it in other ways.
How the Chooks do it is another way.

The TPA saga is showing us that it's more of a legal interpretation minefield than a mathematical equation.
Seems they need to be an accountant, actuary and solicitor plus whatever else all rolled into one.
Not a job for the coach.

Other than Des all those those examples are basically cheating. A salary cap manager is irrelevant if Bellamy , Poilutis and.co want to cheat.They just tell the “manager “ to shut up.

A lot of these blokes earn close to a million bucks.If they cannot look at players salaries plus TPAs and come up with a strategy to take a club forward then submit it to a board ( who should be on top of the legal stuff ) for approval - then they shouldn’t have the job.

I’d love to see the daily 9am to 5pm duties performed by a full time salary cap manager over a roster that changes once a year. Hope he’s a smoker.

 

[Woodsie]

There is obviously more to "managing the salary cap" than it appears.
I assume it's not just A + B + C x 30 = $9.4 mil

Des "managed" the salary cap in his own special way.
The Eels and the Storm "managed" it in other ways.
How the Chooks do it is another way.

The TPA saga is showing us that it's more of a legal interpretation minefield than a mathematical equation.
Seems they need to be an accountant, actuary and solicitor plus whatever else all rolled into one.
Not a job for the coach.

All good points ... plus the fact that we didn't do real well with the salary cap without a salary cap manager is lost on many ..

But please Punchies ..... don't let the fact that you don't understand the role of someone stop you from being an expert on the topic .... it is enthralling ...

 

[Woodsie]

Other than Des all those those examples are basically cheating. A salary cap manager is irrelevant if Bellamy , Poilutis and.co want to cheat.They just tell the “manager “ to shut up.

A lot of these blokes earn close to a million bucks.If they cannot look at players salaries plus TPAs and come up with a strategy to take a club forward then submit it to a board ( who should be on top of the legal stuff ) for approval - then they shouldn’t have the job.

I’d love to see the daily 9am to 5pm duties performed by a full time salary cap manager over a roster that changes once a year. Hope he’s a smoker.

You must of missed the 50 or so posts saying that Coaches "in the professional era" don't have anything to do with the salary cap or negotiations .... I am sure someone could direct you to the relevant thread ...

 

[Shoe1]

It’s true. The more “professional” and business-like cricket and union have become, the worse the team is is.

I remember Ross windshuttle would run up warringah rd to French’s forest, then down allambie Rd back to brookie after training sometimes on his own, and he had a job, and he was rarely in first grade, yet he had the drive to keep going. It is a different attitude these days.

 

[The Who]

How is it that Souffs are so successful this season?
They have private ownership, a rookie coach, added just one quality player to their roster this season (Gagai), have no Leagues Club, no real home ground, antiquated training facilities (Redfern and Erskineville Oval) . . .

 

[fLIP]

Like Isacc John said in a tweet a couple days ago. At penrith Phil Gould makes the under 20's feel like first graders.

Its ego stroking, pure and simple.

Hot tubs, reclining seat media rooms and snack machines do NOT make a good footballer or team.

 

[HK_Eagle]

How is it that Souffs are so successful this season?
They have private ownership, a rookie coach, added just one quality player to their roster this season (Gagai), have no Leagues Club, no real home ground, antiquated training facilities (Redfern and Erskineville Oval) . . .

Perhaps their demountables tackle better than ours?

 

[Sue]

The biggest joke of them all is this bull**** pedalled by the media that all clubs have dedicated salary cap people and the coaches play no role in it.

Yep. Almost every club in the competition has been fingered for salary cap breaches, many of them major and with obvious intention to deceive. Every day we hear rumours of cap manipulation.

So we are supposed to believe there is an evil band of conspiratorial salary cap managers out there who manipulate the cap while their million dollar bosses go about their every day business.

Coaches are involved up to their eyeballs! And why wouldn’t they be.And for proper purposes as well as the rorters. Their high paying job depends on who is in the roster and how much they are paid. To suggest they leave it all to some rooster in the back office on 100k is ludicrous.And I can imagine all those budding solicitors and accountants jockeying to do this incredibly difficult task.

Back to my original point. It’s just another way to look “professional “ and if the **** hits the fan pass the buck.

 

[Sue]

How is it that Souffs are so successful this season?
They have private ownership, a rookie coach, added just one quality player to their roster this season (Gagai), have no Leagues Club, no real home ground, antiquated training facilities (Redfern and Erskineville Oval) . . .

Barrett’s old assistant maybe

 

[Budgie]

How is it that Souffs are so successful this season?
They have private ownership, a rookie coach, added just one quality player to their roster this season (Gagai), have no Leagues Club, no real home ground, antiquated training facilities (Redfern and Erskineville Oval) . . .

I was going to mention them in a previous thread. When I lived in Newtown I'd see them all turning up to training at Erskineville Oval and think how lucky we were to have the Institute of Sport to train at.

 

[Tomay]

When the NRL as a governing body measures their success on financial goals instead of the overall health of the game you’re going to have problems. It’s too easy for grubby political types to get in power and cut corners while pointing at the bottom line with no concern for the future health of the game, all the while raking in massive salaries that are justified by their abilities to sell the soul of the game to the broadcasters.

 

[Class of 96]

The coaches must have a role to play in the salary cap in that they submit their list of wanted players. From that point the bean counter plugs the numbers into a spreadsheet and says well you can’t have them all, but give me a list of priorities and salary range and we will calculate who can be brought in, balanced of course against the outgoing players and key positions to complement the current playing group. A very important role I see is a list manager (recruitment manager) as they call it in the AFL. The team I follow, Hawthorn, have this stuff absolutely nailed and it’s why they are mostly top of the heap for 12 years.

 

[HK_Eagle]

The coaches must have a role to play in the salary cap in that they submit their list of wanted players. From that point the bean counter plugs the numbers into a spreadsheet and says well you can’t have them all, but give me a list of priorities and salary range and we will calculate who can be brought in, balanced of course against the outgoing players and key positions to complement the current playing group. A very important role I see is a list manager (recruitment manager) as they call it in the AFL. The team I follow, Hawthorn, have this stuff absolutely nailed and it’s why they are mostly top of the heap for 12 years.

Oh how the mighty Hawks have saved me from an otherwise miserable season. And yes, chalk and cheese between the way these two clubs are run

 

[COMMANDER]

If resources and money spent mattered Brisbane would win every year.