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RiP Australia

Discussion in 'General Discussion Forum' started by cherry_poppins, May 28, 2013.

  1. cherry_poppins

    cherry_poppins Well-Known Member

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    Its been a few days now since the announcement was made and sooner or later a another will follow that will see our country lose part of its heritage,while we may not be losing kangaroos,emus or koalas to extinction we have another 2 icons with numbered days

    As a kid growing up and a Manly fan i knew hate,i knew love and i knew passion,this country is throwing away something more iconic than disgusting Vegemite

    I am of course talking about the Falcon and impending doom of the Commodore,as a blue blood i already know my fate is sealed,my passion is being taken away by the rising sun (Mazda 3 oh how i despise you,you plastic piece of unmitigated rubbish),i blame Japan due to making more affordable cars than these 2 iconic brands,the Falcon has had a few near death experiences before but now we know the big Aussie is over,while the government gives Holden money for free to keep its plants up and running for an extra 2 years the same can't be done for its reason for being great,the Falcon is in fact the Commodores muse,as is the Commy to the big blue oval,the reduction of the tarriffs on these imports was a death knell for our long lived hero cars

    When your stuck in the back seat of a Mazda 3 with your hanging goods stuck to both inner thighs you'll miss these legends as you prize your legs slowly but painfully apart,how will many of us one day become grandparents without the backseat of such a beautiful piece of Australia,the Falcon and Commodore is responsible for more "accidental" Australians than our beer will ever be,not to mention good luck carting more than 1 kid at a time in such a tiny tincan of absolute crap,heads will be bruised my friends,i assure you

    They promise they aren't done in Australia,i for one do not have any desire to drive a bum dragging bucket of poorly crafted ****,i want to drive a car designed by this country for this country (and NZ),our roads and conditions make buying less durable cars a futile effort,our flag as a nation is BLUE,RED and WHITE (Falcon,Commodore......White goods on wheels *Cough Camry cough*),the travesty of this is we are being forced into a place where you'll all regret going,no more will you be able to look out of your Aussie car at one of our sunsets,blissfully cruising along in full comfort

    We might as well get on our knees suck a big american load and discontinue cricket,start major league baseball up in its place followed by culling our native flora and fauna for american pit bulls and other trashy american crap,such as Lindsay Lohan among others,we will have our own Australian versions of snookie i can assure you,if you don't know what a snookie is i envy you

    Our nations soul is being sold to the highest bidder and i for one would rather go get myself a rear wheel eurotrash car than drive anything Ford or Holden will bring in to "replace" these iconic machines

    Rest in peace Australia,we shall miss thee
     
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  2. Dan

    Dan Administrator Staff Member Administrator 2016 Tipping Competitor

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    *backs away slowly
     
  3. Bradza

    Bradza Well-Known Member 2016 Tipping Competitor

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    You'll get over it.
     
  4. cherry_poppins

    cherry_poppins Well-Known Member

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    Thats like asking Manly fans to accept the Northern Eagles
     
  5. WESTIE

    WESTIE Well-Known Member

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    Ive got a VG valiant sedan sitting out in the paddock possibly rusting away slowly, not sure to the extent of the rust as I haven't checked....stopped being driven in it in about 86....i have driven ( in order ) - a holden astra hatch, nissan hatch , camry , 94 lancer and now atm a 2000 hyundai lantra....loved the lancer 2 door... as far the young westie kids are concerned, id be lookin to get the val up and running again for them to drive..they are 9yo atm.....the olds drive a falcon futura....if i had to buy a car atm , id be looking at an aurion - the model just before the current shape...but i can see where cherry is coming from and can feel his pain - i couldnt give the val away or even sell it - too much sentiment -hence plonking it out the back .
     
  6. Chip and Chase

    Chip and Chase True Supporter Staff Member Administrator Premium Member 2016 Tipping Competitor

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    Falcons are made by lazy Aussies, where "she'll be right" attitude reigns. I've owned 3 Fords in my time and none of them had the quality of finish that you get with the Japanese brands. Currently my missus's Subaru ****s all over my Territory in terms of quality of build. Crummidores aren't any better. I won't be shedding any tears.
     
  7. Wolfpack

    Wolfpack Well-Known Member

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    Geez, if a model of car is one of the countries icons is a make of car it doesn't say a lot for the country. By that logic, you're insulting Australia by claiming the above as national icons.

    Quit hating on Australia, man.
     
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  8. cherry_poppins

    cherry_poppins Well-Known Member

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    Australian cars are barely under European cars in terms of quality,but in terms of bang for Buck **** all over them,a 5 series BMW will set you back a rural property,a falcodore will set you back half that at the least, the new HSV GTS is a Ferrari slayer for the price of an entry level 5 series (note,the 5 series BMW is roughly the size of a falcodore )

    I like a drivers car, Japan unless at top level (nismo etc) have the handling of a dingy and the punch of a year old banana and the traction (due to fwd setup )of a thong on a soapy wet floor, also the territory is a throw together car and to be frank a terrible choice,everyone who buys one should have a seperate SUV license because most owners are terrible drivers with zero spacial perception and could use a course in advanced parking (Yeah you know her, the tiny girl with a big car who steals precious time of your life because she has to do a 8796846 point maneuver to get out of her ****ing parking space, sorry ladies )
     
  9. Kiwi Eagle

    Kiwi Eagle Moderator Staff Member 2016 Tipping Competitor

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    As long as it starts when I turn the key and responds when I touch the pedals I don't care what sort of car it is
     
  10. Dan

    Dan Administrator Staff Member Administrator 2016 Tipping Competitor

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    I had a bommodore for about a year, in that time it cost me $5000 in parts and labour. So I sold it and bought a Rav4. The Rav4 is awesome. though I would prefer to just have something like a Koranda or a cherry because all I want from a car is one that I can put stuff and people in and drive it.

    I also have a 1996 hilux ute, no bells and whistles but still going strong with over 250,000 clicks on it
     
  11. Chip and Chase

    Chip and Chase True Supporter Staff Member Administrator Premium Member 2016 Tipping Competitor

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    All I know is that I don't understand why they can't build a car where

    * The seat belt retracts like it is supposed to
    * The handbrake light doesn't come on when you are cruising down the freeway at 120kph and consequently cuts out the cruise control because it thinks you have pulled the brake.
    * The power windows work
    * The central locking works
    * There isn't a mysterious whine in the motor every morning that no service guy could find the source of
    * Random plastics bits break off or rattle loose.

    Those problems weren't all on one car, but they were all on Fords. I'm all for a local car industry, God knows my taxes have been propping it up for years, but at least do a decent job.
     
  12. ManlyBacker

    ManlyBacker Winging it Staff Member

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    I'd happily grab one of these when they come out

    [​IMG]

    These days small SUVs are all the punters want and to hell with driving dynamics.

    I love the feel of a good sedan. But having driven a small 4 hatchback the last month, as long as it starts and gets you to the shops, I'm starting to not care. There are so many reasonable new cars in the 20 - 30k bracket. But if the Calais is well priced and doesn't guzzle too much I would definitely consider it.
     
  13. ManlyBacker

    ManlyBacker Winging it Staff Member

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    Update on the VF Calais - here is a comparison with Ford & Toyota.
    http://news.drive.com.au/drive/new-car-comparison/large-car-comparison-review-calais-v-v-falcon-g6e-v-aurion-presara-20130530-2ndbc.html
    Slightly more expensive and slightly more guzzling than I was lead to believe but still a huge amount of goodies for the $. I bought a Calais in 1998 and that cost over 50k so this is impressive value. If you want a reasonable sedan then this looks like an excellent Aussie option. I believe the base level VF Evoke (Commodore/Berlina) model with a 3.0L automatic is around 35k and the base Calais is 40k. Happy driving.
     
  14. cherry_poppins

    cherry_poppins Well-Known Member

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    The tariff should've stayed

    Why are we giving up so many Australian jobs to support other markets? Its lunacy

    Its not like the price of the whitegoods on wheels (Camry/Aurion) has lowered post tariff

    Bring it back! We've been sold up the river for the benefit of other countries,i support locally produced products where ever possible which is easy with so many options,coke is locally produced why not cars? Why should we pay $30k for a Camry when it was $30k with the tariff? who is the lack of tariff benefiting in Australia? I don't buy meat from asia and ****ed if i'll buy a car produced there (to expensive for an enjoyable drive)

    If a party supports bringing it back to save Holden's production plant i will personally trade my blue oval in for the arch nemesis to support sustained work in Australia,oh and i will vote for that party even if Tony Abbott is the leader.....Yeah even the moron who wants to make the NBN a pitiful wifi connection

    They took our jewbs
     
  15. SeaEagleRock8

    SeaEagleRock8 Sea Eagle Lach Staff Member Premium Member 2016 Tipping Competitor

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    Anyone that thinks Commodores and Falcons are our nations soul may have missed a couple of key developments. Holden as a stand alone car manufacturer never ever existed. It is owned by General Motors – and has been since 1931. Ford Australia is also just the Australian subsidiary of an American company. For decades the profits from these iconic manufacturers have been dutifully repatriated to their true owners, overseas.

    Fair enough to want a car designed in Australia for Australian conditions.

    But which are these uniquely Australian conditions, that are so different to the rest of the world? Sitting stationary in peak hour traffic in Sydney? Cruising on the F4? Enduring high temperatures during our summer months? Or maybe the wet season in the territory? I guess you'd never come across any of those conditions elsewhere in the world. (Though it's true a lot of Aussie arses would be too big for the back seat of a Mazda 3.)



    I agree the loss of 1000's of jobs is the important issue with the Ford closure.

    However – our auto industries (and manufacturing in general) have been aided by tariffs, import quotas, subsidies, you name it, since day one. Does anyone believe tariffs and protection are the long term answer to the problems we have in manufacturing?

    http://trove.nla.gov.au/ndp/del/article/18383727

    Question – over the decades, how many billions of dollars in profits have been syphoned out of this country and presented to the foreign owners of our Aussie icon car companies? Yet when profitability dips, they up and leave.

    So - should we call for locally owned manufacturers instead?

    What's the difference? Ever heard of Chesty Bonds? Another iconic Aussie brand, and this time a dinky-di Aussie-owned company. But locally owned manufacturers do exactly the same as foreign companies. They will employ local labour for as long as there's a buck in it for them, and they will pocket all those profits, But when they can't make such profits any longer they just relocate somewhere that labour is cheaper.

    So how exactly do tariffs solve that problem?
     
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  16. cherry_poppins

    cherry_poppins Well-Known Member

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    Answering one point at a time

    We all know who owns both companies,at least Ford didn't make a new brand name up specifically to hide it was owned by Americans,but Ford Australia and Holden put money into the pockets of Australian punters who work their asses off making them

    Basically I would challenge you to find another country that has all of what this country has in conditions

    Desert
    Snowy cold ass places (there are colder)
    Cairns tropical disgusting temperate
    The roads of NSW (Since NSW even though forking out for everyone elses roads have the poorest roads in the country),yeah pretty much the four seasons effect this place can give in a typical month

    No,i believe the removal of tariffs was a death warrant for the jobs of those employed in automotive production in Australia and you missed the part where the Camry/Aurion hasnt had a price drop since the tariff has gone,how is that fair to the aussie punter who lost his job in geelong? Post tariff the top of the line camry should cost $18k due to its low build cost and low quality of build,yeah ok the engine is good,whoopdie doo,tell me how good that engine is when you

    A: Torque steer into the car next to you driving uphill from a set of lights on a wet greasy road

    B: Understeer into a telegraph pole because you were going a smidgen too quick

    C: Have to non-stop change CV joints like they are $600 oil filters

    Locally owned manufacturers would be poor and are not the answer,both GM and Ford have access to so much in the way of development due to the international companies who owned them,thats how the VF and FG are comparable to european superpriced cars like the 5 series

    The only way to fix the problem of imports is xenophobia,i'm not asking to stop all imports but what we can make,we should in fact make

    There should be considerable advantages of producing in the country in which you sell to which for the moment in Australia there is not,no other country will chip in and give dollars to our newly unemployed punters so why should we give money to the sweatshop owners who produce offshore?

    I can't tell you if kids made the seats of your mazda 3,i can't tell you if kids or slaves put those parts together to make those parts a Mazda 3 but what i can tell you is the cars built on our shores are in fact made by well paid adults who will soon be jobless thanks to the removal of a tariff that was the only advantage of producing vehicles locally,the ruined lives of these people are the responsibility of our government and should be paying out the rest of the wages of the working lives of these people (55yr old given 10 years pay by Australian government,25 year old given 40 years pay)

    Also,red vs blue? Its part of our culture but in 2016 it'll be red vs who?
     
  17. voicefromthehill

    voicefromthehill Well-Known Member Premium Member

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    Xenophobia, a fear or dislike (aversion even, to other races) by definition not racism, but based on your recent history you are dancing on the self condemned line of racism. You are a contradiction that is for certain
     
  18. Dan

    Dan Administrator Staff Member Administrator 2016 Tipping Competitor

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    The US conditions are almost identical to ours. California alone almost has the exact conditions of australia. You have the tropics of Cairns reflected in florida and to an extent texas though texas is a little more like WA.

    Washington DC weather hits both extremes in summer so hot its comparible to north qld on winter so cold that snow prevents my office from opening.

    I have been there in summer and winter DC that is and its hotter than hervey bay and colder than tasmania.

    So in answer to your question the US has identical conditions to us
     
  19. SeaEagleRock8

    SeaEagleRock8 Sea Eagle Lach Staff Member Premium Member 2016 Tipping Competitor

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    The job losses are the issue.

    In the absence of a significant export component - which we don't have - our local car industry can no longer compete with the advantage of scale of overseas producers. The high dollar doesn't help, but it is mainly because 'our' car makers prefer to run most of their exports from other locations.

    Ford’s production lines in Thailand produce 450,000 vehicles a year; last year Broadmeadows built just 37,000 vehicles. Ford's global bosses say they are considering establishing a production facility in Indonesia (where Nissan, Toyota and others are already based) - and where labour costs are even lower than they are in Thailand.

    http://www.news.com.au/business/companies/no-news-is-bad-news-for-fords-local-factories/story-fnda1bsz-1226608097869


    What is happening here is the same as what happened or is happening or will happen to workers in other countries. So how does it serve our interests to hate or fear them? Though I suppose it is better for Holden and Ford if we think of this as a local problem - which our government should 'fix' by giving them a few extra billion/raising import tariffs/paying the sacked workers.


    Come on Cherry, the companies haven't been running charities you know. They make money from the workers' labour. And if they can make more by going elsewhere, …


    Imported Fords
     
  20. Dan

    Dan Administrator Staff Member Administrator 2016 Tipping Competitor

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    By the way I hate cars and do not understand motor sport as an attraction
     
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