Goal Kicking Duties for 2018

[Brookie]

How?

5 tries a piece is even in my books. Hard to see how we would have won if both teams had even goal kicking.

Although we may not have scored 5 tries of we carried a specialist goal kicker who was not as good as the best 17 that were picked. 28-24 in a 5 tries to 4 loss with a better goal kicker could easily have been the result.

how you ask?

take a look at the final score.... thats HOW!

 

[Fluffy]

how you ask?

take a look at the final score.... thats HOW!

so a top line (80%) kicker kicks 4/5 and we win the game 28 points to the roosters 28?

Doesn't seem like a win to me, feels more like a draw. My maths must be slipping

 

[BOZO]

I'd rather blame the ref instead.. But you can't ignore the fact that converting tries or the lack of has been an issue for us. In tight games we can't always rely on DCE to save us with last ditched field goals where a good goal kicker would have decided the game earlier. So the truth is goal kicking can be the difference.

I'm with you Sparty . Lets look at the big picture
Lets look at the final top 8 where the teams are even and the games are tight .
Teams that go into those close games without a good goal kicker will get their ass kicked .
A good goal kicker is a game breaker .
Memories are made of this....

 

[Woodsie]

At the end of 1971, Ray Brannigan was far and away the best fullback at South Sydney ... however, Souths in their eternal wisdom decided it was far more important to keep the best goal kicker the world had ever seen at fullback solely for his kicking ability, one Eric Simms ....

Brannigan, wishing to play Fullback promptly left Souths to play for the glorious Sea Eagles and immediately won countless Grandfinals ..... whilst Souths, comforted by having the worlds best goal kicker, didn't win another premiership for 100 years ...

The moral of this story is ... play your best 17 numbnut ....

PSS Poor Ray, joined Manly to play fullback, but as fortune would have it ... somewhere between Redfern and Brookie, Arko had enticed a young fella called Eadie to Manly .... however, Ray went on to become a Manly great at centre.

 

[HoldenV8]

You know, even the best goal kickers get it wrong at times.

Who here remembers the 1995 Rugby League World Cup and the Semi-final between Australia and New Zealand at Huddersfield? A late Kevin Iro try in the corner locked the scores at 20-all and Matthew Ridge had a sideline kick to win the game for the Kiwis and knock us out of the tournament. A kick we had seen him put over the black dot many times when playing for Manly.

I wonder how Bozo felt at that point knowing that it was Ridge lining up the kick?

Well, he shanked it big time, it never even got close. And of course Australia went on to win 30-20 in extra time.

I didn’t see the trial, can DCE kick or are we still just clutching at straws?

At one point DCE was a very, very good goal kicker. He was our top point scorer in the U/20s in I think 2008 or 2009, and he was the top point scorer in the Qld Cup when playing for the Sunshine Coast in 2010 with a reputation of being able to kick goals from just about anywhere. But he was given the kicking duties at Manly in 2011 when Killer was reluctant to do so, and he seemed to lose confidence under the pressure. Ever since then his goal kicking has been patchy at best.

I'm with you Sparty . Lets look at the big picture
Lets look at the final top 8 where the teams are even and the games are tight .
Teams that go into those close games without a good goal kicker will get their ass kicked .
A good goal kicker is a game breaker .
Memories are made of this....

As good as that kick was, in both games 1 and 3 at Lang Park, Snoz couldn't buy a goal and some of his kicks, even easier ones than his game winning kick at the SFS, missed by the proverbial country mile. And those missed kicks ultimately cost NSW the series because Mal Meninga didn't have a much better time of it with his kicking for Qld, but he nailed them when it counted. People have questioned why Tim Sheens picked Snoz to kick over Greg Alexander and Rod Wishart when they were regular kickers for Penrith and Illawarra respectively, while Snoz had rarely kicked a goal since Matthew Ridge joined Manly in 1990, and before that he had generally shared the kicking with Mal Cochrane.

Having a quality goal kicker (around 80% or better these days) is a big asset to any side. But ideally you want that player to also be good enough to be part of the team on merit, unlike American football where they have specialist kickers who only ever get game time when there is a goal to be kicked.

 

[Fluffy]

It would have made a HUGE difference last year, if we had kicked 1 more goal in every game (roughly 20% better) we would have won ZERO more games.

Also we would have finished the season in 6th with the F/A change.

** assuming the player outside our best 17 is no worse than the player he replaces.

 

[Spartan Eagle]

I agree with @Woodsie that you have to field your best 17. It wouldn't hurt if amongst that group was a recognised goal kicker ..where that leaves us currently i don't know. But i guess the flipside to the argument is if we get the other basic things right ie defence, discipline, errors, completions ... the outcome of a game needn't be determmined by goal kicking .

 

[BOZO]

At the end of 1971, Ray Brannigan was far and away the best fullback at South Sydney ... however, Souths in their eternal wisdom decided it was far more important to keep the best goal kicker the world had ever seen at fullback solely for his kicking ability, one Eric Simms ....

Brannigan, wishing to play Fullback promptly left Souths to play for the glorious Sea Eagles and immediately won countless Grandfinals ..... whilst Souths, comforted by having the worlds best goal kicker, didn't win another premiership for 100 years ...

The moral of this story is ... play your best 17 numbnut ....

PSS Poor Ray, joined Manly to play fullback, but as fortune would have it ... somewhere between Redfern and Brookie, Arko had enticed a young fella called Eadie to Manly .... however, Ray went on to become a Manly great at centre.

The moral of the story is to get our facts right .....
In 1972 when Branighan joined Manly and we won the comp , Manly Were rebuilding and Souths were a club in financial trouble losing Dominant Players like Branighan , O'neill , Coote ,Cleary . Souths were a team on the slide and we were a team on the rise
In 1972 when we won our first Grand final against the roosters both teams scored 2 tries all. For Manly one each to Branighan and Jones and for the feather dusters one each to Ballesty and Mullens and the difference was Branighans match winning goals .

 

[BOZO]

I agree with @Woodsie that you have to field your best 17. It wouldn't hurt if amongst that group was a recognised goal kicker ..where that leaves us currently i don't know. But i guess the flipside to the argument is if we get the other basic things right ie defence, discipline, errors, completions ... the outcome of a game needn't be determmined by goal kicking .

From what you have seen of Croker , as I did not see the Roosters game . How much better player is he than our best goal kicker in Hasting ?
Is Croker that much better Player than Hasting and worth the sacrifice of a competent goal kicker in Hastings?

 

[HoldenV8]

The moral of the story is to get our facts right .....
In 1972 when Branighan joined Manly and we won the comp , Manly Were rebuilding and Souths were a club in financial trouble losing Dominant Players like Branighan , O'neill , Coote ,Cleary . Souths were a team on the slide and we were a team on the rise
In 1972 when we won our first Grand final against the roosters both teams scored 2 tries all. For Manly one each to Branighan and Jones and for the feather dusters one each to Ballesty and Mullens and the difference was Branighans match winning goals .

Interesting to note that the Chooks goal kicker that day was their fullback Allan McKean who was the top point scorer in the NSWRFL that year, scoring 220 points from 7 tries, 99 goals (how many attempts on goal weren't recorded, just those that scored) and 1 field goal.

The main difference was that Manly took goal kicking opportunities when they came up and Branighan had one of those days where he rarely missed. McKean and/or the Chooks captain Ron Coote knocked back some penalty kicks that day that could have made a difference.

 

[Spartan Eagle]

From what you have seen of Croker , as I did not see the Roosters game . How much better player is he than our best goal kicker in Hasting ?
Is Croker that much better Player than Hasting and worth the sacrifice of a competent goal kicker in Hastings?

I can't cast judgement based on one game. It's a coin toss. He had a better hit out and was more fluid than Hastings was when Hastings played in the trials against the sharks. But they were both playing in totally diffetent teams and circumstances.. To be honest I'll be happy with whatever TB decides.

 

[TimmyQ]

I can't cast judgement based on one game. It's a coin toss. He had a better hit out and was more fluid than Hastings was when Hastings played in the trials against the sharks. But they were both playing in totally diffetent teams and circumstances.. To be honest I'll be happy with whatever TB decides.

The comp is so tight and lets face it we don't have the flashest roster compared to a half dozen odd other teams with more TPA coin to spend. So the value of a sharp shooter kicker is huge - gives battlers like us a real boost and could definitely win us a few extra close ones. Given we will probably be fighting to make the 8 it could mean the difference. But flip side is can we afford to play a bloke on the basis of kicking ability and not because he's the best player in that position?? It's a horrible dilemma and sadly there's no correct answer!!

 

[SeaEagleRock8]

In 1972 when Branighan joined Manly and we won the comp , Manly Were rebuilding

Rebuilding? You joking? Manly had a core of top players who had been within a whisker of the premiership for several years.

 

[BOZO]

Rebuilding? You joking? Manly had a core of top players who had been within a whisker of the premiership for several years.

Joking ? Are you serious feathered friend . Under Arko which year were the Sea eagles not rebuilding . We were buying premierships like there was no 2morrow

 

[BOZO]

This song is dedicated to our very own God father and Manly Legend Arko who all the clubs envied .

 

[SeaEagleRock8]

Adding one or 2 stars to an established team is not a rebuild.
As to goal-kicking, it's true that the benefit of a top kicker averaged over a season may not look significant, nevertheless in certain matches it can have a big effect in deflating the opposition knowing each try will be 6 points, and can have the opposite effect on your own side's confidence.
I haven't seen enough of Hastings to judge his shortcomings but I suspect if he was a bit more tigerish in defence he would make the team. Ironic in a way as his dad was known for his defence and not so much for his attack.

 

[Michael Clare]

Pick your best 17 and throw the ball to the best kicker you have ....

I can honestly say that in 55years I have never blamed a loss on goal kicking ... it is like blaming a loss on one missed tackle or one dropped ball ..... just wrong ...

What about Lyon missing a goal against Bulldogs from the sideline to win a game in a game to win us a semi-final just before the whistle and then we lose to a field goal in extra time?

 

[Woodsie]

What about Lyon missing a goal against Bulldogs from the sideline to win a game in a game to win us a semi-final just before the whistle and then we lose to a field goal in extra time?

What happened during the other 79min and 59 seconds of the game?

 

[Spartan Eagle]

What happened during the other 79min and 59 seconds of the game?

Haha, I was just about to say the same thing..

 

[double hoops]

I've got a question for our goal kicking coach. Why the hell are you training all our goal kickers to take the ball back the least of anyone in this comp? This started in 2016. API, Walks, Matty, now Turtle. They all do it. Kicking from like 10 and 15 metres out?

Every other clubs kicker seems to be around the 20 metre mark. It opens up that gap between the post wider. Given we seem to be the only club missing really easy kicks close to the post. Do you think you theory here needs to change!