The Pack ... and the Alpha Male ..

robbiea said:
We get a Klemmer or another big aggressive mongrel & I dont think we even miss good ole "Team ME".For everything he does in attack he lets back with defence or lack of it.Not a team player and boys will "lift" once its a team again.Happy to see the back of him..
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Who?
 
mike walker said:
G'day all,Just expanding on the dog analogy@ Woodsie to balance the squad you don't know anyone who could spare us a couple of Scottish Deerhounds,a Border Collie and an Airedale or two.
cheers mike
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Airedale? You need a bit of intelligence.
I'd go border collies and staffies with a jack Russell at hooker- like Souths have.
 
Ryan said:
I'm a firm believer in having some intimidation, and fear factor. We have great, amazing forwards, but none of them are "angry" (and I mean within the bounds of the rules, not a loose cannon).

That's why when we had some mongrel in Watmough / Matai, with a few others like Horo chipping in from time to time, while our old forward pack may not have been as naturally gifted as this one, they still intilled fear into the opposition.

I go back to Klemmer, basically slapping DCE across the face at Brooky. If that were 2008, he would have been knocked to the ground and rough housed. Look at how the team reacted at Brooky, when Blair took a swing at him. It was on. You couldn't mess with our Manly boys.

Jesus, even Brent Kite punched Michael Crocker in the head - one of the best footy moments ever.

We lack that. And I think that comes down to mateship, first and foremost. Our team isn't a combines unit at the moment. We are individuals (talented, no doubt), in a team, when we should be one complete unit, together.
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Ben Kennedy!
 
Wish I was an alpha male, but I'm more akin to that kid in the back seat of that car ad, that claims :

" and I'm the point fiiiive".

Hahaha. **** I'm depressed 😛 hahahaha
 
Ryan said:
Man was a God amongst men. I heard a story that Travis Burns was whingeing about his non selection in a game by Des Hasler at Brooky Leagues (in the funniest) one night, and BK was in there, and just said, STFU Burnsy, your dribbling".

Totally cut him down. That's leadership. It's about perception I guess.
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Funny!

I know he was only with us a short while but he is one of my all time Manly greats. IMO he taught the young guys coming through at that time what passion was and was a key part in changing the culture following the NE back into the real Manly and the great era that followed. Jeez, I wish we had someone like that now. We need it.
 
Joel has some of the BK qualities, I've seen him try to lift the team with a big hit on occasion and he seems like a good leader off-field. Not quite at Kennedy's level as a player though, BK was a genuine Test/SOO level and premiership winner.
 
mike walker said:
G'day all,Just expanding on the dog analogy@ Woodsie to balance the squad you don't know anyone who could spare us a couple of Scottish Deerhounds,a Border Collie and an Airedale or two.
cheers mike
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@Woodsie is a stupid git he probably thinks Ben Kennedy is the highest mountain in Scotland and our best ever lock was a a monster called Ness
 
Woodsie said:
The game has changed a bit since the old "hunt and kill as a pack" mentality of forwards ... such as the Bulldogs packs under Warren Ryan .....

But there is still very much a place for packs that play as a tight unit ..... I fear Manly isn't one of them .... Why?

It is easy to say poor coaching ... maybe it is ...... However when I look at the people and personalities in our forwards I get the feeling we are a few blue heelers short .. let's look at our players and you tell me if you agree ..

Jake .... typical old school pack mentality
Lane .... nah .. good year, but more of an off with the fairies than hunt with the pack type ..
Thommo ... yeah, a pack member ..
AFB .... not sure, bit of a lone wolf type ... but can be pack orientated ... maybe .. sorta ..
Api .... too busy working to really give it a thought ....
Kapow .... definitely not a pack kind of guy ... more the lone wolf ... individual performance type guy ...

So, I guess with only 2 pack type guys out of 6 ... we are not as scary or efficient as we could be ...
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Agree with this all but

Its obvious our squad has had divisions throughout the year and alliances were sought. Lussick, hastings, lane, afb,cherry marty. There are stories ( ive used that word on purpose) as its hard to know for sure about this as its reported but if we do have factions. Everyone needs to go before alpha male or alpha romeo will rule with an iron fist by example

I dont care who is to blame, who started it, if they are truely part of ths group fractured by personalities your part of the problem. Just basic respect issues. My granfather always told me. If you want to chose the people you work with start your own business or shut the **** up

Currently our leadership groups seem about as strong and respected as alf alpha. This alf is not the dude from home and away by the way. Id have him in there for sure. This side needs a bit of flamin heck

I agree james graham would have been perfect as mentioned but he may have belted a few in this group id suggest

From coaches, to captain and leadership group and players. You get what you settle for and your excuse laden season indicated you settled way below your own capabilities. For me accepting and settling amongst the group is the main reason we performed to almost wooden spoon level and got our arse handed to us

Would alpha male that wont settle be a great addition - yes
Would he cause some issues in the short term i suspect so.

But if we agree that we need this mongrel dog and we are also admitting our current leadership group need a good saucer of milk by default
 
jbb/james said:
Agree with this all but

Its obvious our squad has had divisions throughout the year and alliances were sought. Lussick, hastings, lane, afb,cherry marty. There are stories ( ive used that word on purpose) as its hard to know for sure about this as its reported but if we do have factions. Everyone needs to go before alpha male or alpha romeo will rule with an iron fist by example

I dont care who is to blame, who started it, if they are truely part of ths group fractured by personalities your part of the problem. Just basic respect issues. My granfather always told me. If you want to chose the people you work with start your own business or shut the **** up

Currently our leadership groups seem about as strong and respected as alf alpha. This alf is not the dude from home and away by the way. Id have him in there for sure. This side needs a bit of flamin heck

I agree james graham would have been perfect as mentioned but he may have belted a few in this group id suggest

From coaches, to captain and leadership group and players. You get what you settle for and your excuse laden season indicated you settled way below your own capabilities. For me accepting and settling amongst the group is the main reason we performed to almost wooden spoon level and got our arse handed to us

Would alpha male that wont settle be a great addition - yes
Would he cause some issues in the short term i suspect so.

But if we agree that we need this mongrel dog and we are also admitting our current leadership group need a good saucer of milk by default
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I think the truth, the facts and the problem probably lie amongst all the issues you raise ...

At the beginning of the year, I stated that I believed one of the players that had the greatest "potential" to make a difference this year was Darcy Lussick ... not because he was a special player ... but because on the field he had a pack, us against them attitude ...for mine the benefit of that was worth the odd dumb penalty ....

For all Kapows good work, I have never seen him even talk to a team mate on the field ... let alone rev them up or blow up at them ...
 
Woodsie said:
I think the truth, the facts and the problem probably lie amongst all the issues you raise ...

At the beginning of the year, I stated that I believed one of the players that had the greatest "potential" to make a difference this year was Darcy Lussick ... not because he was a special player ... but because on the field he had a pack, us against them attitude ...for mine the benefit of that was worth the odd dumb penalty ....

For all Kapows good work, I have never seen him even talk to a team mate on the field ... let alone rev them up or blow up at them ...
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Which is exactly what we need and what Kennedy, Watmough and Stewart all did well.....
 
Woodsie said:
I think the truth, the facts and the problem probably lie amongst all the issues you raise ...

At the beginning of the year, I stated that I believed one of the players that had the greatest "potential" to make a difference this year was Darcy Lussick ... not because he was a special player ... but because on the field he had a pack, us against them attitude ...for mine the benefit of that was worth the odd dumb penalty ....

For all Kapows good work, I have never seen him even talk to a team mate on the field ... let alone rev them up or blow up at them ...
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100% . Lussick had the potential to take us forward. Would have allowed for marty of afb to play bench as well. Was really looking forward to his season
 
Maybe an alpha male would be handy in the sheds. Get Spud to rev up the forwards pre game and at half time! I was disappointed that nobody reacted more strongly when Walker arced up in that melbourne game and got hammered by young Scott. Jeez Matai would have destroyed Scott.

That's when our forwards should have started putting on shots and intimidating the storm! A lot more push me/pull you would have been good to see as well.

The group looked tired, disjointed and fragmentary at times this year. Hopefully they can get in a good break and a strong off season.

I think it will come down to our next coach. I hope it's someone that can instill agro and build confidence....we could use both!
 
Woodsie said:
Agree ... but we tend to play the modern forwards game of changing the point of attack ... which results in a less concentrated forward cluster and a less of a pack attitude .... we rarely have 3/4 poppers hit it up the middle, or "take" the opposition forwards on.

But I am talking more about individual players mental dispositions ... some are "pack" animals ... some are lone wolves .... I think we have too any lone wolves ...
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Ah..so this is what's been going on.
Unknown.jpeg
 
Woodsie said:
I think the truth, the facts and the problem probably lie amongst all the issues you raise ...

At the beginning of the year, I stated that I believed one of the players that had the greatest "potential" to make a difference this year was Darcy Lussick ... not because he was a special player ... but because on the field he had a pack, us against them attitude ...for mine the benefit of that was worth the odd dumb penalty ....

For all Kapows good work, I have never seen him even talk to a team mate on the field ... let alone rev them up or blow up at them ...
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Yeh I thought Darcy might have been a chance, also his brother. But not to be.

I was there at Brooky with 6k of my closest friends when the Titans tore us a new one. Marty was walking, no, strolling back to the 10 metre line with his back to the play as he'd done his tackle that set. I've always been a huge fan of his but I think the strain of 2018 was getting to him and he's in need of a break.

If we need a pack leader then look no further than the lock. Other than that we just need players who will do their job. AFB is a prime example. Not sure about his character as I dont know him but he runs into the field and you can just tell he's giving 100%. That's all we can ask! Talented players well coached who do their job.
 
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