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My tip

Discussion in 'General Discussion Forum' started by byso, Sep 14, 2007.

  1. byso

    byso Well-Known Member

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    Lib to win this Fed election.


    There was a poll on ACA asking if viewers would vote for Howard in the next election. 27000 votes. 83% said yes.


    I think this would be far more conclusive than the 1200 people that’s polled in other polls.

    CW has your school been handing out ALP propaganda to the students like other schools? :drunk:
     
  2. Matabele

    Matabele Well-Known Member

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    All that shows is ACA's demographic is scraping the bottom of the convict gene pool. This has long been suspected.
     
  3. byso

    byso Well-Known Member

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    Not quite as tabloid as Dubbo's favourite, Today tonight though.
     
  4. The Gronk

    The Gronk Well-Known Member

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    That view is about is an touch with reality as Howard and his cronies are.
     
  5. kingyfan

    kingyfan Member

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    Can't wait for the Libs to start tearing Rudd apart when the election is announced. Then the fun will really begin.
     
  6. Matabele

    Matabele Well-Known Member

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    Interesting SMH article that Howard is not even sure HIMSELF that he can win his own seat.
     
  7. Canteen Worker

    Canteen Worker Well-Known Member 2016 Tipping Competitor

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    The election will come down to marginal seats. The ALP has a big task as they have to win 16 seats which is huge! There will be big swings in non-marginal seats and we are yet to see the mother of all scare campaigns to complement the taxpayer funded propaganda that is currently being peddalled.

    Re Byso's dig at schools and influence, anyone with a modicum of intelligence would know that teenagers are rebellious and trying to push them one way or the other is counterproductive. Kids don't just take teachers at their word.

    My personal political views are personal at school and I make of point of not talking about them with kids. Most kids out here can see through Howard and his lies anyway!!!
     
  8. byso

    byso Well-Known Member

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    The election will come down to marginal seats. The ALP has a big task as they have to win 16 seats which is huge! There will be big swings in non-marginal seats and we are yet to see the mother of all scare campaigns to complement the taxpayer funded propaganda that is currently being peddalled.

    Re Byso's dig at schools and influence, anyone with a modicum of intelligence would know that teenagers are rebellious and trying to push them one way or the other is counterproductive. Kids don't just take teachers at their word.

    My personal political views are personal at school and I make of point of not talking about them with kids. Most kids out here can see through Howard and his lies anyway!!!

    [/quote]

    I hear the tripe is being handed out at primary schools as well ;) How desperate is that teachers union.
     
  9. Matabele

    Matabele Well-Known Member

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    The funny thing is Byso and his ilk probably don't realise primary school children aren't eligible to vote.
     
  10. byso

    byso Well-Known Member

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    Maybe they have parents that vote?

    Maybe in Dubbo that isn't the case for the majority. ;)
     
  11. Matabele

    Matabele Well-Known Member

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    You would be naive enough to think the parents read a glossy stuffed in the bootom of their children's satchel?
     
  12. byso

    byso Well-Known Member

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    lol, they are handing them out in front of the schools.

    But yes you do highlight how ridiculous the teachers union/labor party is :clap:
     
  13. byso

    byso Well-Known Member

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    Oops!


    THE Coalition has fought back after John Howard's dramatic undertaking to retire as prime minister during the next term and can now make a fight of the election.

    The Prime Minister's personal standing is virtually unchanged after he pledged last week to hand over to Peter Costello next term if the Government was re-elected.

    But the Coalition is in its best position for eight months.

    The Government's primary support among voters has risen four percentage points to 41 per cent, according to the latest Newspoll survey, conducted exclusively for The Australian last weekend, with Labor's support falling four points to 47 per cent.

    Labor still has a clear election-winning lead on a two-party-preferred basis of 55 per cent to the Coalition's 45, and Kevin Rudd is well clear of Mr Howard as preferred prime minister.

    But an eight-point narrowing in Labor's primary vote lead during the APEC meeting, and despite the Liberal Party's devastating leadership instability, will boost Coalition morale at this morning's crucial party meeting in Canberra.

    Instead of losing support because of leadership instability created by the previous poor Newspoll, calls for Mr Howard to resign and a loss of nerve among the cabinet, the Coalition's standing has risen to the same position as the Keating Labor government in 1993, only eight weeks before the Liberals' John Hewson lost the "unloseable election".

    The Newspoll survey also showed that Mr Howard is still clearly preferred as the Liberal leader to take the Coalition to the election, finishing with almost three times the support of the Treasurer and more than four times the backing of Malcolm Turnbull. About 52 per cent of voters believe Mr Howard gives the Government the best chance of winning the election, compared with 18 per cent for Mr Costello and 12 per cent for Mr Turnbull.

    Yesterday Mr Howard told parliament, in front of his Coalition colleagues, that his leadership position had not changed and he would serve a full term as the member for his Sydney seat of Bennelong if re-elected.

    "I said to my constituents on Saturday, that is, if the Government is re-elected and if I am re-elected, I will serve my full term, the full three years, and I will not inflict a by-election on them," Mr Howard said. "I will not do what (Steve) Bracks and (Peter) Beattie have done."

    The Liberal Party has been divided and nervous since the Newspoll survey before the APEC meeting showed a five-point primary vote jump for Labor to 51per cent, with its two-party-preferred lead up to 18 points, 59 per cent to 41 per cent.

    There were panic-stricken calls for Mr Howard to stand down in favour of Mr Costello, with the Prime Minister asking Foreign Minister Alexander Downer to take soundings at a special cabinet meeting about his future.

    Although the sentiment was for change, Mr Howard declared he would stay. He believes he is the best person to lead the Liberal Party to the election, which could be held as early as October 27 and as late as December 2.

    Yesterday, Mr Downer said the Government should not change direction because of opinion polls and warned MPs to stop "poll gazing".

    "First of all, the party has no intention of changing the leadership," Mr Downer told Sky News.

    "Secondly, I'm not one of those politicians who watches poll after poll with such fascination and allows polls to dictate everything that I think and everything that I'm planning to do.

    "I think it's very important for the Liberal Party to stop poll-gazing and think about the substance of the issues."

    On the question of preferred prime minister, Mr Howard's support was virtually unchanged at 38per cent and Mr Rudd was steady on 48 per cent.

    Mr Howard's satisfaction rating was also virtually unchanged on 45 per cent, compared with dissatisfaction of 44 per cent.

    Mr Rudd's satisfaction and dissatisfaction were virtually unchanged on 65 per cent and 18 per cent respectively.

    Mr Downer predicted yesterday that the instability within the Liberal Party would hurt the Government in the latest Newspoll survey.

    "There's been controversy in the Government in the last week so that's not going to play well into an opinion poll," he said.

    He also said Mr Rudd's "campaign launch" in Western Sydney on the weekend was "because he knows that that's the Newspoll polling period".

    "Look, that's how he thinks. Everything is built around Newspoll polling periods," he said.

    But deputy Labor leader Julia Gillard said she thought the poll could rise for the Government as expectation of the election date grew.

    "The parliament is here this week but at the end of this parliamentary week there is no further excuse for Mr Howard not to call the election, not to allow the Australian people to decide," she said.

    "We will see the mother of all scare campaigns about the economy, about unions, about inexperience, so it's going to be very tough. I wouldn't be surprised if the Newspoll actually records a bounce for the Government.

    "I wouldn't be surprised if Australians feel some sympathy for Mr Howard after his very painful performance on TV last week where he finally managed to choke out that he is going to retire after the next election."
     
  14. Dan

    Dan Administrator Staff Member Administrator 2016 Tipping Competitor

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    oooh 8 point swing....how scary, after John Howard launched his biggest campaign "APEC" guess what....not going to get you out of it little johnny
     
  15. ManlyBacker

    ManlyBacker Winging it Staff Member

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    It hasn't made a huge difference.

    The betting yesterday was Labor $1.32 Libs $3.50. Today it is Labor $1.35 Libs $3.25.

    I can't help think that there is a tinge of underdog sympathy in this poll. However I don't think anything can detract on how bad last week was for the Libs and I believe it will cost them the election. The Libs needed to project a solid un-moveable power that Australians could rely on and instead they now have a vision of a party divided by personal ambition and feasting on the smell of blood in the water. One of the poorest managed leaks I have seen so close to an election and may see Bennelong fall.
     
  16. byso

    byso Well-Known Member

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    Nah I reckon last weeks dramas was intentionally leaked to the media and I expect polls to edge back each time.

    Remember fellas the campaign hasn't even started yet and I feel that the Rudd Media machine will run outa steam and fall in favour of the libs.

    And wait till the libs start pushing this issue of Rudds.

    **********************


    The Sunday Telegraph


    Long-running scandal threatens Rudd


    By Piers Akerman


    Saturday, August 18, 2007 at 10:45pm


    AT the beginning of last week, the Howard Government's appointment of Queenslander Susan Kiefel to the highest court in the land embodied the best principles of the administration of the law.


    At week's end, in the same state, the scab was being lifted on one of the gravest legal scandals in the nation.


    On Tuesday, Kiefel - a state school drop-out who completed her secondary education at night school while working by day - was appointed on merit in a most public rejection of the Australian Labor Party's love affair with affirmative action. Ability, not gender, was the key.


    On Thursday, Premier Peter Beattie was presented with a letter signed by former Western Australian Chief Justice (David Malcolm), two retired NSW Chief Judges (Jack Lee, now deceased, and Dr Frank McGrath), two retired NSW Supreme Court Justices (Roddy Meagher and Barry O'Keefe), one of Australia's foremost QCs (Alec Shand) and a legal academic and barrister (Alastair MacAdam) all seeking the appointment of an Independent Special Prosecutor into an unresolved outrageous injustice now known as the Heiner Affair, which has been poisonously suppurating since the days of the Goss government.


    A copy of this letter was also received by Queensland's Governor, Chief Justice, Opposition Leader, Bar Association and Law Society.


    It followed the completion of a two-year audit by leading NSW QC, David Rofe, who prepared a 3000-word, nine volume report on the case and concluded there were 67 alleged unaddressed prima facie criminal charges that needed to be urgently addressed.


    At the heart of the matter is the order by the Goss Cabinet of March 5, 1990, to destroy all documents relating to an inquiry by retired magistrate Noel Heiner into the management of the John Oxley Youth Detention Centre.

    Heiner had been appointed by Premier Wayne Goss's predecessor, Premier Russell Cooper, in late 1989 to investigate serious allegations of the abuse of children in the state youth detention centre, including the rape of a 14-year-old Aboriginal girl by male inmates in May, 1988, during a supervised bush outing, raised by several youth workers.


    Outrageously, this rape is still unresolved.


    Youth centre manager Peter Coyne and deputy Anne Dutney called on their senior union organiser, Kevin Lindeberg, of the Queensland Professional Officers Association, to protect their interests. Lindeberg was to become the whistleblower.


    Coyne and Dutney, not unreasonably, sought to see the specific complaints laid against them, so they could defend themselves before Heiner. This request was denied them.


    Barely a month after the Goss government came to office in December, 1989, it closed down the enquiry and transferred Coyne to other duties. He and Dutney engaged counsel to seek any Heiner material relating to them, while their solicitor placed the Queensland government on notice of the proceedings and instructed the government not to destroy any documents.


    The union joined the dispute on March 1 and Lindeberg was assured by the government that the material was safe - but it wasn't. Cabinet decided to shred the material on March 5 and it was secretly fed through a shredder on March 23.


    In early March, Lindeberg inadvertently learnt of the secret shredding by a ministerial staffer, challenged it and was removed from the case at the request of the families minister.


    He was sacked by the union six weeks later, one charge being that he had been "inappropriate and over-confrontationalist'' in "the Coyne case''.


    After an outcry by union members, he was conditionally reinstated, but informed the union executive the shredding was a potential illegal act involving the entire Goss Cabinet, or the families minister or the departmental CEO.


    In August, he was again dismissed on challenged grounds under an arbitration forced upon him and subject to a divided union vote.


    Since then, Lindeberg has fought for justice. In 1998, he obtained access to the relevant March 5, 1990, Cabinet submission and received advice from senior counsel and Sir Harry Gibbs, a former Chief Justice of the High Court, that it contained sufficient inculpatory evidence to warrant charges under Section 129 of the Queensland Code to be brought against those involved in the shredding decision.


    In last Thursday's letter to Beattie, the legal authorities "indicate our deep concern about its (the law's) undermining, as the unresolved Heiner Affair reveals''.


    They say that an "unacceptable application of the criminal law by prima facie double standards, by Queensland law-enforcement authorities'' has been exposed by the successful prosecution of another person, Douglas Ensbey, for destruction of material which may be required as evidence under S129 - but not against members of the "Executive Government and certain civil servants for similar destruction-of-evidence conduct''.


    "Compelling evidence suggests that the erroneous interpretation of S129 of the Code, used by those authorities to justify the shredding of the Heiner inquiry documents, may have knowingly advantaged Executive Government and certain civil servants,'' they wrote, noting that the Queensland Court of Appeal case in 2004 exposed the erroneous interpretation.


    They also said they agreed with the late Sir Harry Gibbs, a former Chief Justice of the High Court, who advised that the reported facts (of the Heiner Affair) represent, "at least, a prima facie offence under S129 concerning destruction of evidence''.


    This may all seem like a dry old argument, but it has enormous relevance right now.


    Opposition Leader Kevin Rudd was Goss's chief of staff at the time of the Heiner Affair and shortly after took on the newly-created position of Director-General of the Cabinet Office.

    According to Queensland academic Scott Prasser: "Rudd was the de facto power behind the throne. He was Wayne Goss's closest adviser and the Premier's Mr Fixit. He was the key man''.


    Last December, Queensland Aboriginal leader Noel Pearson said: "Rudd's chief credential for Labor leadership is that he knows power and has exercised it at the highest levels of government. He ran the government of Queensland for six years ...'''


    The Heiner Affair has been put squarely in the public arena by some of the most respected members of the judiciary and the legal fraternity, people not given to demonstrations of public outrage; but who felt that the shredding of evidence by the Goss executive represented a full frontal attack on the separation of powers, on the judiciary's function.


    Given that the matter remains unresolved, there is no guarantee it might not happen again.


    These black letter law figures aren't interested in politics or personalities, but they are gravely concerned about the conduct of the law and, in particular, the manner in which it was applied to a decision of the Queensland government at a time when, as it happens, Rudd held a position of great influence with unhindered access to Cabinet documents.


    With the Australian people soon to decide whether Rudd should be the next Prime Minister, it is time the Heiner Affair was thoroughly investigated and justice applied.
     
  17. Matabele

    Matabele Well-Known Member

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    Piers Akerman - I rest my case.

    I'd hate to see the amount of the retainer he's paid by the Libs.
     
  18. Canteen Worker

    Canteen Worker Well-Known Member 2016 Tipping Competitor

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    John Howard is sending electors in Bennelong two letters a week at the moment and suddenly turning up at every flower show, school fete, opening etc as the polls say that he is in big trouble. He is looking very desperate and he is using every dirty trick to smear Maxine McKew. He has suddenly discovered his electorate, very late, and even opened up a second office at Eastwood. Some ethnic voters with long memories however remember how he used Pauline and her ilk in playing the racism card. It is fun being in this electorate.

    The best campaign slogan at the moment is 'Make Howard History!"
     
  19. byso

    byso Well-Known Member

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    "Make Howard History!" Is that the slogan you have on the blackboard at the moment ;)
     
  20. ManlyBacker

    ManlyBacker Winging it Staff Member

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    I am behind you most times byso but you are losing it on this issue. Piers Akerman has dragged up an absolute fat zero in that article and it will have no effect on this election. His writings consistently make Stan Zemanic look like a union delegate on the wharfs. The Libs are close to needing a miracle but Saint Kevin already has connections.
     

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