Why the salary cap doesn't work

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Technical Coach link said:
Because its a restraint of trade and the sooner its killed off the better the game will be. The excuse \"saving clubs from themselves\" is pathetic---if a club is unable to manage its own financial affairs within their own financial constraints then they dont deserve to survive.

Imposing artificial restraints on free markets will only fuel rorting of the system due to the powers of supply and demand---players earning capacities(and anyone in general) should never be restrained through any type of regulation. In the end if you have a salary cap or not its still usually the teams that spend more overall(staff facilities etc etc) that come out on top anyway.

We all know 90% of clubs exceed the cap and my own personal opinion is that Manly are one of the biggest offenders. Lets be honest with ourselves take off the blinkers and drop the Melbourne hatred if you look at our squads in 07-08 you cant tell me we are not far behind in the rorting scales.

I fully supported the salary cap when the ARL and SuperLeague merged back together as a temporary measure to get the game back up and running plus the unfair advantages the Super League clubs had at the time in relation finances but those days are long gone.

This can go into more detail in relation to (what constitutes reasonable restraint) in the eyes of the law but i'll bore you guys another time.




 

Is this Reyam,or lotti?
 
Rusty link said:
Here is my plan :

Introduce 8 more teams,

Wellington
Perth
Adelaide
Central Coast
West Brisbane
Hunter Valley / Northern Nsw
Sunshine Coast / Central QLD
PNG

Then divide the competition into two 12 team comps, with the bottom 4 being placed in the lower division, add in promotion/relegation for the bottom two/ top two. Have a full 22 round home/away season, and a shorter season at that.

The benifits :

More teams.

More games a weak.

Easy path to expansion, simply add teams to the lower comp, then promote extra teams to keep the two comps equal in size.

Reason for teams to play late in the season, top of the table to the bottom, even those not in finals contention must fight to stay up.

A team can not go from the bottom to the top in one season, since they must get promoted in the middle.

Punishment for being poor, ie sharks, melbourne, cowboys, would all risk dropping down.

I'd be in favour of this system - I've often thought that a regime similar to that of the English Premier League should be the model that sports competitions are based around.
 
codewana link said:
[quote author=Rusty link=topic=184332.msg279146#msg279146 date=1280213609]
Here is my plan :

Introduce 8 more teams,

Wellington
Perth
Adelaide
Central Coast
West Brisbane
Hunter Valley / Northern Nsw
Sunshine Coast / Central QLD
PNG

Then divide the competition into two 12 team comps, with the bottom 4 being placed in the lower division, add in promotion/relegation for the bottom two/ top two. Have a full 22 round home/away season, and a shorter season at that.

The benifits :

More teams.

More games a weak.

Easy path to expansion, simply add teams to the lower comp, then promote extra teams to keep the two comps equal in size.

Reason for teams to play late in the season, top of the table to the bottom, even those not in finals contention must fight to stay up.

A team can not go from the bottom to the top in one season, since they must get promoted in the middle.

Punishment for being poor, ie sharks, melbourne, cowboys, would all risk dropping down.

I'd be in favour of this system - I've often thought that a regime similar to that of the English Premier League should be the model that sports competitions are based around.
[/quote]


What's that, most clubs with huge debts, trying to keep up with the Jones'.
 
TokyoEagle link said:
[quote author=codewana link=topic=184332.msg279238#msg279238 date=1280240820]
[quote author=Rusty link=topic=184332.msg279146#msg279146 date=1280213609]
Here is my plan :

Introduce 8 more teams,

Wellington
Perth
Adelaide
Central Coast
West Brisbane
Hunter Valley / Northern Nsw
Sunshine Coast / Central QLD
PNG

Then divide the competition into two 12 team comps, with the bottom 4 being placed in the lower division, add in promotion/relegation for the bottom two/ top two. Have a full 22 round home/away season, and a shorter season at that.

The benifits :

More teams.

More games a weak.

Easy path to expansion, simply add teams to the lower comp, then promote extra teams to keep the two comps equal in size.

Reason for teams to play late in the season, top of the table to the bottom, even those not in finals contention must fight to stay up.

A team can not go from the bottom to the top in one season, since they must get promoted in the middle.

Punishment for being poor, ie sharks, melbourne, cowboys, would all risk dropping down.

I'd be in favour of this system - I've often thought that a regime similar to that of the English Premier League should be the model that sports competitions are based around.
[/quote]


What's that, most clubs with huge debts, trying to keep up with the Jones'.
[/quote]

Arg! Pick one of the only negatives about a system and base your whole opinion around that why don't you...  ;) ;)

The main pro for such a system is forcing teams to play for the whole season no matter what the position on the ladder.

Also how good would it be to see a promotion-relegation game challenge, where the top two teams in the lower division would play the bottom two in the top division, the winners getting the spots for the next year. They would pack out the stadiums and the passion would be huge.

Plus I would love to be able to dance on the graves of certain teams when they went down. Think how much sweeter the storm mess would be if they were given automatic relegation as part of the punishment.
 
TokyoEagle link said:
[quote author=codewana link=topic=184332.msg279238#msg279238 date=1280240820]
[quote author=Rusty link=topic=184332.msg279146#msg279146 date=1280213609]
Here is my plan :

Introduce 8 more teams,

Wellington
Perth
Adelaide
Central Coast
West Brisbane
Hunter Valley / Northern Nsw
Sunshine Coast / Central QLD
PNG

Then divide the competition into two 12 team comps, with the bottom 4 being placed in the lower division, add in promotion/relegation for the bottom two/ top two. Have a full 22 round home/away season, and a shorter season at that.

The benifits :

More teams.

More games a weak.

Easy path to expansion, simply add teams to the lower comp, then promote extra teams to keep the two comps equal in size.

Reason for teams to play late in the season, top of the table to the bottom, even those not in finals contention must fight to stay up.

A team can not go from the bottom to the top in one season, since they must get promoted in the middle.

Punishment for being poor, ie sharks, melbourne, cowboys, would all risk dropping down.

I'd be in favour of this system - I've often thought that a regime similar to that of the English Premier League should be the model that sports competitions are based around.
[/quote]


What's that, most clubs with huge debts, trying to keep up with the Jones'.
[/quote]

Yeah, that's what I was talking about....

I was referring to the structure - why would anyone go and watch a Cronulla game now? Everyone knows they won't make it to the finals, so stadiums won't be filled. If there were a chance they could be relegated then it gives reason to watch the lower teams play.
 
codewana link said:
[quote author=Rusty link=topic=184332.msg279146#msg279146 date=1280213609]
Here is my plan :

Introduce 8 more teams,

Wellington
Perth
Adelaide
Central Coast
West Brisbane
Hunter Valley / Northern Nsw
Sunshine Coast / Central QLD
PNG

Then divide the competition into two 12 team comps, with the bottom 4 being placed in the lower division, add in promotion/relegation for the bottom two/ top two. Have a full 22 round home/away season, and a shorter season at that.

The benifits :

More teams.

More games a weak.

Easy path to expansion, simply add teams to the lower comp, then promote extra teams to keep the two comps equal in size.

Reason for teams to play late in the season, top of the table to the bottom, even those not in finals contention must fight to stay up.

A team can not go from the bottom to the top in one season, since they must get promoted in the middle.

Punishment for being poor, ie sharks, melbourne, cowboys, would all risk dropping down.

I'd be in favour of this system - I've often thought that a regime similar to that of the English Premier League should be the model that sports competitions are based around.
[/quote]

I agree guys, makes a lot of sense!
Won't be "weak"though, code
 
I agree with a couple of points made earlier by er08 and TC. Firstly, I think a points system is a must. With the independent commission I'd like to see a committee whose sole job is allocating and reviewing points assigned for all NRL players. The points could be assigned around this time each year for the following year so clubs can recruit accordingly. Concessions for length of service and local juniors can be incorporated into this. The point allocations should be made public so there is complete transparency.
Secondly, as TC said the 'saving clubs from themselves argument' is complete garbage. We are constantly told how clubs are now businesses and if a business, or anyone for that matter, spends beyond their means, they go broke. End of story. Players should be allowed to earn whatever the market dictates. The point system would be used only to guard against clubs stockpiling players, not to restrict their earning capacity.
 
Technical Coach link said:
if a club is unable to manage its own financial affairs within their own financial constraints then they dont deserve to survive.

I agree and I'm all for an independent commission to take over from the current administration to get News Ltd out of the game but the financial failure of teams is my biggest concern with the clubs having ownership of the said Independent Commission.  How will ownership work if clubs are bankrupt and forced into receivership?  Do they lose their share of ownership or do they somehow still keep it and maintain a position in the administration? How can expansion of the game go forward if the current NRL teams have ownership? What incentive is there for them to even consider expansion or relocation?
 
blitzkrieg link said:
[quote author=codewana link=topic=184332.msg279238#msg279238 date=1280240820]
[quote author=Rusty link=topic=184332.msg279146#msg279146 date=1280213609]
Here is my plan :

Introduce 8 more teams,

Wellington
Perth
Adelaide
Central Coast
West Brisbane
Hunter Valley / Northern Nsw
Sunshine Coast / Central QLD
PNG

Then divide the competition into two 12 team comps, with the bottom 4 being placed in the lower division, add in promotion/relegation for the bottom two/ top two. Have a full 22 round home/away season, and a shorter season at that.

The benifits :

More teams.

More games a weak.

Easy path to expansion, simply add teams to the lower comp, then promote extra teams to keep the two comps equal in size.

Reason for teams to play late in the season, top of the table to the bottom, even those not in finals contention must fight to stay up.

A team can not go from the bottom to the top in one season, since they must get promoted in the middle.

Punishment for being poor, ie sharks, melbourne, cowboys, would all risk dropping down.

I'd be in favour of this system - I've often thought that a regime similar to that of the English Premier League should be the model that sports competitions are based around.
[/quote]

I agree guys, makes a lot of sense!
Won't be "weak"though, code
[/quote]

I don't think it will lead to a weaker game all round, the second division would obviously be weaker, but since teams would be playing at their level then it wouldn't be so noticeable.

The key point would be that we could then raise the cap more and if a team was unable to spend the whole thing they would likely drop down and a team able to spend it would rise up. Ideally there would be more then two divisions to allow this to work to its full effect, but since RL is a small sport still it would take a long time to implement.

My plan could be put in place in 2013, since most of the teams in my list are either in the NSW or QLD cups or actively bidding for an NRL team currently. Yes doing it quickly would mean that none of them would be NRL standard teams overnight, but since they would be in a second division they would have time to develop as they would only be playing the bottom 4 NRL sides. And frankly who doesn't think that some NSW or QLD cup side would give the sharks a run for their money currently.
 
does he means more games are weak or more games a week..?? because if we start  adding more teams obviously  the player talent want be as good  in most of those new teams so yeah the games played every week might be weak lol
 
jjai link said:
does he means more games are weak or more games a week..?? because if we start  adding more teams obviously  the player talent want be as good  in most of those new teams so yeah the games played every week might be weak lol

Well you would have 6 games per division, or 12 all up and the lower 6 would be weaker, but my point is perhaps it wouldn't matter since they would be more even.
 
I don't like the 2 division idea at all

Main reasons being, although people already say loyalty is dead, there is still a bit of it around, however if you split teams into 2 groups the star players will all gravitate towards the top Div for rep opportunities etc, which conversely also means that the sides in Div 2 also can't recruit a big name, because a big name won't want to play lower level footy. Fans won't turn up in droves to see the sides battling it out at the bottom of Div 2 either

Using the English set up as an example of this, how many big names in the world of football are picked from Div 2 EPL sides
 
Well i did play under 10s and PSSA with a current 1st grader and an ex panther/bronco who left for england,with 48 teams id be a interchange for manly
 

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