Cap Space

[Woodsie]

With 30 players to fit into your cap ... how many stars can one team afford? That is a team without the massive TPA's of Broncos of course.

Manly has ...

1 current Australian International fullback/Centre (Tom T)
1 current Australian International Locke (Jake T)
1 current Australian International Centre. (Walker)
I current NZ International Front rower. (Kapow)
I current NZ International rotation Front rower. (AFB)
I one million dollar halfback. (DCE)

If we get Pearce that will be 7 big money stars ... that is as many head-line acts as any other club.

For me it is easy to see why we don't have much wriggle room.

 

[Kevinward777]

With 30 players to fit into your cap ... how many stars can one team afford? That is a team without the massive TPA's of Broncos of course.

Manly has ...

1 current Australian International fullback/Centre (Tom T)
1 current Australian International Locke (Jake T)
1 current Australian International Centre. (Walker)
I current NZ International Front rower. (Kapow)
I current NZ International rotation Front rower. (AFB)
I one million dollar halfback. (DCE)

If we get Pearce that will be 7 big money stars ... that is as many head-line acts as any other club.

For me it is easy to see why we don't have much wriggle room.

Maybe if we signed Bennett, every player indiscretion could be brushed off with the explanation that “it’s not his go” And we could announce every re-siging with something along the lines of “he loves the place so much he extended for $150k a season.”

 

[slamminsam246]

- Green
- Matai
- Stewart
+ cap increase
= Pearce +

 

[Peter C]

With 30 players to fit into your cap ... how many stars can one team afford? That is a team without the massive TPA's of Broncos of course.

Manly has ...

1 current Australian International fullback/Centre (Tom T)
1 current Australian International Locke (Jake T)
1 current Australian International Centre. (Walker)
I current NZ International Front rower. (Kapow)
I current NZ International rotation Front rower. (AFB)
I one million dollar halfback. (DCE)

If we get Pearce that will be 7 big money stars ... that is as many head-line acts as any other club.

For me it is easy to see why we don't have much wriggle room.

What you say is possibly correct, however our roster apart from Uate, falls down quite sharply after that, especially in the backs

 

[Eagleman]

- Green
- Matai
- Stewart
- large contract upgrades to the Turbos and several other players
+ cap increase
= Pearce +

Noone else probably (but Crichton would be awesome)

 

[Loobs]

- Green
- Matai
- Stewart
+ cap increase
= Pearce +

Matai and Stewart were never part of our 2018 cap calcs as their deals had ended and were presumably soaked up elsewhere.

 

[maxta]

In theory that is a fair call Woodsie - but with the 2m cap increase and money from Snake / Matai there's 3.2 minimum.

I don't buy too much into the International stuff, as most teams have over 5 that come from NSW cup....if we look at SOO (the true indicator of Marquee) - we have 2 players compared to other teams boasting 5 or more.

The buy /sell wipes itself out.
The upgrades are the killer....Turbo Bros, AFB, Uate and others are pretty hefty dollars - but it seems logical there is more in the pot....

I guess when the Pearce sage plays out - will show if there was more money over or not - my money say's there is.

 

[Woodsie]

What you say is possibly correct, however our roster apart from Uate, falls down quite sharply after that, especially in the backs

Apart from Uate, Walker, and Tom T there are only 2 other backs.

Jorge who I don't think is a drop down and Kelly who the jury is still out on. But then again Kelly is only on $160k, and at that price V's potential we are ahead of the game.

I think most of our other players are of equal standard to other teams 2nd echelon players eg. Siro, Api, Lussick et al.

remember we still have a whole host of talented youngens in the wings, a couple of them will soar like an Eagles in the next few years..

 

[Woodsie]

In theory that is a fair call Woodsie - but with the 2m cap increase and money from Snake / Matai there's 3.2 minimum.

I don't buy too much into the International stuff, as most teams have over 5 that come from NSW cup....if we look at SOO (the true indicator of Marquee) - we have 2 players compared to other teams boasting 5 or more.

The buy /sell wipes itself out.
The upgrades are the killer....Turbo Bros, AFB, Uate and others are pretty hefty dollars - but it seems logical there is more in the pot....

I guess when the Pearce sage plays out - will show if there was more money over or not - my money say's there is.

All probable ... but remember that the number of players to fit into the cap increased by 5 to 30, and the minimum wage per player was also increased.

The upgrades are the main factor, Tom, AFB, Kapow, Jake etc, even the coin needed to secure the young talent all adds up.


But Maxta my main point is that after all is said and done, ... fitting 7 major players into your cap is as good as just about all other clubs have done, and as good as I expect.

As far as SOO players being a benchmark I agree, but if I was the argumentative type, which I am not, I would suggest that DCE, Dylan, Tom and Jake were all contenders this year. And I would also suggest that Kapow if eligible would also get a run, add Pearce and that is 6 SOO contenders

 

[maxta]

All probable ... but remember that the number of players to fit into the cap increased by 5 to 30, and the minimum wage per player was also increased.

The upgrades are the main factor, Tom, AFB, Kapow, Jake etc, even the coin needed to secure the young talent all adds up.


But Maxta my main point is that after all is said and done, ... fitting 7 major players into your cap is as good as just about all other clubs have done, and as good as I expect.

As far as SOO players being a benchmark I agree, but if I was the argumentative type, which I am not, I would suggest that DCE, Dylan, Tom and Jake were all contenders this year. And I would also suggest that Kapow if eligible would also get a run, add Pearce and that is 6 SOO contenders

Those minimum players Woodsie take up Approx $400,000.
In the SOO benchmark - Storm have Funucine, Vunivalu , Smith, Slater, Glasby, Bromich x 2, Harris ,Munster Solomona.
Roosters have Napa, Moa, Ferguson, Cordner, Mitchell, Tupou, Hargreaves ...now add Cronk and Tedesco.
Brisbane - Gillett, Milford, Glenn, Boyd, Blair, Maguire, Hunt, Kahu, Thaiday, Oates.
Theres over 10 players of SOO callibre just there and I will add - really don't think Brown, Winterstein or Kelly (simply due to rookie status) would be in many other top 8 teams 17 man team....and their price would be indicitive.
But because like you Woodsie....I don't like to argue - (especially with a poster I rate) - I will agree on something at the same time...
Once Pearce becomes official - there's no room to complain about the roster as an excuse OR other salary caps...

 

[jbb/james]

I also reckon tapow and walkers deals would have been backended. No way did we have that much coin as late as what we signed them. We are moving into year 3 of there contracts so i suspect they are ramping up in dollar values

 

[Woodsie]

Those minimum players Woodsie take up Approx $400,000.
In the SOO benchmark - Storm have Funucine, Vunivalu , Smith, Slater, Glasby, Bromich x 2, Harris ,Munster Solomona.
Roosters have Napa, Moa, Ferguson, Cordner, Mitchell, Tupou, Hargreaves ...now add Cronk and Tedesco.
Brisbane - Gillett, Milford, Glenn, Boyd, Blair, Maguire, Hunt, Kahu, Thaiday, Oates.
Theres over 10 players of SOO callibre just there and I will add - really don't think Brown, Winterstein or Kelly (simply due to rookie status) would be in many other top 8 teams 17 man team....and their price would be indicitive.
But because like you Woodsie....I don't like to argue - (especially with a poster I rate) - I will agree on something at the same time...
Once Pearce becomes official - there's no room to complain about the roster as an excuse OR other salary caps...

I was never really arguing, but you have mentioned the 3 teams with the TPA power and an elastic cap. And of course players are happy to play for peanuts to be there.

Of the other 13 real teams in struggle street fitting 7 highly paid stars into the cap is an excellent result ... and that is my point.

PSS we have no idea how many players are on the minimum .. could be 10 or it could only be 1.

 

[EagleFlys]

This whole discussion is great, but ultimately pointless.

No-one here knows, and for the love of god, none of us can work out what the hell each contract contains.

If Manly can buy dogboy under the cap they will.
The accountants that work for Manly are probably the only ones who really know.

As a CA accountant with an economics degree, a masters in project management, and 3/4's through an MBA, I will say with some certainty that ;

 

[Woodsie]

This whole discussion is great, but ultimately pointless.

No-one here knows, and for the love of god, none of us can work out what the hell each contract contains.

If Manly can buy dogboy under the cap they will.
The accountants that work for Manly are probably the only ones who really know.

As a CA accountant with an economics degree, a masters in project management, and 3/4's through an MBA, I will say with some certainty that ;

I concur .. which is my point ... we have no idea of the details, but we do know one (1) fact ... that each team has to spend 100% of their cap each year.

We can then judge whether we are dopes as some suggest or going good as others believe by seeing how much bang we got for our buck.

And as I said, I think 7 top draw players is a pass mark.

 

[EagleFlys]

I concur .. which is my point ... we have no idea of the details, but we do know one (1) fact ... that each team has to spend 100% of their cap each year.

We can then judge whether we are dopes as some suggest or going good as others believe by seeing how much bang we got for our buck.

And as I said, I think 7 top draw players is a pass mark.

With back ended contracts, and TPA's, that is no certainty either. The futility of us poor sausage roll eating fans knows no limits.

 

[Woodsie]

With back ended contracts, and TPA's, that is no certainty either. The futility of us poor sausage roll eating fans knows no limits.

The spending 100% of the cap is a certainty ... Toddy gives each a club a chq (100% funded by the NRL) for the sum of the cap $8.4m (??)

A club can't then spend only $1m on players and pocket the balance of $7.4m ... that is one of the briefs of the cap auditors to ensure the total is spent.

 

[maxta]

Unless we have access of the auditors- we have no Exact numbers bar what BS the media feed - who can create any number to fit an agenda.
The easiest way to see if Manly have more money under the cap - if Pearce signs -we do...
If he does not - we don’t.
My opinion is we do and he has (will)

 

[Woodsie]

Unless we have access of the auditors- we have no Exact numbers bar what BS the media feed - who can create any number to fit an agenda.
The easiest way to see if Manly have more money under the cap - if Pearce signs -we do...
If he does not - we don’t.
My opinion is we do and he has (will)

If not Pearce it has at least become demonstrably manifest that we have the coinage to make a play for a top liner before next season.

 

[EagleFlys]

TPA

The spending 100% of the cap is a certainty ... Toddy gives each a club a chq (100% funded by the NRL) for the sum of the cap $8.4m (??)

A club can't then spend only $1m on players and pocket the balance of $7.4m ... that is one of the briefs of the cap auditors to ensure the total is spent.

I understand that, but TPA's mean the cap ceiling is limitless to the upside (hello Wayne). However, I don't know how the NRL allocate back ended contracts to the cap. Do they pro rata contract values for the term, or do they allow unders and overs through the years to run?

 

[SeaEagleRock8]

TPA
I understand that, but TPA's mean the cap ceiling is limitless to the upside (hello Wayne). However, I don't know how the NRL allocate back ended contracts to the cap. Do they pro rata contract values for the term, or do they allow unders and overs through the years to run?

Should take into account depreciation for players who become old busted or obsolete.