BUZZ Proof the salary cap isn't working

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DUFFMAN

Bencher
Don't know how this is news, everyone except Roosters and Storm fans knew this already.



The NRL salary cap is not working.
This list of arguably the top 100 players in the competition shows a significant gap between the top and bottom sides.

It demonstrates the premiership heavyweights have up to four times more elite stars than many of their struggling rivals and that the talent pool is lopsided, even with all teams spending $9.5 million.

The NRL will reasonably argue there have been seven different premiers in the past 10 years, that success goes in cycles, and that no sporting competition will ever have completely level rosters.

However, the New Zealand Warriors, the Gold Coast Titans and the Canterbury Bulldogs are clearly off the pace, with a combined eight players in the top 100. It is hard to believe they spend the same amount as the glamour clubs.

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The Penrith Panthers and the Newcastle Knights have only four top players each.

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The list of the NRL's top 100 players shows a significant gap between the top and bottom sides.
The list of the NRL's top 100 players shows a significant gap between the top and bottom sides.
Warriors recruitment chief Peter O’Sullivan has been in the NRL for 25 years and knows the business better than most. He has offered huge money to Matt Lodge, David Fifita and other big names in recent times with no results.

“They haven’t needed to move to get the bigger dollars,” O’Sullivan said.

“We have to develop them. We have to buy undervalued players and local kids and turn them into top 100 players.

“We are confident we are heading in the right direction.”

At the other end of the scale, premiers the Sydney Roosters still have the most elite players along with the Melbourne Storm, despite the retirement of Cooper Cronk and the departure of Latrell Mitchell.

The Canberra Raiders and the South Sydney Rabbitohs are the next strongest in the top 100.

It highlights the importance of having a coach who can attract players, or a smart one like Ricky Stuart who made a raid on Great Britain’s best talent to build his magnificent Raiders roster.

There are three coaching standouts in recruitment — Trent Robinson, Craig Bellamy and Wayne Bennett. Players will accept less to join their clubs because of their track records.

You then look at the Wests Tigers and coach Michael Maguire who, until signing the unwanted Joey Leilua last week, couldn’t attract a decent player.

Mitchell rejected Maguire’s $4 million offer over four years to accept an extraordinary $3.3 million less — a $700,000 one-season deal at the South Sydney Rabbitohs.

Latrell Mitchell knocked back a big Wests Tigers offer to join the Rabbitohs. Picture: Dylan Robinson
Latrell Mitchell knocked back a big Wests Tigers offer to join the Rabbitohs. Picture: Dylan Robinson
Boom forward Ryan Matterson broke his contract and walked out on the Tigers because he didn’t want to play under the 2014 premiership-winning coach. So too did powerful centre Esan Marsters.

Titans forward Jai Arrow took $200,000 a season less than he could have earned at the Wests Tigers to join the Rabbitohs. It’s said Maguire’s punishing approach at training is a turn-off for potential recruits.

Penrith’s Ivan Cleary is another who has struggled to attract top talent. He left the Wests Tigers in a terrible mess by paying way over the top for the likes of Josh Reynolds, Russell Packer and Ben Matulino.

He has also released top 100 players Dallin Watene-Zelezniak, Waqa Blake and Reagan Campbell-Gillard from the Panthers.

Back-to-back premiers the Roosters are often accused of rorting the salary cap. Yet they rarely get into bidding wars to keep players.

Mitchell was offered $800,000 a year for two seasons but knocked it back. They withdrew the offer.

They let Roger Tuivasa-Sheck go in 2016 because they refused to match the Warriors offer. The same with James Maloney, who was released in 2015.

It is a fact that elite players will accept less to play under Robinson, who has won three premierships in seven years.

The Roosters refused to match the Warriors’ offer for Roger Tuivasa-Sheck. Picture: Getty Images
The Roosters refused to match the Warriors’ offer for Roger Tuivasa-Sheck. Picture: Getty Images
Even youngsters like boom 17-year-old halfback Sam Walker will take less to play at Moore Park, for the opportunity to learn from the three-time premiership coach. He could have got $200,000 more at Belmore.

At the Roosters you are also almost guaranteed to play finals football and it increases your chances of playing State of Origin or Test football and getting the bonuses that go with it.

At the same time, the weaker clubs often have to pay overs to sign the bigger names — and that weakens the rest of the roster.

The Knights have a ‘‘big three’’ — Mitchell Pearce, Kalyn Ponga and Dave Klemmer — but have struggled to build a competitive roster around them because the funds have not been available.

That might change this year with the appointment of the highly regarded coach Adam O’Brien, although he will have basically the same roster that Nathan Brown failed with.

At least he’s come out of the Storm and Roosters systems — they are the best in the business.

NRL’S TOP 100 PLAYERS

Brisbane Broncos (7):
David Fifita, Payne Haas, Matt Lodge, Anthony Milford, Corey Oates, Tevita Pangai, Kotoni Staggs

Canberra Raiders (9): John Bateman, Nick Cotric, Jarrod Croker, Josh Hodgson, Josh Papalii, Charnze Nicoll-Klokstad, Elliott Whithead, Jack Wighton, Joseph Tapine

Canterbury Bulldogs (3): Will Hopoate, Josh Jackson, Dallin Watene-Zelezniak

Cronulla Sharks (6): Wade Graham, Andrew Fifita, Matt Moylan, Shaun Johnson, Bronson Xerri, Chad Townsend

Gold Coast Titans (3): Jai Arrow, Jarrod Wallace, Alexander Brimson

Manly Sea Eagles (7): Daly Cherry-Evans, Addin Fonua-Blake, Curtis Sironen, Marty Taupau, Jake Trbojevic, Tom Trbojevic, Dylan Walker

Daly Cherry-Evans of the Manly Sea Eagles. Picture: AAP
Daly Cherry-Evans of the Manly Sea Eagles. Picture: AAP
Melbourne Storm (11): Josh Addo-Carr, Nelson Asofa-Solomona, Jesse Bromwich, Kenny Bromwich, Dale Finucane, Felise Kaufusi, Ryan Papenhuyzen,

Cameron Munster, Brandon Smith, Cameron Smith, Suliasi Vunivalu

Newcastle Knights (4): Dave Klemmer, Mitchell Pearce, Kalyn Ponga, Daniel Saifiti

North Queensland Cowboys (5): Valentine Holmes, Kyle Feldt, Josh McGuire, Michael Morgan, Jason Taumalolo

Parramatta Eels (9): Waqa Blake, Dylan Brown, Nathan Brown, Blake Ferguson, Clint Gutherson, Mitchell Moses, Maika Sivo, Reagan Campbell-Gillard, Ryan Matterson

Penrith Panthers (4): Nathan Cleary, James Fisher-Harris, Viliame Kikau, James Tamou

Penrith’s Nathan Cleary. Picture: AAP
Penrith’s Nathan Cleary. Picture: AAP
St George-Illawarra Dragons (6): Tyson Frizell, James Graham, Ben Hunt, Tariq Sims, Paul Vaughan, Cameron McInnes

South Sydney Rabbitohs (8): Tom Burgess, Damien Cook, Dane Gagai, Latrell Mitchell, Cameron Murray, Adam Reynolds, James Roberts, Cody Walker

Sydney Roosters (11): Boyd Cordner, Angus Crichton, Jake Friend, Luke Keary, Joseph Manu, Brett Morris, Victor Radley, Sio Siua Taukeiaho, James Tedesco, Daniel Tupou, Jared Waerea-Hargreaves

New Zealand Warriors (2): Blake Green, Roger Tuivasa-Sheck

Wests Tigers (5): Luke Brooks, Benji Marshall, Moses Mbye, Joey Leilua, Adam Doueihi
 
"At the same time, the weaker clubs often have to pay overs to sign the bigger names — and that weakens the rest of the roster. "

Its actually gotten to the point where clubs like the Tigpies have to offer overs just to get name players to even consider them. And even then more often than not the better players still end up signing elsewhere.
 
Should be a point cap with a mixture of contract value, player rating as in rep player loading ( origin/international apperances) and club loyalty.

There are some smart cookies out there that could come up with a system.

Let's say
50% contract value
30% rep rating
20% years at club.

If it were a points based system that say every club could have 5000 ( might be too high) points for their roster.

On the money side every 100k equals 20 points

Rep side - 10 < less = 20 points
10 - 20 = 45 points
20 - 30 = 60 points
30 + = 100 points

Loyalty side
Club juniors from under 18s = minus 20 points

In addition to

Players at club 5 + years = minus 40 points
Players at club 8 + years = minus 60 points
Players at club 10 + years = minus 80 points



Take a cooper cronk for instance @ roosters.

Contract value = $900 k - 170 points
Rep rating = full rep player - 100 points
Loyalty - null

Value = 270 points

Tom Turbo

Contract value - 1.2million - 220 points
Rep rating - 20 points
Loyalty - minus 60

Value = 180

Thurston

Contract value - 1 million - 200 points
Rep rating - 100 points
Loyalty - minus 80

Value = 220

Now of course there needs to be a lot of calculations and the number ratings would change but that I think could be a pretty good basis to start.

Sorry for boring the ****e out of you.
 
Should be a point cap with a mixture of contract value, player rating as in rep player loading ( origin/international apperances) and club loyalty.

There are some smart cookies out there that could come up with a system.

Let's say
50% contract value
30% rep rating
20% years at club.

If it were a points based system that say every club could have 5000 ( might be too high) points for their roster.

On the money side every 100k equals 20 points

Rep side - 10 < less = 20 points
10 - 20 = 45 points
20 - 30 = 60 points
30 + = 100 points

Loyalty side
Club juniors from under 18s = minus 20 points

In addition to

Players at club 5 + years = minus 40 points
Players at club 8 + years = minus 60 points
Players at club 10 + years = minus 80 points



Take a cooper cronk for instance @ roosters.

Contract value = $900 k - 170 points
Rep rating = full rep player - 100 points
Loyalty - null

Value = 270 points

Tom Turbo

Contract value - 1.2million - 220 points
Rep rating - 20 points
Loyalty - minus 60

Value = 180

Thurston

Contract value - 1 million - 200 points
Rep rating - 100 points
Loyalty - minus 80

Value = 220

Now of course there needs to be a lot of calculations and the number ratings would change but that I think could be a pretty good basis to start.

Sorry for boring the ****e out of you.
That is probably the best alternative to a salary cap I have read - nice
 
I may get shot down here

But the main point for the cap is to stop clubs spending themselves in bankruptcy and a nice little sideline is that is helps even up the comp a bit.

For mine you want the well run clubs to reap the rewards without it getting to the Real Madrid Barcelona level....and I think we currently have the right balance.

Sure Titans, Bulldogs and Tigers are having a bad run but the Dogs screwed themselves and the Tigers and Titans have never been well run clubs.

Most others go through the cycle and have there moments in the sun

That said.........Roosters and Storm are cheats hahahahahahahaha
 
To determine if clubs are paying over the Cap you just need to ask: "How many local juniors are in the side?"
All young kids dream of playing for the team (area) they started playing with so they have a default loyalty factor. To overcome this a rival club would need to (a) offer greater chances of success and/or (b) more money/incentives.
How many truly local juniors do Easts and Melbourne have? I believe Victor Radley is the only one for Easts and I don't think Melbourne has any.
So, to stack their clubs with superstars it's obvious that they are paying more.
In Sydney Penrith, Doesn'tmatta and Wests produce the greatest number of talented youngsters which should mean they are our most successful clubs, but it is the opposite.
The reason is not hard to work out.
 
I suppose antoher interesting thing would to see how many players were signed when in top 100.

So while re-signing is also expenditure mpst of our top 100 were juniors or putside the 100 on signing.
 
The system is fine ... it is the administration of it that is incompetent and corrupt ...

Simply quadruple all penalties for breaches to the point no club would dare to cheat .... as an alternative to smacking clubs like Parra with a feather ... and then say we will do everything we can to help them ......
 
Should be a point cap with a mixture of contract value, player rating as in rep player loading ( origin/international apperances) and club loyalty.

There are some smart cookies out there that could come up with a system.

Let's say
50% contract value
30% rep rating
20% years at club.

If it were a points based system that say every club could have 5000 ( might be too high) points for their roster.

On the money side every 100k equals 20 points

Rep side - 10 < less = 20 points
10 - 20 = 45 points
20 - 30 = 60 points
30 + = 100 points

Loyalty side
Club juniors from under 18s = minus 20 points

In addition to

Players at club 5 + years = minus 40 points
Players at club 8 + years = minus 60 points
Players at club 10 + years = minus 80 points



Take a cooper cronk for instance @ roosters.

Contract value = $900 k - 170 points
Rep rating = full rep player - 100 points
Loyalty - null

Value = 270 points

Tom Turbo

Contract value - 1.2million - 220 points
Rep rating - 20 points
Loyalty - minus 60

Value = 180

Thurston

Contract value - 1 million - 200 points
Rep rating - 100 points
Loyalty - minus 80

Value = 220

Now of course there needs to be a lot of calculations and the number ratings would change but that I think could be a pretty good basis to start.

Sorry for boring the ****e out of you.

Well thought out, I’ve been advocating a points based system for years , no salary cap.

Clubs still get a grant but can pay whatever they like to the top players BUT on points they can only have XX of those on the books.
 
Great idea with a points system however, the big clubs will never buy into it and neither will the NRLPA. It is the obvious answer though.
 
Great idea with a points system however, the big clubs will never buy into it and neither will the NRLPA. It is the obvious answer though.

But you think they would because it means the really rich clubs can offer fortunes to get the best players ( albeit only 4 or 5).

Roosters could get the absolute top 5 players in the game , all on 5 million each.

Would they not go for that???
 
This all just reinforces the argument for either a draft or points rating system. But the rich clubs would oppose this firmly, especially Sydney City and Melbourne.
 
his all just reinforces the argument for either a draft or points rating system. But the rich clubs would oppose this firmly, especially Sydney City and Melbourne.
I thought it was the players that in the past have opposed a draft. Could be wrong.
 
Team P W L PD Pts
7 6 1 99 14
8 6 2 66 14
7 6 1 54 14
9 5 3 37 11
9 5 4 95 10
7 4 3 49 10
9 5 4 42 10
9 5 4 -14 10
7 3 4 17 8
8 4 4 -14 8
8 3 5 -55 8
8 4 4 -60 8
8 3 4 17 7
8 3 5 -25 6
7 2 5 -55 6
7 1 6 -87 4
8 1 7 -166 4
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