Ian Roberts speaks

[Kevinward777]

Bible slavery from my limited research is/can be about an individual offering themselves up for slavery to pay a debt----which is different to the kidnapping sale and trade of people in more modern times forms of slavery--- which is forbidden in the Bible.

Quoting the Bible minus the context is one way to lean towards a bias, also not mentioning if it is part of a parable which will exaggerate to illustrate a point.

I don't know enough to really debate the issue but feel both sides of the fence tend to go for the easy answer without doing some leg work, or too proud to change their views.

William Wilberforce was the chief architect in the abolishment of slavery in England through the Slave Trade Act of 1807.

His tireless campaign for justice is one of the greatest humanitarian achievements of modern times. Wilberforce was a devout Christian.

You make very sound points @Technical Coach about both sides. It’s refreshing to read.

 

[Kevinward777]

I had 4 great years in a catholic boarding school and their spin was
1)We are all created in God's likeness
2)Jesus died for we sinners to show that God will forgive our sins and we all ultimately hang out beside him
3)Judge not, lest you be judged

The Izzy diatribe is not the 10 Commandments, but just random sins that his Mormon church is hung up on at the moment.

Their doctrine changes too as they amended that blacks were less valient and could not be priests etc

Slavery and the lack of value of females is throughout both testaments and was/is the way of life in the middle east.

All religions just serve as a template of social rules to try and control the masses.

Never understood why man needs to believe in Gods who create them to suffer and long for ultimate happiness by dying 😕

There was a funny book in the 80s that had a synopsis of all religions and highlighted the hyprocrisy of all their leaders - True Believers or something similar

As opposed to non believers, atheists and agnostics who are never hypocritical. Human beings are flawed, irrespective of their faith, ethnicity or lifestyle. It’s very liberating when a person becomes aware of this simple little fact.

 

[ricardo]

Slavers from North Africa were hitting Europe hard, depopulating much of the Mediterranean coastline of Spain, France & Italy leading to the USA's first international military action (Tripoli, hence the song). Fun fact.

 

[HappilyManly]

As opposed to non believers, atheists and agnostics who are never hypocritical. Human beings are flawed, irrespective of whatever faith, ethnicity or lifestyle they belong to. It’s very liberating when a person becomes aware of this simple little fact.

The point is that human nature is common to all irrespective of culture or religions.

Those that preach a dogma then contravene it are being called out on social media.

The rest of us just make it up as it suits us without fear of an after life punishment

 

[lsz]

Couldn’t agree with you more about every single person on the planet being afforded the same rights and liberties that’s for certain.

However, perhaps I might be a little on the slow side, because I fail to correlate how you arrived at the interpretation that there is any discriminatory ideals being presented in the above posts.

As far as I can tell... it has been suggested that there may be an agenda being pushed by SOME who identify as being gay. Just as there is an opposing agenda being pushed by SOME who identify as being Christian.

Is the expression of that opinion permitted on here? Or is it too offensive for you? Being a happy clappy, money laundering, sky fairy believing, God bothering, Zealot... I certainly don’t want to come across as overly objectionable in this wonderful new age of respect and inclusivity.

Huh?

All i am saying is gay / trans people deserve equal rights without discrimination...nothing more nothing less

 

[Kevinward777]

Huh?

All i am saying is gay / trans people deserve equal rights without discrimination...nothing more nothing less

Yes, but where is the counter view point to your statement in the above mentioned posts? I fail to see where anybody has implied any different.

 

[lsz]

Yes, but where is the counter view point to your statement in the above mentioned posts? I fail to see where anybody has implied any different.

If not stated it is implied - and something that may, far more articulate posters, have commented on before.

It is a sad fact that in this world what I am stating (free from prejudice etc) is something that still needs to be stated.

 

[Kevinward777]

The point is that human nature is common to all irrespective of culture or religions.

Those that preach a dogma then contravene it are being called out on social media.

The rest of us just make it up as it suits us without fear of an after life punishment

Has Israel Folau claimed to be without sin? Now that would qualify as a contravention of his chosen dogma... But as far as I can tell, he has always maintained that he is a sinner who has accepted Jesus Christ as a Saviour, and that Hell awaits all people who choose not to accept Christ. It’s a message which has been proclaimed/perverted/ridiculed/embraced/rejected etc for two thousand odd years. However, he didn’t write all people, and this has been interpreted as him promoting hatred towards one particular group.

 

[Kevinward777]

The point is that human nature is common to all irrespective of culture or religions.

Those that preach a dogma then contravene it are being called out on social media.

The rest of us just make it up as it suits us without fear of an after life punishment

And he’s a Christian... not a Mormon (anymore)

 

[Kevinward777]

If not stated it is implied - and something that may, far more articulate posters, have commented on before.

It is a sad fact that in this world what I am stating (free from prejudice etc) is something that still needs to be stated.

Do you feel the same strength of conviction about the material which gets posted on here (in much greater volume) that might be interpreted as discriminatory/offensive towards people who identify as being Christian?

 

[StuBoot]

There is only one Alan Jones I idolise, and it ain't the rugby media clown.

The Alan Jones I idolise is a World Champion.

Showing your age there @HoldenV8 !

 

[StuBoot]

And he’s a Christian... not a Mormon (anymore)

Is there a fundamental difference?

 

[Kevinward777]

Is there a fundamental difference?

Massive differences actually.

 

[frank stokes]

Has Israel Folau claimed to be without sin? Now that would qualify as a contravention of his chosen dogma... But as far as I can tell, he has always maintained that he is a sinner who has accepted Jesus Christ as a Saviour, and that Hell awaits all people who choose not to accept Christ. It’s a message which has been proclaimed/perverted/ridiculed/embraced/rejected etc for two thousand odd years. However, he didn’t write all people, and this has been interpreted as him promoting hatred towards one particular group.

Happy to live and let live Kev but I find it very hard to respect the opinion of anyone who sins their a*see off in their 20s and then becomes 'born again' and feels they have the right to preach to others about how to live their life 'righteously'... christ may accept hypocrites but it doesn't mean I have to...

 

[Kevinward777]

Happy to live and let live Kev but I find it very hard to respect the opinion of anyone who sins their a*see off in their 20s and then becomes 'born again' and feels they have the right to preach to others about how to live their life 'righteously'... christ may accept hypocrites but it doesn't mean I have to...

Agreed mate... hypocrisy is in any walk of life is hard to cop.

 

[wombatgc]

Gender discrimination/ politics and religion in one thread....who knew this would blow up!

 

[HoldenV8]

Showing your age there @HoldenV8 !

Oh well, I'm only 44 lol

 

[StuBoot]

Massive differences actually.

I said fundamentally the same.
Common denominator is the same.
How one spins their story is another and therein lies the rub.
Each one thinks their version is the best and correct one.

 

[Kevinward777]

I said fundamentally the same.
Common denominator is the same.
How one spins their story is another and therein lies the rub.
Each one thinks their version is the best and correct one.

Depends on what you determine as the necessary base that is responsible for driving the belief.

If the fundamentals which you’re referring to implies God at the top and man underneath, striving to live their lives by a moral standard to which none of us are capable of doing... then I agree.

 

[Lyonstomenzies]

The problem is, as Ian Roberts rightly pointed out, there are kids who will hear/see/read that kind of message who don’t yet have the resilience or thick skin to just brush it off like you or I might.

I have an old school friend whose husband speaks really eloquently on the subject, and what it was like as a kid growing up in a country town when he started to realise he was gay (at around the age of 9). He attempted suicide as a teenager, in no small part because of the vilification he was copping at the time.

This week at work we’ve had a colleague’s son take his own life at 17, and an absolutely gut-wrenching case of a 7 year old doing the same. We may never know the reasons behind it, but what’s for certain is that young people are choosing permanent, irreversible solutions to temporary problems at an alarming rate. Anything we can do to mitigate that is worth doing.

Respect @yokahontas