1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.

Bill Harrigan calls for common sense in ruling on obstruction

Discussion in 'News' started by Jethro, Aug 25, 2014.

By Jethro on Aug 25, 2014 at 7:04 PM
  1. Jethro

    Jethro This space is for rent Staff Member Premium Member 2016 Tipping Competitor

    7,128
    1,492
    Ratings:
    +1,897 / 7
    The obstruction rule has become too "black and white" and that "common sense" is lacking in the decision making process.

    That is the opinion of former referees boss Bill Harrigan when quizzed on the rule that has left both experts and fans scratching their heads.

    Harrigan levelled a blistering attack on the rule and called for a change of interpretation following Friday night's decision to deny Chris Sandow a try due to a decoy run from David Gower.

    Read More
     

Comments

Discussion in 'News' started by Jethro, Aug 25, 2014.

    1. Jethro

      Jethro This space is for rent Staff Member Premium Member 2016 Tipping Competitor

      7,128
      1,492
      Ratings:
      +1,897 / 7
      The obstruction rule has become too "black and white" and that "common sense" is lacking in the decision making process.

      That is the opinion of former referees boss Bill Harrigan when quizzed on th[​IMG]e rule that has left both experts and fans scratching their heads.

      Harrigan levelled a blistering attack on the rule and called for a change of interpretation following Friday night's decision to deny Chris Sandow a try due to a decoy run from David Gower.

      Eels coach Brad Arthur said he was "confused" by the ruling from video referees Steve Clark and Luke Patten after the game.

      Harrigan has called on Tony Archer to bring common sense back into the decision making equation and says that former players in the video ref's box have been given too much responsibility.

      Harrigan said while he expected the red light to appear due to the wording of the rule book, it doesn't mean it was the right decision.

      "I was left shaking my head," Harrigan told News Corp.

      "When I took over as the (referees) coach with (Stuart) Raper, we went in and adjusted the guidelines. On the obstruction I said ‘we are getting it wrong because we are trying to be too black and white and taking common sense out of it'. So I added a clause that said: If the play does not affect the scoring of the try then the try shall be allowed.

      "It was a matter of looking at it and saying ‘he does run behind the player but there's no one there and no one has been affected by it so why not give a try? Or he did run around his player but then they threw the ball four passes to his winger and the defence was in a one-on-one and they still beat them and scored a try in the corner.

      "Why wouldn't you give it to them because the run around didn't have any effect on the defensive line."

      Harrigan said since Daniel Anderson, and now Tony Archer took over the referees unit, the guidelines have been changed.

      "Had I still been in charge with Stuart Raper, I know we would have stuck to a common sense (rule)," he said.

      "We were also getting rid of the guidelines – it was in our plan for the following year. We were of the opinion that we have a rule book. What do we need these guidelines for? We were getting rid of that document."

      On paper, the officials made the right call. According to the NRL's guide "ball carriers must not run behind an active block runner" but a video official who preferred to remain anonymous confessed that they don't always agree with the rule book.

      "We are stuck between a rock and a hard place. It can be hard if there is something in the rule book on obstruction even if you see it another way," the official admitted.

      Sandow didn't gain an advantage as a result of the decoy runner which was the biggest gripe Eels skipper Jarryd Hayne had with the ruling following their 22-12 victory.

      "There's that rule about going behind the player but he didn't impede anyone," Hayne said.

      Harrigan says the blame lies in part with the former NRL players in the video refs boss who are given too much responsibility.

      "The biggest inconsistency and biggest failure from the video refereeing this year is having the (past) players in there and giving them the sole responsibility of making some of the decisions," Harrigan said.

      "The players in there aren't referees and they are being tasked with making certain decisions and not the video referee."

      Former players are responsible for ruling on obstructions and groundings, with a split decision between official and former player going with the man who has NRL experience because they have a "match feel".

      Harrigan claims there is disharmony in the referees' ranks, with former players and coaches Andrew Dunemann and Steve Folks doing the referee game reviews.

      "That would be like me walking into Cronulla and saying ‘I've just watched your game boys and now I'm going to critique your performances'," Harrigan said of the duo conducting the reviews.

      "They'd look at me and say ‘have you ever played this game, Bill? You're kidding'.

      "A bloke hasn't refereed before but they are critiquing a referee of 250 first grade games and telling how he's refereed … I still do talk to some of them and it's not a happy camp at all. Whether it's a club or refereeing group, if it's not a happy camp off the field, how the hell can they be performing on the field?"
      .
      .
      Nathan Ryan
      FOX SPORTS

      http://www.foxsports.com.au/nrl/former-nrl-referees-boss-bill-harrigan-calls-for-common-sense-in-ruling-on-obstruction/story-e6frf3ou-1227036211149
       
    2. Eagles2nv

      Eagles2nv New Team, New Beginnings 2016 Tipping Competitor

      3,275
      754
      Ratings:
      +1,404 / 35
      I think bill has taken one too many head knocks because for the first time he is actually talking sense.

      The obstruction rule has been a bad rule the last few seasons. If a player was not going tobe able to make a tackle then it should not be obstruction.
       
    3. Dan

      Dan Administrator Staff Member Administrator 2016 Tipping Competitor

      32,370
      3,610
      Amsterdam, The Netherlands
      Ratings:
      +5,463 / 74
      Im sorry but how do you get "too black and white" surely the goal of any rule is that it becomes "Black and white" thereby taking interpretation out of it and thus meaning a more consistent ruling every time.

      Now they want to make it "grey" and allow for varying interpretations and individual opinion to creep in, which then means you are going to get a different call every week depending on who the referee is.

      It's simple. You run behind a player you have caused an obstruction, thats it rule done dusted, no allowance for all this other crap and grey area.

      All the complaints over the last few years because it was open to interpretation now that its been fixed and we can have a consistent call we want to change it. Silly.

      This is exactly why he was a terrible referee boss, because he tried to over explain the simple as he saw it rather than to make the ruling as simple as possible.
       
      • Like Like x 5
    4. Jerry1

      Jerry1 Well-Known Member

      4,723
      925
      Ratings:
      +2,470 / 80
      Its all too hard - the rule has to be in your opinion has the defending player been impeded for making tackle that would have stopped the attacking player. Not did he run behind someone 30 meters before the player beat 4 defenders.

      The common sense has to be part of it.
      Black & white is too lateral.
       
    5. Mark from Brisbane

      Mark from Brisbane Living the dream Premium Member

      16,336
      5,346
      Brisbane
      Ratings:
      +12,737 / 257
      Look as much as we hate it (the denied Jamie Lyon try at the Gold Coast a good example), I'd agree with Dan, you run behind your own player in the effort to get the ball flowing then it's simple NO TRY.

      As long as that's the ruling every single time then we should not have an issue, if a player runs behind his own player he should immediately stop, submit to a tackle and then play on...if its the last tackle its a handover.

      We need them to adopt the KISS approach.

      Now we have that finalised can I raise the issue of the forward passes???
       
      • Like Like x 1
    6. Jerry1

      Jerry1 Well-Known Member

      4,723
      925
      Ratings:
      +2,470 / 80
      submit to a voluntary tackle is a penalty. :)

      Again when playing advantage - when is the advantage over?

      Common sense :)
       
    7. Brookie Brawler

      Brookie Brawler Well-Known Member 2016 Tipping Competitor

      602
      211
      Ratings:
      +428 / 6
      Agreed.

      You can't pass the ball forward. When a forward pass is called we don't worry about whether or not the attacking side gained an advantage from the infringement. As long as it actually went forward everyone accepts the ruling.

      If the rule says you can't run behind your teammate, why does it have to be more complicated than that?
       
      • Like Like x 1
    8. Jerry1

      Jerry1 Well-Known Member

      4,723
      925
      Ratings:
      +2,470 / 80
      Then it would be an obstruction as often as not. There is always someone coming back onside or a dummy runner in front of the player with the ball.

      Its never black & white.
       
    9. Dan

      Dan Administrator Staff Member Administrator 2016 Tipping Competitor

      32,370
      3,610
      Amsterdam, The Netherlands
      Ratings:
      +5,463 / 74
      Yes but there is a clear difference. I can see precisely why that try was denied, that runner wasn't a straight running decoy runner, he ran a line on an angle and the player ran a line directly behind him, clear black and white and i was fine with it either way it went.

      I am happy for that to be an obstruction if that is the ruling every time and the only way to get consistency is to continue to remove the grey areas not add to them
       
      • Like Like x 1
    10. rmd

      rmd Active Member

      262
      96
      Ratings:
      +173 / 8
      RE:ill Harrigan calls for common sense in ruling on obstruction

      As Sterlo said on Sunday, while there was really no advantage (credit to Foran, as he agreed) the responsibility rested with Gower for running a poor line and players have to learn and are responsible for running lines that do not interfere or make contact with the defending side that could possibly create an advantage. Simple, but like Foran said, no impediment, he was just wrong footed by Sandow.

      The main reason we have a lot of these stupid rules now is because of the media and the intense scrutiny on the game. Look at the Starling eye gouge claim through a media photo and the frame by frame replays a multitude of times.
       
      • Like Like x 1
    11. Dan

      Dan Administrator Staff Member Administrator 2016 Tipping Competitor

      32,370
      3,610
      Amsterdam, The Netherlands
      Ratings:
      +5,463 / 74
      This is still annoying me, this is probably the dumbest comment I have ever heard.

      The idea of any rule, or the goal is for the rule to become completely black and white, therefore easy to know whether you either have, or have not broken the rule.


      This is why the game needs to rid itself of idiots, so many people with no brains running it
       
      • Like Like x 1
    12. Snake

      Snake Doing The Eagle Rock!

      2,146
      1,154
      Ratings:
      +2,522 / 134
      You are 100% correct.

      Any you watch, if we have an obstruction this weekend, even though the NRL haven't come out and officially changed the rule to include an "interpretation", because of the media pressure, the video referee will be in two minds and more than likely award a try. It's a reactive game and we have a "revolving door" rule book to contend with every week. Poor form from the NRL as usual.
       
    13. shawn.b

      shawn.b Active Member 2016 Tipping Competitor

      103
      44
      Ratings:
      +54 / 0
      & why is it an obstruction 10 metres out yet totally ignored at the half way line?
       
    14. 2830 Eagle

      2830 Eagle Aim low, reach your goals, avoid disappointment

      159
      42
      Ratings:
      +97 / 2
      In my opinion Harrigan is reason refereeing is such a shambles today.
       
    15. Shoe1

      Shoe1 Well-Known Member

      6,219
      1,988
      Ratings:
      +4,640 / 74
      News: Clubs, Fans and the wider Australian community call on Bill Harrigan to show common sense
       

Share This Page