Eight man Rugby League does not cut it any more

[Sue]

Been reading a lot of comment about how we need to play given our inexperienced and slowish backline. The obvious way is to keep it tight and play the middle third and grind out a win. Sounds ok and might work for a couple of rounds when attacking sides are rusty but over a season it doesn’t work anymore.

Firstly Rugby League hasn’t changed in that you must assert yourself in the forwards to compete in footy games.Thats a given.

What has changed is, unlike the footy a lot of us grew up with, a dominant pack helps but simply is not enough. The days of owning the middle with the little men like Gibbs, Blake , Alexander etc running amok past tired defenders and brilliant backrowers like Menzies, Gartner, Lindner,Clyde etc cutting a swathe are gone.

Now the middle is like a war zone with 4 fresh forwards ready to plug gaps as legs tire. Locks are now converted props bolstering the middle.And the bench can work against you in another way as well.If you attain dominance in the middle but your 14 to 17 are not flash ( like us in recent years ) your outside men need to take advantage of absolutely every opportunity because that dominance can go very quickly .

The try scoring lists are totally and utterly dominated by three quarters and fullbacks. Second rowers and nippy halves don’t feature anymore.Even the very best like Tomololo and Thurston / Cronk dontvscore anywhere near the tries their peers of yesteryear did.The best sides have 30 to 50 tries between their wingers.Simple as that. I reckon we had about 10 to 20 max.Interesting to note we have one specialist career winger in our top 30 this year. The rest are converted centres.

Last year we often dominated in the middle but could inot finish it off with points and went on to lose. Whether Trent had a preset plan to operate in tight or we simply didn’t have confidence in the outside men is irrelevant. We did not hurt sides out wide off the back of good go forward and lost.

The best example last year was the Cowboys. Great forwards , great halves and a slow aging three quarter line and an injury prone declining fullback. Result was premiership favourites to spoon contender. They look a bit like that this year too.Des had Klemmer Jackson Graham in his last couple of years at Dogs and couldn’t score a try out wide.

The top sides now score almost 30 points a game. This comes off the back of good go forward but mainly speed and power in the centres and a pinpoint kicking game with good receivers and finishers on the edges. You need to score twenty plus points to be in the hunt on most occasions against good sides. That’s just a fact.

Having adequate defenders with limited attack out wide is fine but it won’t win you many footy games in the end. It sounds good and might keep the score respectable but the guys out there need to score points or all the forward dominance in the world is worth nothing.

Guys like Garrick , Hoppa , Anderson may be those sort of guys. I hope so because slow and steady out wide with a good forward pack don’t cut it any more.Im sure Des knows this and we will see a different side and approach in coming years as the rebuild unfolds.

 

[SeaEagleRock8]

I think Suli is seen as having the potential to be an attacking weapon. Parker probably not, I’d say he is holding a position as a ‘steady’ (hopefully) stopgap, until Funa Hoppa and co apply so much pressure they’ll earn their chance.
But yes I agree the top sides have threats across the park, that’s not what we have but what we will try to build towards.

 

[Sue]

Yep. Suli is a candidate for sure if he can get his confidence back and live up to the hype. Has the raw ingredients.
I’m more talking in a general sense, not particular personel. Whoever we pick in the future needs that explosive attacking edge to them and good skills under the high ball defensively and in attack. You just can’t compete without outside backs who have these skills.

 

[Stevo]

Yeah i reckon we will start well but fall away in the 2nd and 4th quarters of the game like we did last year. I still think at this point splitting up Tapau and AFB is the way to go. With Tanginoa and Paskea injured we are probably going to see Perrett in the front row rotation. Des will want to go with experience to start the year. I just can't see us asserting any dominance at all if Perrett and (any other available front rower) are on the field at the same time. It's just so **** to be starting the year having to field your 5th and 6th choice front rowers.

 

[Stevo]

And as far as the backline goes i really just want to see Taufua and Parker be strong in defence. I don't think they have that much attack in them. I just can't see them beating the tigers out wide. I think the dark horse is Suli and Garrick. I think if Suli can break tackles Garrick can be dangerous out wide. But i see this side as being defensively weak. With the players we have out, i guess they have to play Parker. But i feel like the backline would be the 1 place to gamble on a young player. something like this. At least with this there is speed on both sides of the field.

1 Elliot. 2 Taufua. 3. Garrick. 4. Suli. 5. Anderson/Hopoate/Miski

 

[tookey]

If Brad Parker is one of our centres then we are in huge trouble He would be lucky to make NSW cup with most other teams

He had better not slip over on saturday

Some of the comments about playing 10 man football were tongue in cheek based
on the quality or lack of it in our backline

 

[Harvies elbow]

Until we get a reduction in the interchange this will be the trend.
But even if this doesn't happen, enforcing a 3 second play the ball, regardless of where the defence is, like they do now in waiting for them to get back would bring the middle attackers and smaller men back into play.

 

[Stevo]

It's too much to ask with Turbo, Walker, Tanginoa and Paseka out.

We'll lose this and i think we'll lose it badly. We just don't have the cattle.

 

[jbb/james]

Been reading a lot of comment about how we need to play given our inexperienced and slowish backline. The obvious way is to keep it tight and play the middle third and grind out a win. Sounds ok and might work for a couple of rounds when attacking sides are rusty but over a season it doesn’t work anymore.

Firstly Rugby League hasn’t changed in that you must assert yourself in the forwards to compete in footy games.Thats a given.

What has changed is, unlike the footy a lot of us grew up with, a dominant pack helps but simply is not enough. The days of owning the middle with the little men like Gibbs, Blake , Alexander etc running amok past tired defenders and brilliant backrowers like Menzies, Gartner, Lindner,Clyde etc cutting a swathe are gone.

Now the middle is like a war zone with 4 fresh forwards ready to plug gaps as legs tire. Locks are now converted props bolstering the middle.And the bench can work against you in another way as well.If you attain dominance in the middle but your 14 to 17 are not flash ( like us in recent years ) your outside men need to take advantage of absolutely every opportunity because that dominance can go very quickly .

The try scoring lists are totally and utterly dominated by three quarters and fullbacks. Second rowers and nippy halves don’t feature anymore.Even the very best like Tomololo and Thurston / Cronk dontvscore anywhere near the tries their peers of yesteryear did.The best sides have 30 to 50 tries between their wingers.Simple as that. I reckon we had about 10 to 20 max.Interesting to note we have one specialist career winger in our top 30 this year. The rest are converted centres.

Last year we often dominated in the middle but could inot finish it off with points and went on to lose. Whether Trent had a preset plan to operate in tight or we simply didn’t have confidence in the outside men is irrelevant. We did not hurt sides out wide off the back of good go forward and lost.

The best example last year was the Cowboys. Great forwards , great halves and a slow aging three quarter line and an injury prone declining fullback. Result was premiership favourites to spoon contender. They look a bit like that this year too.Des had Klemmer Jackson Graham in his last couple of years at Dogs and couldn’t score a try out wide.

The top sides now score almost 30 points a game. This comes off the back of good go forward but mainly speed and power in the centres and a pinpoint kicking game with good receivers and finishers on the edges. You need to score twenty plus points to be in the hunt on most occasions against good sides. That’s just a fact.

Having adequate defenders with limited attack out wide is fine but it won’t win you many footy games in the end. It sounds good and might keep the score respectable but the guys out there need to score points or all the forward dominance in the world is worth nothing.

Guys like Garrick , Hoppa , Anderson may be those sort of guys. I hope so because slow and steady out wide with a good forward pack don’t cut it any more.Im sure Des knows this and we will see a different side and approach in coming years as the rebuild unfolds.

I dont disagree with anything but

The stats id love to see is how our link men used the ball when we were dominant
Our threee quatrer line had about 75 % or there possesions one out from dummy half at our own end. Manly play was a second rower on the fringes once we got up in opposition territory. Was lane our top try scorer?

The link between forward dominance and outside backs was diabolical
Its very hard to use the backs when the go play is to tommy 2 m behind the attack line. He has to be chiming in and ball playing not playing stand off from behind the team.

The pass the buck to tommy last year was very uncool.

Effective gameplan, accountability and roles were non existent . Id love to see how suli , parker and jorger go outside of a cronk or thurston. Players that make others around them better

Parker might play for qld then based on the vautin rule. Hes red, hes manly hes a kwweeeenzzlanda

 

[Sue]

I dont disagree with anything but

The stats id love to see is how our link men used the ball when we were dominant
Our threee quatrer line had about 75 % or there possesions one out from dummy half at our own end. Manly play was a second rower on the fringes once we got up in opposition territory. Was lane our top try scorer?

The link between forward dominance and outside backs was diabolical
Its very hard to use the backs when the go play is to tommy 2 m behind the attack line. He has to be chiming in and ball playing not playing stand off from behind the team.

The pass the buck to tommy last year was very uncool.

Effective gameplan, accountability and roles were non existent . Id love to see how suli , parker and jorger go outside of a cronk or thurston. Players that make others around them better

Parker might play for qld then based on the vautin rule. Hes red, hes manly hes a kwweeeenzzlanda

Yep that’s the point I was making. Forward dominance isn’t enough these days. You need to use the edges properly and have the firepower out there. Until Tommy got a few late Lane was our top scorer playing edge back rower off the bench!
I’m no wrap on Barrett as a coach but the reason we played like we did was I think he had zero confidence in the outside guys, and probably with good reason. Trouble is the alternative approach he used can’t work in modern football either, especially with a sub standard forward rotation to relieve AFB and Marty .

 

[Mark from Brisbane]

This thread clearly shows how desperately short we are of quality backs outside of our half ( and potentially our 5/8).

There’s few teams ( maybe none) that are worse than we are in the backs.

It was our Achilles Heel in 2018 and is still that in 2019.

We are either going to have to be lucky and have some of the young guns or cheapie newcomers step up or go into the market for some quality in 2020.