NRL set to investigate Orford's financial records

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First Grader
NRL set to investigate Orford's financial records

By Paul Kent
The Daily Telegraph
July 25, 2005

THE NRL is set to investigate Mat Orford's financial records when his contract is lodged with the League this week.

The enormous speculation concerning Orford's contract with Manly has given the NRL what it believes are "reasonable grounds" to delve into Orford's deal under the terms of the Collective Bargaining Agreement agreed upon by the players' association.

NRL chief executive David Gallop acknowledged the League's interest in the Orford deal but stopped short of using the term "investigate", saying the League will "look at" Orford's contract.

The NRL is concerned with several matters, ranging from speculation that Orford knocked back two much larger deals to sign with Manly, to rumours that he is telling team-mates the deal is much larger than the four-year $1.8million deal Manly is saying.

"We have got powers to call for a player's records where we have reasonable grounds for doing so," Gallop said.

"Salary cap cheating starts with clubs deciding to cheat but if players are complicit in that then they are open to investigation and penalties.

"The next step in the Orford matter is to wait for a contract to be lodged by Manly and until that happens I can't say what will happen next."

Gallop later said: "All new contracts are looked at carefully."

Orford's manager George Mimis said he would "welcome any investigation" but said he wants the NRL to be armed with more than has simply been reported in the past week.

"I am surprised the NRL would be guided so much by speculation and media," Mimis said.

"I will be requesting more factual information that they will be underpinning their investigation on because we have all read The Sun-Herald this morning and it is totally inaccurate.

"It is absolute rubbish. It is baseless, factless journalism."

The game has come under heavy criticism of late as doubts about the adequacy of salary cap policing continue to plague the game.

Most criticism has centred around the NRL's inability to delve into the financial records of players

In contrast, the AFL's salary cap auditor is given access not only to a player's complete financial records but also to those of his wife or partner, a fact that critics of the NRL system have not missed.

Yet, despite not having such access, the NRL believes its "reasonable grounds" clause is sufficient to properly investigate salary cap cheating.

Given the high level of speculation that has dominated the Orford signing, those levels of concern appear to have been reached.

Both Melbourne chief executive Brian Waldron and South Sydney chief executive Shane Richardson said their clubs offered significantly richer deals to lure Orford to their club.

While Orford claimed a change in lifestyle played a significant part in his switch, Waldron left no doubts that he believed Orford was going for no other reason than Manly was offering more money.

Waldron said Orford will own a Manly apartment in three years, will have his management fees to George Mimis and also former manager Wayne Beavis paid by the club, in a deal worth $700,000 a season.

Throughout negotiations Manly has insisted it is not paying any more than the four-year $1.8million it has acknowledged paying.
NRL set to investigate Orford's financial records

i would love to know how we could be over the cap when we have 3 players on big money,orford ,bk and kite and beaver and monaghan on fairly lucrative deals.the rest are iether up and comers or average pluggers,with 2 of the higher paid pluggers leaving(harris,randall) THEN look at the roosters next year

minichello-aus re
wing-aus rep
anasta-hottest player in game atm and origin star
fitzgibbon-aus rep
morley-international who would have to be on a motza
finch-origin rep
monaghan-high profile signing last year
roberts-high profile signing last year
nate myles-generally regarded as best young prop on the horizon
ashley harrison-origin rep and having sensational year.

it is a total ****ing joke!


Journey Man
NRL set to investigate Orford's financial records

Yes, but the Sun Herald are in bed with the Roosters aren't they? Chief Rooster Phil "Banjo Patterson" Gould writes a column for Fairfax. And Fairfax are in bed with Ch 9, home of the dissaffected Fatty Vuatin.

Add to that the fact that Ricky Stuart writes a column for the Australian (News Ltd) and you have the Roosters immune from speculation of this sort.

So the media resort to poking the stick at their most hated silvertails - us! Add to that the fact that every journalist despises Peter Peters (and I have that in black and white from several of them after the events of last week) and you have quite a ptent brew, don't you?

Time for a change?


Journey Man
NRL set to investigate Orford's financial records

It makes you wonder sometimes.

Even with the dogs offloading who they have their roster still looks higher paid than ours


Winging it
NRL set to investigate Orford's financial records

We front loaded the contracts of BK1 & BK2 so we should be in a good position. This is in complete contrast to the Rorters. Old trick to deflect criticism by pointing a finger elsewhere (and I will avoid political comment in the footie forum).

I think it was Roy Masters who recently wrote an article that players do not receive any form of punishment if caught being complicit in innacurately lodged contracts or negotiating before the June 30 deadline. That is a joke and needs to be addressed. When the player, who knows about an under the table deal, is forced to pay back illegally gained benefits and cop a fine then the system will change. Look at the negative publicity and cash penalty Arsenal's Ashley Cole received recently for negotiating with Chelsea outside of the allowable contract period and you know that one high profile hit would clean up this whole sorry BS instantly.
NRL set to investigate Orford's financial records





Journey Man
NRL set to investigate Orford's financial records

Reason? As mentioned above.

We seem to like to be the media's punching bag. See how Politis gets on the front foot?


Winging it
NRL set to investigate Orford's financial records

Punching bag? And we are supposedly revelling in the idea of wanting to be hated again and, *ahem*, being silvertails. You get what you ask for.


Reserve Grader
NRL set to investigate Orford's financial records

i couldnt care less but i find it amazing that we are being looked at over the likes of rooters and saints.on another note i have a new most hated player.luke ricketson has turned into a whingeing cheap shot merchant now they are losing,finally gould and stewart have rubbed off on someone else.


Reserve Grader
NRL set to investigate Orford's financial records

sorry thats harsh,3rd most hated player below crocker and hodges


Journey Man
NRL set to investigate Orford's financial records

My most hated Danny Williams was scrubbed out of the game thankfully.


Tipping Member
NRL set to investigate Orford's financial records

I can't believe that Parramatta are not also highlighted when this topic comes up.

If you believe that salaries are anywhere near what is reported in the media they bought Cannings for $200k+ and then last year they got
Tahu (at a ridiculous amount)
PJ Marsh

Hindmarsh would be on plenty.
Vella, Cayless and Morris would be on good deals

Despite this, they seem to escape attention on this topic.


NRL set to investigate Orford's financial records

Typical. What about all the rumours with Roosters - apparently George Piggans claims over Anasta etc isnt reasonable cause - but random articles in papers from an unamed source (probably tomato) is when it is Manly.


Journey Man
NRL set to investigate Orford's financial records

Partly because they know that Zorba will botch the response (my point from previous posts).

Party because said other clubs have representation on the NRL Partnership Committee.

I'm surprised no-one has thrown up the Broncos or the Knights with their $1million per season man.

Canteen Worker

First Grader
NRL set to investigate Orford's financial records

See the Andrew Denton Article below from Herald:

Something's off-key in the NRL choir
July 24, 2005
The Sun-Herald

Clubs are having a lend of the NRL by treating the salary cap with contempt, Andrew Denton writes.

Let me get straight to the point: I cannot see how the Roosters are under the salary cap and I don't believe the game is benefiting from their actions.

Proof? I don't have any. But it wouldn't take the cast of Law And Order: Forensic Accountants to work out that something is off-key in the NRL choir.

Grab a pen and paper and let's look at the Roosters squad for 2005. Remember, the salary cap is $3.3 million and it's for 25 players.

Recently published figures suggest representative players Jason Cayless and Michael Crocker are paid $200,000 and $190,000 respectively. Former rep players Luke Ricketson and Chris Walker receive $150,000 and $200,000. Stuart Webb ($80,000) and Ned Catic ($75,000) make do on more modest sums.

Also mentioned was Brett Firman, one of three big signings last year, with Amos Roberts and Joel Monaghan. Firman, it seems, was on a $200,000 deal.

How much has been spent so far? $1.095m. $2.20m to spare.

Those with good memories will remember that Roberts signed on for $250,000. Let's be conservative and say that Monaghan, an equally sought-after player, came for Firman's price of $200,000.

Taking Firman as the benchmark (and, remember, he wasn't even a regular first-grader, much less a rep player), it should be safe to assume that current and former rep players Chris Flannery, Ryan Cross and Brett Finch aren't playing for less.

But we're being charitable here. Let's say they're all happy to take a cut so they can play with Ricky and put them each at $190,000.

Running total: $2.115m. Still under the $3.3m cap.

Now the elite players - those who would cause a frenzy if they went on to the open market: Adrian Morley, Craig Wing, Craig Fitzgibbon and Anthony Minichiello. Clearly, none is playing for $200,000. Roberts is on $250,000 - and he's not at their level - so common sense suggests they're on more.

Let's put them on $275,000 each, except for Morley (an Englishman who will rightly expect to be compensated for the weak Australian dollar). We'll give him $300,000 - a steal when you consider the Roosters signed Bulldogs fringe player player Charlie Tonga during the week for $150,000 a year.

Cost to date: $3.240m. Looking shaky.

But the cap fits 25 players, each of whom must be paid a minimum $40,000. So far, we've accounted for 16. Who's left? The hottest young prop in the game, Anthony Tupou, is listed under the cap at $150,000.

Then there's Penrith import Richard Fa'aoso, Iosia Soliola (who Ricky says is the next big thing) and prolific junior Jamie Soward. What the hell, give them all the play-with-Ricky rate of $40,000, along with the other five needed to get us to 25.

Grand total? $3.710m. Oops.

Now I know what you're saying. The NRL has registered contracts. It says everything's OK. Where's your proof? Of course, I have none. And I'm sure all the contracts, as registered, add up.

But do I believe that they tell the whole story? Or that the salary cap is working? No. And I don't think many fair-thinking fans do either.

We're being treated like mushrooms - fed you know what and kept in the dark. Take the claim that Brad Fittler was on $350,000 a year. A legend of the game and he could get only $150,000 more than Firman? Oh please.

Then I read that Braith Anasta has passed up a $3m deal with Souths to sign a $900,000 one with the Roosters, and that Ashley Harrison has dropped $450,000 over three years to play with Ricky. And no one bats an eyelid?

Ricky Stuart is a great coach, but for players to take such huge discounts in the best earning years of their short careers? Seems unlikely. Other clubs sacrifice and shed profile players to develop new ones, but not the Roosters. They just sign better ones.

What is the benefit to rugby league of having some teams forever weak and another always strong?

Shouldn't all rugby league fans start the season genuinely believing their team might make the eight, might even win the comp? And if that were true, if we had a level playing field, wouldn't that make for a great competition?

Stop me before I go mad. Let's just say the Roosters really are under the cap. Let's say the system is operating as it should be, which is what the NRL claims. That leaves only one question: is it working? Here's what the NRL website says about the salary cap:

The primary function of the salary cap is "to assist in spreading the playing talent so that a few rich clubs cannot simply out-bid poorer teams for all the best players. The NRL believes that if a few clubs were able to spend unlimited funds in such a way, it would both reduce the attraction of games to fans, due to an uneven competition, and drive some clubs out of the competition".

I may not be able to prove how. I may not be able to prove who. And neither, perhaps, for all its best efforts, can the NRL. But when Anasta and Harrison run on with the all-star Roosters against Souths next year, I'll be able to prove this much: the system is broke, the whole town knows it, and it's time to fix it.

 Andrew Denton, host of ABC TV's Enough Rope, is a lifelong rugby league fan and South Sydney supporter.


Reserve Grader
NRL set to investigate Orford's financial records

he is also a great coach that up until this year has had great cattle,most coaches with the cattle he has had would have done as well.if you havent got the cattle i doubt it matters how good you are.


Journey Man
NRL set to investigate Orford's financial records

but great coaches attract the cattle

(ignore the fact that the roosters were up there when he took over)


Journey Man
NRL set to investigate Orford's financial records

This is purely speculation guys, but:

In 2003, we reportedly had speant $800k under the salary cap for that year. We then signed Kite / Kennedy, but we utilised much of that $800k as sign on fees, and towards their payments, which would mean in basic terms they'd be on 1.3 million odd between them over three years, or just on $200k each per year. Even if the payments weren't given to Kite & Kennedy, the $800k could have been frontloaded with our current players, having the same monetary effect.

Remember the NRL clubs whinged at that again, and the NRL said it would look into utilising previous years unutilised cap funds as sign on fees. Manly did this when it was COMPLETELY within the rules.

Therefore, you would say our 2 marquee players aren't earning that much.

We have released possibly Randall, Harris, Donald, Hoppa, Hill. I bet you'd find that if you added up all those players incomes, Orford actually fits in VERY easily, with plenty of room to spare.

I'd also think you'd find a few players like Brett Stewart, Anthony Watmough, Michael Witt, Ashley Alberts & co. were signed at very good value for money (hence why we feel the need to upgrade some of them like Bretts.)

You look at our Premier League team, and it is obvious we lack depth. We don't have the Chris Walkers & co. running around in Premier League. Crusher is looking to fix that, and it was said on the Q&A night.

To even consider we are ANYWHERE near our cap is ludicrous. I expect we will see MORE signings in the weeks to come.

Well done management. You continue to attract top quality players. Manly is a great selling point. I'd rather live here than Melbourne OR Redfern.


NRL set to investigate Orford's financial records

souths sour grapes, simple, **** just look at the dragons and the roosters!

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