$3 Million worth of talent on the bench

[Fluffy]

Can somebody please tell me which of the following injuries are a result of poor strength and conditioning.

Snake's chronic hammie and knee.
Matai's neck
Turbo's ankle
Parcell's hammie
Jorge's shoulder.
Walkers hand.
Lyon's aging legs.
DCE's ?? whatever it was leg.

DCE has the same injury as TT - high ankle sprain. Will get the same surgery in the off season

 

[HappilyManly]

Stupid post given they started 1M over the cap.

And they had a full salary cap available for most of their first 6 wins so really really dumb post

and Semi is playing so incorrect anyway

Manly had Chez , Matai, Killer and Snake playing early on but still didn't win

Parra then were playing 3.5 million below - they were only 450k over this year.
In fact Choc never got a a run due to Scott damaging him in pre season.
So another 700k off their inflated playing roster


Semi hasn't been playing in all their winning games

Manly under performed in 2016 and need to identify the issues ASAP

 

[niccipops]

And we beat a team 40-0 who were cheating the cap

True, but only Manly can do that. Nobody else could.
It's beautiful history now.

 

[Woodsie]

Yes, we had a lot of injuries. I accept that. But we also made a lot of mistakes, hardly ever played to a game plan and, until the back end of the season, were about as resilient as a soggy paper bag if anything didn't go our way. For the bulk of the season we were just plain bad, and that's why we've missed the finals again.
So yeah, injuries are a valid excuse, but they're still an excuse and they deflect attention away from just how poorly this team has played. Bad management, bad coaching, bad luck - call it what you want, it's still bad.
We were told ad nauseam how much better we were going to be, how we'd skipped the rebuilding process and would go straight back to the top. I never believed it for a second, but a lot of people did and they have a right to be disappointed. By any measure, the season has been a failure.
I hope we're better next year and continue to improve. I'm not convinced Barrett is the man for the job but I hope he's at least given time to prove that he is. And in the meantime I don't want to hear any more excuses, valid or not. We finished where we deserved to finish. We weren't very good and we need to get better. The players and coaching staff need to admit that, stop talking about who isn't playing and what might have been, and just get on with the job.

You admit injuries are a valid excuse but then go on to ignore them and say we played bad. Perhaps the reason we played bad was the injuries (all to our halves and backs) caused so many team and positional changes (especially to our spine) over the first 10 weeks, that any form of cohesion or structure would be compromised.

Also I don't know what people who continually mention a lack of a game plan think a game plan is. 90% of a game plan is attacking and defensive structures that are constant week to week and trained into a squad from day I. And 10% variable, focusing on areas of perceived weakness or strength in the opposition weekly. eg Kick high to so and so, kick away from Radrara , attack up the middle, attack their left edge, etc.

To get a team to play those patterns consistently under pressure and stress can take the same team years to achieve. Teams like the Storm and Manly pre 2015 had the benefit of a large base of regular players all on the same page, always, and made it look easy.

As a result of some consistency in our pack over just 5 weeks you can see their improvement as the patterns become ingrained, our halves and backline however remain a dogs dinner, and no magic "game plan" will make any difference.

 

[Fluffy]

Manly had Chez , Matai, Killer and Snake playing early on but still didn't win

Parra then were playing 3.5 million below - they were only 450k over this year.
In fact Choc never got a a run due to Scott damaging him in pre season.
So another 700k off their inflated playing roster


Semi hasn't been playing in all their winning games

Manly under performed in 2016 and need to identify the issues ASAP

Yep great argument Missing Foran & Semi & choc they have really shown us the difference winning 1 game the entire season.

1 win is your argument, it is wrong

 

[Ron E. Gibbs]

You admit injuries are a valid excuse but then go on to ignore them and say we played bad. Perhaps the reason we played bad was the injuries (all to our halves and backs) caused so many team and positional changes (especially to our spine) over the first 10 weeks, that any form of cohesion or structure would be compromised.

Also I don't know what people who continually mention a lack of a game plan think a game plan is. 90% of a game plan is attacking and defensive structures that are constant week to week and trained into a squad from day I. And 10% variable, focusing on areas of perceived weakness or strength in the opposition weekly. eg Kick high to so and so, kick away from Radrara , attack up the middle, attack their left edge, etc.

To get a team to play those patterns consistently under pressure and stress can take the same team years to achieve. Teams like the Storm and Manly pre 2015 had the benefit of a large base of regular players all on the same page, always, and made it look easy.

As a result of some consistency in our pack over just 5 weeks you can see their improvement as the patterns become ingrained, our halves and backline however remain a dogs dinner, and no magic "game plan" will make any difference.

Woodsie, I just want them to stop talking about it and get on with fixing the problems. As for the game plan, I don't think we've had any attacking game plan all year. It's almost like the points we've scored have all come by accident and, occasionally, individual brilliance.
I agree that our forwards have started to look good and, on the back of that, our backs have been close to diabolically bad. That's not how it's supposed to work.
Anyway, here's hoping they lift today against the Storm. Go the Eagles!

 

[manlyfan76]

Well Parra are technically on 26 points with about 3 million on the sidelines too - Choc 700k, Fiz 1.4m, Peats, Paulo, Norman, Semi

Manly's combinations, due to lack of structures, is what greatly contributed to this year's results.
Being the most penalized Team, also contributes to the amount of extra defense that Manly have to do each game

Storm lose key player, and another one seamlessly slots in.
Same with the Titans

Last year was all an orchestrated failure to justify sacking a 28 year old Club Legend. Those injuries were all blamed on 2v and his support staff

It will be interesting to see how many seasons the Owners want to commit to the rookie Coach experiment

He won't be a rookie next year.

 

[bones]

Doesn't matter how much worth of talent is on the bench when we've only got $3 worth of talent in the coaching box.

 

[Bearfax]

And anybody that thinks not having Snake, Matai, Lyon, Parcell, T-Turbo,
Jorge, Walker and DCE missing for extended periods isn't a valid excuse is moon dribbling mad.

'Moon Dribbling'. Love it. But is it like some comments are Sun Snot.

 

[Enigma]

What Manly is going through is entirely understandable and no cause for short term panic. Instead of looking at the odd club which over performs each year like the Titans we should look at other recent premiers most of who have a golden period of grand finals and near misses but typically then have some really poor years. The rooters are the classic example who crash horribly between titles . The storm are a possible exception to an extent but they have the core of some "greats" who are still playing like greats. If our recent greats were still at their best we easily make the top eight. I did not believe the hype before the season started because I felt too many players were past their best. Somehow the Rooters and Bunnies have hopeless coaches without a game plan or is it just the way it is? Thru the Eagles history I reckon we have performed vaguely in line with our roster but rarely out performed. the exception I believe are the recent premierships and also Menzies /Lyons era where on paper Brisbane and Canberra were unbelievable. Based on the Titans logic if we get Neil Henry here next year we are certainties yet he had an amazing roster at the cows. It will be interesting to watch the storm in two years time but if they have a crash will it prove Bellamy is now a dud?

 

[conanu]

Anyone remember 2010? We had similar Injury Crisis that year but we still made finals.

From 2010:

Missing In Action… The Sea Eagles were decimated by injuries, but it wasn’t just at the end of the season that they were down on men. Brett Stewart went down in Round 1 with a knee injury and was out for the rest of the year, while David Williams’ shoulder troubles meant he didn’t feature at all. Shane Rodney, one of Manly’s most consistent players in 2010, was another to have his season cruelly cut short with a knee injury.

As the final game of the season arrived, the Sea Eagles finished the year with the following players either missing or under an injury cloud: Anthony Watmough, Jamie Lyon, Matt Ballin, Kieran Foran, Joe Galuvao, Brent Kite, and Ben Farrar – not to mention Jason King, Steve Matai, and Glenn Stewart, who were all suspended for the all-important finals game.

We still made the finals.

 

[Woodsie]

Anyone remember 2010? We had similar Injury Crisis that year but we still made finals.

From 2010:

Missing In Action… The Sea Eagles were decimated by injuries, but it wasn’t just at the end of the season that they were down on men. Brett Stewart went down in Round 1 with a knee injury and was out for the rest of the year, while David Williams’ shoulder troubles meant he didn’t feature at all. Shane Rodney, one of Manly’s most consistent players in 2010, was another to have his season cruelly cut short with a knee injury.

As the final game of the season arrived, the Sea Eagles finished the year with the following players either missing or under an injury cloud: Anthony Watmough, Jamie Lyon, Matt Ballin, Kieran Foran, Joe Galuvao, Brent Kite, and Ben Farrar – not to mention Jason King, Steve Matai, and Glenn Stewart, who were all suspended for the all-important finals game.

We still made the finals.

I think you have the wrong year old mate. Off the top of my head

Lyon only missed 3 games (rd 13, 14, & 16)
Ballin played every game.
Whatmough only missed 1 game (rd 14)
Foran only missed 2 games (rd10 & 12)
King played every game, only missed the semi.
Joe G. Only missed 2 games (RD 1 & 13)

Snake and Wolfie were replaced by Robertson and T-rex.

Best year we every had injury wise.

 

[Class of 96]

Yoga! Strength training is just that, but does not provide flexibility and to train the muscles to withstand extreme stretches.

 

[conanu]

I think you have the wrong year old mate. Off the top of my head

Lyon only missed 3 games (rd 13, 14, & 16)
Ballin played every game.
Whatmough only missed 1 game (rd 14)
Foran only missed 2 games (rd10 & 12)
King played every game, only missed the semi.
Joe G. Only missed 2 games (RD 1 & 13)

Snake and Wolfie were replaced by Robertson and T-rex.

Best year we every had injury wise.

I am qouting the 2010 season review from NRL.com

http://m.nrl.com/2010-season-review-manly-sea-eagles/tabid/10874/newsid/60313/default.aspx

If that was our best year for injuries, then jesus we must have had some bad ones old mate.

We lost to st merge 28-0 in the first semi with half of 1st grade out injured.

 

[Woodsie]

I am qouting the 2010 season review from NRL.com

http://m.nrl.com/2010-season-review-manly-sea-eagles/tabid/10874/newsid/60313/default.aspx

If that was our best year for injuries, then jesus we must have had some bad ones old mate.

We lost to st merge 28-0 in the first semi with half of 1st grade out injured.

Well, it is the worst revue in the history of the entire world.

The stats I posted are fact. I think only King, Rodney and Gifty missed the semi. Hardly half of FG. The writer must be related to our media manager.

 

[Enigma]

I think you have the wrong year old mate. Off the top of my head

Lyon only missed 3 games (rd 13, 14, & 16)
Ballin played every game.
Whatmough only missed 1 game (rd 14)
Foran only missed 2 games (rd10 & 12)
King played every game, only missed the semi.
Joe G. Only missed 2 games (RD 1 & 13)

Snake and Wolfie were replaced by Robertson and T-rex.

Best year we every had injury wise.

There seems to be lots of proof that we have a dud coach but maybe we should look at the other coaches and apply the same "proof"to their dudness. Are the coaches of the bottom six teams proven duds and the top six great coaches? If Barrett was coaching the Buns or chooks this year to the same results as they're having now would that be proof that he could not coach? Often teams in contention have had key injuries but still make the finals but rarely win so I wouldn't be surprised if this happened to us in the past.

 

[pjayz]

Anyone remember 2010? We had similar Injury Crisis that year but we still made finals.

From 2010:

Missing In Action… The Sea Eagles were decimated by injuries, but it wasn’t just at the end of the season that they were down on men. Brett Stewart went down in Round 1 with a knee injury and was out for the rest of the year, while David Williams’ shoulder troubles meant he didn’t feature at all. Shane Rodney, one of Manly’s most consistent players in 2010, was another to have his season cruelly cut short with a knee injury.

As the final game of the season arrived, the Sea Eagles finished the year with the following players either missing or under an injury cloud: Anthony Watmough, Jamie Lyon, Matt Ballin, Kieran Foran, Joe Galuvao, Brent Kite, and Ben Farrar – not to mention Jason King, Steve Matai, and Glenn Stewart, who were all suspended for the all-important finals game.

We still made the finals.

True, but we didn't have 8 new players in the roster, new coaching staff, new trainers etc etc all at once on top of the injuries. We also didn't have five 5 day turn-arounds in the first 8 or 10 weeks. Each one on their own isn't a big enough issue to justify our position on the ladder; however, when you add them all together - it has a huge impact.

 

[Bearfax]

I certainly want to see Barrett at the helm next year (unless Toovey is brought back which wont happen). Like Woodsie and Enigma I think he's had a dud year with injuries and being a first season coach he's had a lot to learn.

In a sense Manly's efforts this year have been good for the team and Barrett. For Barrett its meant he's had to learn some hard truths. He's got a way to go, but he'll be a much better coach next year than he would have had Manly close to the top 4. Hard learning is the best way to pick up skills. The same applies to Manly's better players coming through. Players like Lussick, DCE, Walker, Tommy T, Jake T. Knight, J. Hopoate, Taufua, Taupau, Buhrer, Tom Wright, Parcell, Koroisau, Lawrence, Starling, who I believe will be in the top 25 next year unless they move elsewhere, will have learned how hard it is to win and what they have to know to step up. All have had tough years through injury or playing in a regularly losing side in all grades.

With a few additions such as Meehan, Green etc and if they are able to keep injuries and suspensions down, this team can make the finals next year with ease. The defence is beginning to improve, and with a decent play making five eighth, they have the elements of team very much on the rise next year. If Barrett fails to take advantage of this by years end, then we look elsewhere, but not before.

 

[Jerry1]

I wouldn't disagree but highlight that fact that the slime got 12 of those 26 points while cap cheating.

To be fair they are the manly retirement home. They should b allowed a little more cap than everyone else as they offer fantastic retirement packages. You don't even have to turn up to training. You just sit on the sidelines & collect your mil per season. We owe them a great debt for looking after our past it players.

 

[Fluffy]

and the slime lost another one now they have a cap and some injuries.

but i was told it was just us