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Too Predictable and lack of Speed

Discussion in 'Rugby League Forum' started by Darren, Aug 8, 2009.

  1. Darren

    Darren Well-Known Member

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    This year we have been worked out, basically Mattai, Lyon, Orford, Glenn Stewart and Robbo cannot break the line or run thru gaps. That leaves Watmough as our only attacking weapon. With no Stewie, there isn't anyone else.

    Glenn plays wide and runs back in or has to pass, he just ain't quick enough for wide 2nd row. Mattai does that show the ball, jink left and look to his winger or take the tackle. Lyon and Ox just don't have enough toe to beat defenders. Robbo looks good but rarely beats anyone.

    It doesn't leave much in the tank, HENCE THE RUNNING ACROSS FIELD ALL THE TIME LOOKING FOR RUNNERS (IE SOMEONE ELSE WITH SPEED)

    Our 1 out stuff 4-5 every set shows Des's reluctance to throw the ball around, Kite and Perry lock it up and bye bye second phase ball. We are easy to play and never use anything to surprise the opposition.

    Now our kicking game, its horrendous, tell me with professionals, how come no one can put that ball in the goal line and make it sit!!! Week in, Week out, other teams do it to us, we just kick straight to fullback, wingers and they get back to where we kick, this is real problem for us, if we make finals Soward will kick us our of the match. 
     
  2. eagle_predator

    eagle_predator Active Member

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    The reason our kicking game is S**t is that Ox can't kick for S**t most of the time and has little vision what so ever in that area. Don't get me wrong he pulls off some great kicks here and there but most of his kicking options are poor at best imo and a half has to have a good kicking game.
     
  3. Darren

    Darren Well-Known Member

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    you write with such passion predator  ;) you sum it up quite nicely though  ;D

    Except for grand final, He has to rate as one of the worst kickers I've ever watched in first grade as a regular kicker. What about when he puts up a bomb, it always lands either 20 metres out or in goal with no chance for runners. At least he doesn't kick for touch anymore, I used to say there's an extra 10 metres top with a penalty lol  ;D

    40/20 he struggles to kick 30 metres to start with  ::) give the 20 a miss
     
  4. Moops

    Moops Well-Known Member

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    In regards to a alck of speed, I heard that Jennings was looking at testing his value on the open market. Apparently he has a clause in his contract to do so. I am salivating at the prospect of Jennings and Snake being in the same backline. No speed? Problem solved.
     
  5. eagle_predator

    eagle_predator Active Member

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    Most clubs if not all would love to have Jennings on their books so to speak if he was to leave the Panthers ?

    That said i wouldn't say no to him signing up with Manly he can play at Centre or Wing however he would come at a price though i would think ?
     
  6. missing_something

    missing_something Active Member

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    I think we've got a massive problem with small backs already and while it would be great to have him we'd need to look at moving a couple of people on if we did.
     
  7. eagle_predator

    eagle_predator Active Member

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    I think we've got a massive problem with small backs already and while it would be great to have him we'd need to look at moving a couple of people on if we did.
    [/quote]

    Well i wouldn't want Matai going anywhere that's for sure he is one of the best centres in the world.
     
  8. PONTIAN SEA EAGLE

    PONTIAN SEA EAGLE Well-Known Member

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    In other words nothing much has changed since last year too predictable & lack of speed yet we still won the grand final.
     
  9. Cameron

    Cameron Cambo Premium Member

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    It's a bit harsh to give Ox such a bad wrap when the entire team played crap.

    He's only as good as his forwards are & tonight they were absolutely abysmal.

    Don't forget that it was that tosser Tony that dropped the high ball twice and let 2 tries through. I am one to give Orford **** when he plays like **** but it is not fair to say what you said as our garden gnome may be richer than you but he cannot do everything.
     
  10. Rex

    Rex Well-Known Member

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    Manly again played without composure and control, as again indicated by the completion count differential, which flattered Manly.

    And Manly's looking for too many soft options. Just like those people who put all responsibility for Manly's deficiencies on one player.  Manly's problems are bigger than one player can change - whether that's Ox or Snake. But if Hodkinson were up to it, a massive change like that could possibly be one part of a desperate plan to get Manly players out of mental ruts and individually looking at their own games creatively again, and stop looking for one player to do all their creative thinking.  Off the bench?  

    They're mentally trying too hard for all-eggs-in-one-basket miracle plays and physically trying too little to build pressure by putting multiple creative questions to the opposition. The stress on Wolfman's face nowadays is indicative of the team's mental state.  Apart from Tony Williams who desperately needs time in a lower grade if he's to have a chance to develop the desire and know-how for top grade as a forward or back. He's had his taste of top-grade and demotion to fix some issues now will only do him good. Foran to 5/8th or centres and Farrer to wing? Foran's defence is top-notch and he wouldn't have gifted their last try like Matai did.  Wolfman needs to see a good sports psychologist.

    The simple Kite/King try at the end shows what can happen when low risk multiple questions are put to the defence and the defence doesn't respond.  Those sort of questions - multiple creative threats - need to be put on virtually every play in the opposition's 20, not just on the last tackle.  And not just from one person.  Souths tries at the end were creative and simple and came from different players and from dummy half plays with the physical exertion of dummy runners running creative lines and being genuine threats. They didn't rely on a single point of attack and instead responded to whatever decisions our defence made.  And they didn't wait for the last tackle or kick away all future opportunities away on the first.

    At least twice Manly kicked away great attacking field possession on the first tackle (Matai & Lyon) with very, very soft options, rather than building pressure.  They are falsely counted in stats as "completions" of sets, and should be counted as early tackle errors.  Trying too hard for the high-risk miracle play rather than putting multiple questions on the opposition.  Wolfman rightly copped heaps in SOO and again recently when he chipped ahead on an early tackle to gift the opposition the ball.  Those two kicks against Souths weren't chip and chases, but were more in wild hope than reasonable expectation.  And easily covered.  And in effect they were equally as reckless as Wolfman's.

    The expectations on Watmough from the press this week showed. He was twice rightly penalised for marking up half a metre to the left of the play-the-ball when he knocked the ball out of the opposition's dummy-half hands and spent his time arguing with officials and teammates rather than reflecting on his own soft choices. Watmough's head getting out of control tends to follow press strokes to his ego.  Just like after the WCC final.  Very lucky not to be sin-binned. And when Merritt chased through for the last play under the posts kick-try in the first half, Watmough left King stranded to deal with the threat.  Everyone knows Merritt is the target equivalent of a Slater or Snake for kicks and he was given an oh-so-easy passage.  Lack of awareness or couldn't be bothered?  Maybe a bit of both but primarily the former.  Manly seem to be playing without alert awareness in both attack and defence.

    The penalty count differential was bigger than the numbers suggest.  Manly's penalties came largely on the first tackle in attacking positions (effectively meaning only one extra tackle), or at the death when the game was over.  The refereeing performances, especially from that junior referee, were "ordinary".  Some of the penalties he gave for laying on the player, if consistently applied, would result in penalties in every tackle.  And ridiculous penalties like those decide momentum and decide matches. Dump the junior referee. Both that one and the system itself. And dump Harrigan and his ego as a video ref.  Was he on drugs? Does he not know benefit of the doubt goes to the attacking team?

    If this game doesn't lead to a Manly wakeup call, then the season appears to be gone.

    Rant over.
     
  11. Berkeley_Eagle

    Berkeley_Eagle Current Status: 24/7 Manly Fan 2016 Tipping Competitor

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  12. Darren

    Darren Well-Known Member

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    I'd hate to say it but Mattai isn't in the top few centres in the world. I think many of us Manly supporters have the blinkers on, Folau, Hodges, Jennings, Inglis, Josh Morris, Idris, Tonga, Chris Lawrence (destroyed us last week) and not even thought of English centres. Idris wrecked Mattai this year. Last year he was up there, look at his try record, is it 3 or 4 this year in 15-20 games?? When you look at those names, they can score tries.

    Some even say on here that Lyon is best 5/8 in the world.  ::)


    Choc at present would be top 3 forwards in the world, Brett when playing this year is top 3,

    We need to look at Foran, Lussick, Buhrer and Dean Whare next year. We need a direct shot of youth, enthusiasm and speed. David Williams smiling as he came off last night sums up our position. Saints are playing like us last year.
     
  13. DVS Matt

    DVS Matt Well-Known Member 2016 Tipping Competitor

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    Saturday can't come quick enough

    We need to try and dig ourselves out of this mess FAST - doesn't look good though
     
  14. Utility Player

    Utility Player Well-Known Member

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    Yes I uttered a few choice words on both occasions

    After Monday nights display I thought Killer might have put the tactical kicking cue in the rack.
     
  15. Moops

    Moops Well-Known Member

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    I don't get all of the love for Matai THIS year, either. To be honest, he hasn't had a great year. And comparing Matai to Jennings, well, I have heard everything now!
     
  16. DSM5

    DSM5 Well-Known Member 2016 Tipping Competitor

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    Rex, you're analysis is excellent regarding the crap dished up last night.  But the question remains, just who is responsible for the poor tactical play, the lateral running, the last tackle options, the ever so slow play the balls, the lack of a game plan.  When I see all those things unfold on the playing field you must ask yourself just who is responsible for this mess.  I consider it totally unacceptable that a bunch of professional football players can present that stuff to their supporters without apologising.          
     
  17. Matabele

    Matabele Well-Known Member

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    It looks like Rex has joined the evil ranks of the untrue supporters.  One must always support the side, regardless of whatever pap they throw up it seems. 
     
  18. KaZa

    KaZa Well-Known Member

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    our centres GET NO BALL. I dont even remember Matai getting a pass to run into space..

    Orford cant pass. Hes useless. Lyon cant pass... He needs to go back to centre.
     
  19. Si

    Si Member

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    It annoyed me that Choc got penalised twice for infringements in the ruck. The refs let the attacking played get up, move forward and to the side of the mark and then penalise the front marker for standing where he should be.

    They have to get something sorted out. It is absurd at times.
     
  20. nita

    nita Member

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    that's what i've been trying to work out. I feel like I need someone to blame. I don't think there's any one person.

    We know they can do it. Compare this year to last year.. This years side is just as talented (if not, more so) than last year. Sure we had dramas with Brett, but they've had 26 rounds to deal with it.

    It's all in their heads I think.. How can they snap out of it?
     

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