Welcome!

By registering with us, you'll be able to discuss, share and private message with other members of our community.

SignUp Now!

NRL Salary Cap Era

Mark from Brisbane

“ Triggered Boomer”
Premium Member
Joined
Oct 2, 2008
Messages
32,518
@TagMonster .. thank you .. excellent read

Just a point ... the Salary Cap was never ever introduced to create a level playing field ... the one and only reason it was ever brought in was to stop numbnut clubs going broke chasing a premiership .. however some clever journo raised the thought that it would also mean a level playing field and that was an easier sell so the narrative continued ..

There Has not been one club official in 112 years that wants a level playing field ... they all want any advantage they can get ... any way they can get it ... and if gambling $2 mil on a 16 year old kid, or $3 mil on a broken down former star .. they will do it .. and why some love the TPA rorts ... and fans need to be saved from crazy CEO's with a 3 year contract to impress ..

The NRL realised with the demise of Newtown, Wests, Norths and almost Souff's that whole generations of fans are lost forever when their clubs fold ...

sorry for the ramble ... but if you want to get rid of the salary cap .. you still need to come up with a plan to stop clubs spending themselves into oblivion chasing the dream ...
That too is an excellent point!!
 

manlyfan76

Parra Trolls are the best.
Premium Member
Joined
Dec 11, 2010
Messages
15,447
you still need to come up with a plan to stop clubs spending themselves into oblivion chasing the dream ...
Yes and no... With teams in Brisbane and Perth ready to step up a team... or two would easily be replaced in my opinion... especially a Sydney team like tigers.
 

Woodsie

Feast yer eyes ..
Joined
Feb 13, 2016
Messages
12,252
Yes and no... With teams in Brisbane and Perth ready to step up a team... or two would easily be replaced in my opinion... especially a Sydney team like tigers.
But that doesn't change the fact that many fans would be lost and many others disillusioned ... whilst I am a fan of the law of the jungle and only the strongest survive ... I don't think the NRL would survive team collapses ... if Manly went I would suggest that I and many others on this site would be gooorne ..
 

manlyfan76

Parra Trolls are the best.
Premium Member
Joined
Dec 11, 2010
Messages
15,447
But that doesn't change the fact that many fans would be lost and many others disillusioned ... whilst I am a fan of the law of the jungle and only the strongest survive ... I don't think the NRL would survive team collapses ... if Manly went I would suggest that I and many others on this site would be gooorne ..
I'd say a big percentage of fans are already disillusioned with the fame now.
 

shawn.b

Active Member
Joined
Jun 18, 2010
Messages
138
The problem with TPAs is that they are organised by the clubs, despite the fact they are ‘arms length’.
If the NRL enforced a rule that all TPAs are arranged or referred through them then that makes it more difficult for clubs to fort the system.
The other thing to consider is, do the NRL want an even comp?
 

mickqld

Sea Eagle forever
Joined
Sep 13, 2004
Messages
10,321
The points system looks to be much fairer BUT we know they’d Rort that too!!

The games ****ed I reckon , people will eventually get sick of only 2-3 teams ever winning and start to desert it in droves.

Stupid bastards have no ****ing idea.
So their solution is to speed up the game which advantages the teams with the biggest resources budgets, the biggest research, medical and technology budgets to make their players bigger, faster, stronger, fitter.
Yep they certainly have no FUKING idea.
You want an even comp then slow the game down.
 

mickqld

Sea Eagle forever
Joined
Sep 13, 2004
Messages
10,321
I got bored this afternoon so decided to have a look over the NRL Results during the Salary Cap Era (1998 through 2020).

Here are some the simple stats:

  • 23 Seasons Plays
  • 23 Grand Finals Played
  • 15 of the 16 Teams have played in a Grand Final (Only Gold Coast have missed out)

This actually surprised me a lot. The fact that almost every team has had a crack over the past 23 years truly surprised me (bar the lowly Titans).

Delving deeper into the stats though reveals some sad outcomes:

  • Melbourne have played in 10 of the last 23 Grand Finals
  • Roosters have played in 8 of the last 23 Grand Finals
  • No other team has played in over 4 Grand Finals (Manly, Brisbane and Canterbury)

Looking specifically at the last 15 years it gets even worse:

  • Melbourne have played in 9 of the last 15 Grand Finals (greater than 50%)
  • No other team has played more than 4 Grand Finals over the same period (Manly and Roosters)

When you consider that over the last 15 years only 2 Grand Finals have not had either Melbourne, Roosters or Manly the competitions starts to look a bit lopsided. Its even worse when you consider Melbourne have played in 4 of the last 5 and over half of the last 15 Grand Finals.

But playing in the Grand Final is only one half of the test. The winners of the Grand Final Since 1998 are:

  • Melbourne have won 6 of the last 23 Grand Finals, 5 of the last 15 Grand Finals, or even works 2 of the last 5 Grand Finals.
  • Roosters have won 4 of the last 23, but 3 of the last 10 and of course 2 of the last 3 years.

No other team really comes close to the dominance of Melbourne over the last 15 years, not even the Roosters who have been dominate over the past 3 years.

So how can 15 of the 16 teams have had a crack at Grand Final Glory over the past 23 years, yet two teams in particular have dominated the past 10 years. What changed. Well looking over a few items I noticed the below:

2005 - Increase in TPA to $150k
2013 - Increase in Marquee Player Agreement form $250k to $600k

So, 15 years ago the NRL increased the amount each player can receive in TPAs significantly and then 7 years ago they more than doubled the amount a marquee player can received over and above the Salary Cap. What is very interesting is that around these same times, both Melbourne and the Roosters become the dominant two teams in the league by a significant margin. Unsurprisingly enough, they are also two teams that have significant financial backing (Uncle Nick and News Corp).

So when you break it down as a "Pre TPA Era" and a "Post TPA Era" you get the below:

Pre TPA Era
  • Grand Finals Played: 8
  • 11 of 16 Teams Represented in at least 1 Grand Final (68.75% of teams represented)
  • Every year a team had a 8.6% chance of being in the Grand Final
  • Roosters played in 4 Grand Final (winning only 1)
  • Only Brisbane won more than once (2 wins) 25%

Post TPA Era
  • Grand Finals Played: 15
  • 13 of 16 Teams Represented in at least 1 Grand Final (81.25% of teams represented)
  • Every year a team had a 5.41% chance of being in the Grand Final
  • Melbourne played in 9 Grand Finals (winning 5) 60%
  • Melbourne won 5 times whilst the Roosters won 3 times (54% of Grand Final Winners)
  • Only 3 Grand Finals played over this period not involving the Roosters or Melbourne

Post Marquee Player Agreement Increase
  • Grand Finals Played: 8
  • 10 of 16 Teams Represented in at least 1 Grand Final (62.5% of teams represented)
  • Every year a team had a 7.81% chance of being in the Grand Final
  • Melbourne Played in 4 Grand Finals, Roosters played in 3 (44% of Grand Final Representation)
  • Only teams to win multiple are Rooster with 3 and Melbourne with 2 (62.5% of Winners)
  • Only 2 Grand Finals played over this period not involving the Roosters or Melbourne


The salary cap was introduced to level the playing field. Looking at the Pre TPA era, I think it generally works. The chances of making it to the Grand Final have reduced marginally since TPA and Marquee Player payments were unleashed with the major difference is in the same teams winning repeatedly.

So I guess my conclusion is that the competition is "competitive" for finals representation and Grand Final representation. Its just that the winners are almost always one of two teams which are arguably (or actually) over the salary cap. The easiest way to do this is through TPAs.

My fix, get rid of the salary cap. Pay the players whatever they are worth. Its a free market economy. Let the market dictate and eliminate restrictions of trade etc. To keep the competition competitive, introduce a Player Points Cap. Every player is rated on a scale of 1-10. Every team has a player rating representative and they rate all played (including their own). The top two and bottom two scores for each player is eliminated and the average of the remaining 12 is their score. Each team has a total amount of points they can use for their Top 30 squad. All player rating are published, there is no way to cheat the cap.

Unfortunately, the two dominate teams of the past 10 years will continue to play with 14 players on the field each and every game. I don't have a solution to that one.....
Great analysis. Let's analyze the 23 years prior to 1998 salary cap. Survival of the richest.
23 Grand finals
12 teams represented.
6 missed out Illawarra (16 seasons) Souths , Norths , Wests, Gold Coast (10 season), Warriors (10 seasons).
Not including Crushers, Mariners, Reds, Rams as they only played 3 or 4 seasons during fractured comps.
9 teams were premiers in 23 seasons
Manly 9 GF won 4- draw 1 - lost 4
Parra 8 GF won 4- draw 1 - lost 3
Canter 8 GF won 5 - lost 3
St Geo 8 GF won 2 - draw 1- lost 5
Canberra 5 GF won 3 - lost 2
East 2 GF won 1 - lost 1
Balmain 2 GF lost 2
Penrith 2 GF won 1 - lost 1
Newcastle 1 GF won 1
Newtown 1 GF lost 1
Brisbane 2 GF won 2
Cronulla 2 GF 1 draw - 1 lost

So 5 teams dominated that era winning 18 of 23 seasons. Was still more competitive than the last 23 years.

Salary cap did work until Super league and tpa greed killed the competition
 

Woodsie

Feast yer eyes ..
Joined
Feb 13, 2016
Messages
12,252
That's why I think the idea of no salary cap would work - if you cant control or limit the TPA side of things then what use is a cap?
The big difference with TPA's is that the money is coming from sources other than the club ... so they can't and won't send a club broke ....
 

Woodsie

Feast yer eyes ..
Joined
Feb 13, 2016
Messages
12,252
Another thing ... is there any obligation on a TPA being a genuine commercial deal .. and not just a top up payment by a friendly millionaire ?? .. I suppose the recent bequest of a TPA for Foran indicates that there isn't ..

There is in my mind a big difference to a players right to maximise his income through commercial deals ... and just getting a top up payment .. the former is just business .. the latter a corrupt rort to bypass the salary cap ..

You would think that if a car yard wanted to pay ..say DCE a $100,000 a year .. we would see his face on telly doing ads all year .. but I can't think of any ads featuring all these players by what are obviously very un-demanding TPA suppliers ..
 

Mark from Brisbane

“ Triggered Boomer”
Premium Member
Joined
Oct 2, 2008
Messages
32,518
Another thing ... is there any obligation on a TPA being a genuine commercial deal .. and not just a top up payment by a friendly millionaire ?? .. I suppose the recent bequest of a TPA for Foran indicates that there isn't ..

There is in my mind a big difference to a players right to maximise his income through commercial deals ... and just getting a top up payment .. the former is just business .. the latter a corrupt rort to bypass the salary cap ..

You would think that if a car yard wanted to pay ..say DCE a $100,000 a year .. we would see his face on telly doing ads all year .. but I can't think of any ads featuring all these players by what are obviously very un-demanding TPA suppliers ..
I do see a LOT of advertisements up here featuring the Broncos , and not in their colours BUT for some strange reason not many this year .....could be Covid but more than likely that they are viewed as Shyte.
 
Last edited:

globaleagle

stay tuned
Staff member
Premium Member
Joined
Oct 8, 2011
Messages
24,837
Another thing ... is there any obligation on a TPA being a genuine commercial deal .. and not just a top up payment by a friendly millionaire ?? .. I suppose the recent bequest of a TPA for Foran indicates that there isn't ..

There is in my mind a big difference to a players right to maximise his income through commercial deals ... and just getting a top up payment .. the former is just business .. the latter a corrupt rort to bypass the salary cap ..

You would think that if a car yard wanted to pay ..say DCE a $100,000 a year .. we would see his face on telly doing ads all year .. but I can't think of any ads featuring all these players by what are obviously very un-demanding TPA suppliers ..
I thought the tpa had to be approved by the nrl overlords and that's about it.

I guess just to make sure the products advertised are...damn I dunno...nrl friendly
 

conanu

Well-Known Member
Premium Member
Joined
Mar 16, 2009
Messages
2,381
I got bored this afternoon so decided to have a look over the NRL Results during the Salary Cap Era (1998 through 2020).

Here are some the simple stats:

  • 23 Seasons Plays
  • 23 Grand Finals Played
  • 15 of the 16 Teams have played in a Grand Final (Only Gold Coast have missed out)

This actually surprised me a lot. The fact that almost every team has had a crack over the past 23 years truly surprised me (bar the lowly Titans).

Delving deeper into the stats though reveals some sad outcomes:

  • Melbourne have played in 10 of the last 23 Grand Finals
  • Roosters have played in 8 of the last 23 Grand Finals
  • No other team has played in over 4 Grand Finals (Manly, Brisbane and Canterbury)

Looking specifically at the last 15 years it gets even worse:

  • Melbourne have played in 9 of the last 15 Grand Finals (greater than 50%)
  • No other team has played more than 4 Grand Finals over the same period (Manly and Roosters)

When you consider that over the last 15 years only 2 Grand Finals have not had either Melbourne, Roosters or Manly the competitions starts to look a bit lopsided. Its even worse when you consider Melbourne have played in 4 of the last 5 and over half of the last 15 Grand Finals.

But playing in the Grand Final is only one half of the test. The winners of the Grand Final Since 1998 are:

  • Melbourne have won 6 of the last 23 Grand Finals, 5 of the last 15 Grand Finals, or even works 2 of the last 5 Grand Finals.
  • Roosters have won 4 of the last 23, but 3 of the last 10 and of course 2 of the last 3 years.

No other team really comes close to the dominance of Melbourne over the last 15 years, not even the Roosters who have been dominate over the past 3 years.

So how can 15 of the 16 teams have had a crack at Grand Final Glory over the past 23 years, yet two teams in particular have dominated the past 10 years. What changed. Well looking over a few items I noticed the below:

2005 - Increase in TPA to $150k
2013 - Increase in Marquee Player Agreement form $250k to $600k

So, 15 years ago the NRL increased the amount each player can receive in TPAs significantly and then 7 years ago they more than doubled the amount a marquee player can received over and above the Salary Cap. What is very interesting is that around these same times, both Melbourne and the Roosters become the dominant two teams in the league by a significant margin. Unsurprisingly enough, they are also two teams that have significant financial backing (Uncle Nick and News Corp).

So when you break it down as a "Pre TPA Era" and a "Post TPA Era" you get the below:

Pre TPA Era
  • Grand Finals Played: 8
  • 11 of 16 Teams Represented in at least 1 Grand Final (68.75% of teams represented)
  • Every year a team had a 8.6% chance of being in the Grand Final
  • Roosters played in 4 Grand Final (winning only 1)
  • Only Brisbane won more than once (2 wins) 25%

Post TPA Era
  • Grand Finals Played: 15
  • 13 of 16 Teams Represented in at least 1 Grand Final (81.25% of teams represented)
  • Every year a team had a 5.41% chance of being in the Grand Final
  • Melbourne played in 9 Grand Finals (winning 5) 60%
  • Melbourne won 5 times whilst the Roosters won 3 times (54% of Grand Final Winners)
  • Only 3 Grand Finals played over this period not involving the Roosters or Melbourne

Post Marquee Player Agreement Increase
  • Grand Finals Played: 8
  • 10 of 16 Teams Represented in at least 1 Grand Final (62.5% of teams represented)
  • Every year a team had a 7.81% chance of being in the Grand Final
  • Melbourne Played in 4 Grand Finals, Roosters played in 3 (44% of Grand Final Representation)
  • Only teams to win multiple are Rooster with 3 and Melbourne with 2 (62.5% of Winners)
  • Only 2 Grand Finals played over this period not involving the Roosters or Melbourne


The salary cap was introduced to level the playing field. Looking at the Pre TPA era, I think it generally works. The chances of making it to the Grand Final have reduced marginally since TPA and Marquee Player payments were unleashed with the major difference is in the same teams winning repeatedly.

So I guess my conclusion is that the competition is "competitive" for finals representation and Grand Final representation. Its just that the winners are almost always one of two teams which are arguably (or actually) over the salary cap. The easiest way to do this is through TPAs.

My fix, get rid of the salary cap. Pay the players whatever they are worth. Its a free market economy. Let the market dictate and eliminate restrictions of trade etc. To keep the competition competitive, introduce a Player Points Cap. Every player is rated on a scale of 1-10. Every team has a player rating representative and they rate all played (including their own). The top two and bottom two scores for each player is eliminated and the average of the remaining 12 is their score. Each team has a total amount of points they can use for their Top 30 squad. All player rating are published, there is no way to cheat the cap.

Unfortunately, the two dominate teams of the past 10 years will continue to play with 14 players on the field each and every game. I don't have a solution to that one.....
Great post, makes sense. They do release the TPA amounts each year and every year Storm spend nearly a million more in TPA's but for some reason no media ever say a word about it, instead they bang on about their system blah blah blah, the same system that affords them to have a superstar rookie like Harry Grant signed and on loan to Wests only to pull him back when they need him. But if you believe the media it is just great roster management and that famous SYSTEM.
 

47MVEagle

Well-Known Member
Joined
Mar 28, 2018
Messages
1,496
Great post, makes sense. They do release the TPA amounts each year and every year Storm spend nearly a million more in TPA's but for some reason no media ever say a word about it, instead they bang on about their system blah blah blah, the same system that affords them to have a superstar rookie like Harry Grant signed and on loan to Wests only to pull him back when they need him. But if you believe the media it is just great roster management and that famous SYSTEM.
How accurate are those TPA reports though?

I'm pretty sure the Roosters were reported as being one of the clubs with the lowest TPA amounts recently?

What's interesting about the Storm admitting to having $1million in TPAs across their squad is it kind of undermines the whole "they've got a great system & just take young, unproven rookies & turn them into superstars...gee I can't remember the last superstar they actually bought" mantra that was oft-repeated in the GF week & after the game.
 

Woodsie

Feast yer eyes ..
Joined
Feb 13, 2016
Messages
12,252
A bigger piece of information would be the amount of money clubs have invested in the housing, education, training and payments to kids in their junior systems from the age of 14 years to 18 years old ....

To my limited knowledge there is no caps on these amounts ... other than maybe the amount paid to an individual kid by way of age contract ... but if a club has 30 kids from all over the country ... must be a fair investment ...

@Mitch or @Smokin Joe ... do you know much about this ... a 16 yo like Kosef brought from the mulga to the big smoke and billeted out and put into one of the rugby league schools ... what are the likely costs involved to a club ??
 

Staff online

  • lsz
    Well-Known Member

2020 Ladder

Team P W D L PD Pts
1 Panthers 20 18 1 1 299 37
2 Storm 20 16 0 4 258 32
3 Eels 20 15 0 5 104 30
4 Roosters 20 14 0 6 230 28
5 Raiders 20 14 0 6 128 28
6 Rabbitohs 20 12 0 8 169 24
7 Knights 20 11 1 8 47 23
8 Sharks 20 10 0 10 0 20
9 Titans 20 9 0 11 -117 18
10 Warriors 20 8 0 12 -115 16
11 Tigers 20 7 0 13 -65 14
12 Dragons 20 7 0 13 -74 14
13 Sea Eagles 20 7 0 13 -134 14
14 Cowboys 20 5 0 15 -152 10
15 Bulldogs 20 3 0 17 -222 6
16 Broncos 20 3 0 17 -356 6
Top Bottom