Reviewing the stats, and what it could mean for next year.

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tries 10th
try assist 9th
set completion 10th
Post contact meters 15th
All run meters 11th
Run meters conceded 5th least
Line breaks conceded 6th least
All runs 11th
Dummy half runs 15th
kick meters 4th
errors 11th
5th least penalised side
offloads 15th
missed tackles 4th best
tackle breaks 11th
line break/assist 11th
stats from nrl.com/ fox

Defensively were a good side as we do not miss many tackles, concede many meters or linebreaks. Kick meters is top shelf too.

Now the bad part, below average making meters and get folded after contact, tackle/line breaks bad, no offloads, and butter hands.

Offensively I would say the Manly side gets beaten up in attack in the middle, which forces them to play through the outside backs who struggle without a platform from the pack.

To perform well next year Manly desperately need to recruit some players to fix the forward pack because this year they ran out of gas.
 

Woodsie

Feast yer eyes ..
Tipping Member
Offensively I would say the Manly side gets beaten up in attack in the middle, which forces them to play through the outside backs who struggle without a platform from the pack.

1) .. It is to be expected when you take a Mungo prop off, to bring on an ex-centre to replace a tackling machine lock .. who has, after tackling for 25 minutes replaces a Mungo prop, to line up against a fresh prop brought on by the opposition. .... and yes ... Walker played well ... but a result was our middle didn't ..

2) .. we were not forced to play through the outside backs ... that, as far as I can tell, was the plan ... a **** of a plan admittedly ...

3) It was a plan conceived by "Dessie the Mad" during the previous V'Landy's ball year ... sounded good on paper ... and worked absolutely shiitehouse on the field .... but one thing we do know about Dessie the Mad is ... he doesn't like to change ... so let's just stick to a whole year of playing with one Mungo prop on the bench and our middle being bitch slapped each week ..
 

Mark from Brisbane

“ Boomer still Booming”
Premium Member
Tipping Member
As I said ALL year , each and every game the blame went squarely on the shoulders of the captain.

BUT

In reality our forwards were absolutely ****ing ****house, would hardly frighten the Mona Vale under 8’s.

We all saw what our skipper could do behind a dominant pack.

Honestly out of all them only Jake & Guaca would get a start in almost any other side.

Oh sure a strike centre would help but if I’m spending money it’s on a forward pack that’s fast , mobile and puts a bit of fear in the opposition.

Won’t happen overnight but we need to buy a few decent forwards and build from there.
 

Woodsie

Feast yer eyes ..
Tipping Member
As I said ALL year , each and every game the blame went squarely on the shoulders of the captain.

BUT

In reality our forwards were absolutely ****ing ****house, would hardly frighten the Mona Vale under 8’s.

We all saw what our skipper could do behind a dominant pack.

Honestly out of all them only Jake & Guaca would get a start in almost any other side.

Oh sure a strike centre would help but if I’m spending money it’s on a forward pack that’s fast , mobile and puts a bit of fear in the opposition.

Won’t happen overnight but we need to buy a few decent forwards and build from there.

Mark ... this is where I differ from most of the Silvertails ...

Yes, our forwards were bitch slapped ... BUT .. I believe this was 100% the result of abysmal coaching and structure ... with the exception of possibly one additional Mungo prop, I believe we had the individual forwards to be more than competitive.

NOT once in 25 odd games did I see any evidence to suggest that competing and dominating the middle was part of the plan .. it was always bring on walker and throw the ball wide every play ... fukken embarrassing ...

Change the plan, change the attitude, feed them raw meat, and give them a license to compete ... and I believe we have the forwards to get it done ..
 

BOZO

Journey Man
Tipping Member
Mark ... this is where I differ from most of the Silvertails ...

Yes, our forwards were bitch slapped ... BUT .. I believe this was 100% the result of abysmal coaching and structure ... with the exception of possibly one additional Mungo prop, I believe we had the individual forwards to be more than competitive.

NOT once in 25 odd games did I see any evidence to suggest that competing and dominating the middle was part of the plan .. it was always bring on walker and throw the ball wide every play ... fukken embarrassing ...

Change the plan, change the attitude, feed them raw meat, and give them a license to compete ... and I believe we have the forwards to get it done ..
I think our failure was a combination of both

The predictable game plan and some of the inferior cattle on the field
 

BOZO

Journey Man
Tipping Member
I’m spending money it’s on a forward pack that’s fast , mobile and puts a bit of fear in the opposition.

Won’t happen overnight but we need to buy a few decent forwards and build from there.
I see what you see with my maroon and white eyes feathered friend

Predictable Hooker and pedestrian forwards compared to the top 8 teams

And Des could not inspire them to any great heights
 

The Who

Journey Man
One issue worth considering is why Manly has so many injuries. Surely it has to be more than "bad luck".
Last season props such as Tent, Keppie and Al missed as many matches as they played. If forwards win matches then this goes some way to explaining why our pack was usually outplayed.
 

manly al

First Grader
Problem with Manly 's forward injuries and in particular to Alioia and Paseka is that they were more of a longer term nature and hardly helpful to get some continuity in the pack . Keppie showed that he can be good in patches but no where near the same impact as last season . Marty very average , Sipley there abouts . Really needed Walker to add some go forward in most matches , not sure how this is going to be addressed next season . Still think that D C E took too many wrong options this season , and again hardly conductive to good or effective meter gains to put any opposition under more pressure . . Still concerned with no Walker or Foz being next season , , really do need a better run with forward injuries in particular . Still not a bad forward line up but plenty of work in the off season to get some better playing systems in place . Then again also the dreaded injury curse to overcome .
 

Eagle 1

First Grader
Problem with Manly 's forward injuries and in particular to Alioia and Paseka is that they were more of a longer term nature and hardly helpful to get some continuity in the pack . Keppie showed that he can be good in patches but no where near the same impact as last season . Marty very average , Sipley there abouts . Really needed Walker to add some go forward in most matches , not sure how this is going to be addressed next season . Still think that D C E took too many wrong options this season , and again hardly conductive to good or effective meter gains to put any opposition under more pressure . . Still concerned with no Walker or Foz being next season , , really do need a better run with forward injuries in particular . Still not a bad forward line up but plenty of work in the off season to get some better playing systems in place . Then again also the dreaded injury curse to overcome .
Good sum up ma, I can't remember a time when we had all of our props available for more than a 2 week period for the whole of the season.
 

Chip and Chase

True Supporter
Staff member
Administrator
Premium Member
Tipping Member
@IQofalimabean I think you are better off looking at averages and not totals for those stats as the Fox Sports Lab includes finals games. So it will skew the results one way or the other for the top 8 teams as they have played 1 or 2 more games.

If you read this article from last year


the statistical analysis over last 6 years suggested that "run metres conceded" was the best indicator as to whether a team wins or loses. We were 8th on average run meters conceded per game and mid table in terms of results. Funnily enough statistically the 8 best teams in terms of fewest run meters conceded were in fact the teams that finished in the top 8.
 
Throw in another Des Plan, which he continues to use every game;

When we are pinned on our goal line, our best response is to EVERY TIME use two lightweight wingers and one half to take the hit ups off the line.

The opposition know they are coming, with out any fear and we are on our own 40m line on the 4th tackle. It might have been OK with Taufua, but not with what we have got.

Change the carriers & forget the "relieving the forwards workload crap". What are they there for, to judge the technique of Saab as he dives into the turf before he is lifted back over the goal line?
 

XV-1

First Grader
Throw in another Des Plan, which he continues to use every game;

When we are pinned on our goal line, our best response is to EVERY TIME use two lightweight wingers and one half to take the hit ups off the line.

The opposition know they are coming, with out any fear and we are on our own 40m line on the 4th tackle. It might have been OK with Taufua, but not with what we have got.

Change the carriers & forget the "relieving the forwards workload crap". What are they there for, to judge the technique of Saab as he dives into the turf before he is lifted back over the goal line?

Don't have much choice when our lazy arse forwards are still walking to the play after 2 or 3 tackles. Our backs are forced to take the hard hit ups.

All our issues keeps going back to our lazy entitled forwards who's go forward is almost non existent.
 

Pete W

Bencher
Don't have much choice when our lazy arse forwards are still walking to the play after 2 or 3 tackles. Our backs are forced to take the hard hit ups.

All our issues keeps going back to our lazy entitled forwards who's go forward is almost non existent.
Whilst it is true our forwards were borderline useless this year, in this case it is actually the outside backs job in the modern game to take the first couple of tackles after receiving the ball again. The forwards must do the bulk of the work both in attack and defence for pretty much all other areas of the game. It is absolutely crucial that a team has strong running outside backs who make quality yardage, get over the advantage line, quick play the balls, so the sets are started off with momentum. Saab and Garrick need to put on some kgs I think, and Tui needs to continue as he started the season before his form dropped.
 
Whilst it is true our forwards were borderline useless this year, in this case it is actually the outside backs job in the modern game to take the first couple of tackles after receiving the ball again. The forwards must do the bulk of the work both in attack and defence for pretty much all other areas of the game. It is absolutely crucial that a team has strong running outside backs who make quality yardage, get over the advantage line, quick play the balls, so the sets are started off with momentum. Saab and Garrick need to put on some kgs I think, and Tui needs to continue as he started the season before his form dropped.

I agree with what the "coaches rule book" recommends, but it is not working at Manly, so Des has to change the players or the team's playbook.
 

SeaEagleRock8

Sea Eagle Lach
Premium Member
Tipping Member
Our season stats would be skewed because the last 7 weeks the season was destroyed and we suffered several thrashings. Any analysis of how Manly fared in 2022 would have to take into account what happened in Round 20. Hard to quantify, but absurd to suggest it wasn't a critical factor in how our season ended.
 

Pete W

Bencher
I agree with what the "coaches rule book" recommends, but it is not working at Manly, so Des has to change the players or the team's playbook.
Not really so much the coaches rule book, as the way the modern game has evolved. It's not a strategy, it's a necessity
 

Woodsie

Feast yer eyes ..
Tipping Member
Service from hooker hurts our forwards significantly. They don’t get the ball at the advantage line.

That's not the hookers fault .. his timing is based on the bloke playing the ball ... it is the runner that has the ability to "time" his run correctly ..

We give Froggy few options, rarely more than just the one body in motion .... or a first reciever 2 wide, standing flat footed and 5m behind ....

Because we are a really really poorly coached football team ...

Give froggy options, movement either side of the ruck, and a competent forward pack contesting the middle ... and he will get the job done ..
 

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